Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles OLD POWDER

I NEED AN OPINION ABOUT POWDER. I HAVE SOME POWDER THAT I HAVE NOT USED IN 7 OR 8 YEARS. IT HAS BEEN IN MY GARAGE WHERE THE TEMPERTURES VARY DEPENDING ON THE TIME OF THE YEAR. SOMEONE WAS TELLING ME THAT THIS MAKES THEM UNSTABLE. IS THIS TRUE. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/help.gif" alt="" />

Check it visually and by smell. If it has an acrid odor and/or has a "Rusty" colored dust in it, it is not good to use. If it still appears OK and has no unusual odors, use it. Eagleye.

If it went bad, it makes a nice fertilizer for house plants and gardens.

I really doubt it is bad. Takes a lot to screw up a powder. I've got some power that is 40 years old. Got an old keg of 700X that has made several trips across the nation when I moved, went from humid climates to dry climates and warm and cold. It is best to keep powder stored dry and cool but life is difficult and we can't always keep things stored proper.

Like Eagleye said, if it looks rusty and or smells like a strong vinager or similar acid smell, it is probably bad.

Good luck.

CM

Let's start with some basic questions. What kind of powder is this? Black? Smokeless? Semi-smokeless? Talcum? Chili?

How much is "some"? Are we talking a few ounces, a few pounds, a few tons?

The two previous posters' answers were assuming current smokeless types. If it's semi-smokeless from 80 years ago, you can find yourself dead if you don't handle it really carefully, as happened in Pennsylvania recently.

--Bob

Throw it out, it will not be consitant in its burning rate, BAD??BAD

Eagleeye and Combineman are correct. Without obvious signs of decay the powder is probably ok. If it is a modern powder with a known burning rate it should be perfectly safe to use..............DJ

I diden't say it would not shoot, My experance shows it can have a differant burning rate than an older lot, if you load all the sheels with old you probably will not see any differance, until you buy a new can, I would not expect 40 year old powder to burn the same as fresh powder, Combinman, buy a can of new powder of the same type and load some shells and compare the accurcy, and bullet drop , to the same load withyour 40 year old powder, I would like to know the result's as I do not have any powder that old to test, Thank's Hubert// <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

There have been some well documented cases of older powder having slightly different burning rates as the newer versions but not enough to make it unsafe to load. Jack O'Conner's famous load of 62grs of H-4831 was made with War Surplus H-4831 that he bought by the barrel. With most modern production H-4831's, 60-61grs is a max load. The War Surplus stuff was a little slower, but that doesn't mean it wasn't safe to use. I would love to find a 50gal drum of old 4831 it would keep me shooting for years...............DJ

I diden't say that, I said an old can of powder could possibly not have the same burning rate as a new can of the same number powder. I too have shot military cartriges that were made before I was born ,more than 50 yrs old, and they shot ok, but I would not want to shoot compition with them. Hubert

Then why did you reccommend to throw stuff out that you yourself use BAD BAD?........DJ

In the 1960's, a friend of mine & I bought a 50 lb. keg of H-4831 for $ .50 pound. Yea!, at that time you could get powder for that price.

He took 25 & I took 25 lb. I used it for my 06's, & a 25-06, 270, & 6mm. Always kept it in a cool dry place, & never had a problem with it.

About 10 yrs. ago, I finally finished it. Even though I bought, & used "newer" H-4831. If I had worked up a load with the newer H-4831, I NEVER use the loading data for the old H-4831, as other people have pointed out, the composition probably is different.

I wouldn't recommend keeping it as long as I did, ( you should shoot more often), but if kept in a cool dry place, it still works.

I diden't have any problem up to that time, as I had never used powder that was old, and a new can in the same box of shell's, in other words make sure you (or I) have enough powder to load all the same shell's at the same time in the same box, (does that make sense or does it sound stupid) I don't know how else to say it,, BAD//////BAD, Hubert <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I read a report in Handloader's Digest [1975 Edition] on some IMR 4895 powder that Bob Bell had bought a large container of in 1947. He shot most of it up in the first few years after purchase. He then checked what was left of it 25 years later for performance, etc. His conclusion was that it worked exactly the same as it had when new. However, as some have pointed out, newer lot numbers might be slightly different, so it is a good idea to be careful. I have a bit of powder left of a number that went out of production more than 25 years ago. It works exactly as it did back when it was new. Velocities and consistency is the same as it was back when. Stored properly, smokeless powder will last a loooonnnngggg time. Regards, Eagleye.

Lot of good posts here.

In a tight sealed container whether it be a powder can or a loaded round and properly stored, it will last a long long time and stay consistant. I've shot some recent GI stuff that had to be 50 years old or more and who knows how it was stored during that time.

Now what he said about the way is powder was stored is not the proper way to store it. A simple check for signs damage will confirm whether the powder is still good.

On an interesting side note, I bought a can of IMR 4895 once a couple years ago right from the local sporting goods store. I normally don't load this powder but was working on some recipie or another and needed some. I bought the can and took it home. It was bad. The oder knocked me over after breaking the seal and the powder had some rust specks on some of the kernals. I took it back to exchange for another powder from a different lot. The funny thing was the seller argued with me and said that sometimes powders small like vineger and look rusty and I should not worry. Well, we discussed it briefly and I walked out the door with my money back.

If one has doubts, it is better to discard it. I do fear that a lot of perfectly good powder gets discarded.

CM

Hubert,

Ok, I will give you a benefit of some doubt as say that there could be some velocity lost due to old age of the powder. But lets be realistic here. In my experience of shooting old factory ammo and old handloads and new handloads using old powder and new factory loads and new handloads loads using new powder, (whheew), I find more variables due to temperature, primers, barometric pressure, tides and moon fazes than I see from using old powder compared to new powder of the same make. Now it is wise to work up loads differently when switching from new powder to old powder and visa versa, but in my experience, old powder is still very consistant and accurate. That old keg of 700X I've been shooting for the past several decades is second to none in accuracy. Takes a long time to go through a keg of 700X 2.5grs at a time through a 38 Special.


CM