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Campfire Ranger
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i picked up my new vanguard from the shop today. this one does not have a target in the box, and the last one i bought did not either. what gives?
you guys still getting targets? i know they stopped producing stainless vanguards for the time being because they are selling the blued synthetic models so fast they can't catch up.
are they just skipping the targets for the same reason?
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Campfire Outfitter
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They stopped the targets last year as a cost reduction. You still get one with Sub MOA models but the regular Vanguard doesn't come with one.
Posted 08/04/200906:25 PM
Weatherby Nation Members:
Since the introduction of the Weatherby Vanguard, we have included a factory-shot target with every Vanguard rifle as a reassurance of the accuracy potential of that particular rifle. This has played a significant part in supporting our accuracy guarantee and establishing Weatherby�s reputation for superior accuracy in an affordable rifle.
Keeping our rifles affordable for every hunter has always been a key driver in how we bring our products to market. As I�m sure you can appreciate, including a target with every rifle is an expensive proposition. The rifle must have a scope mounted, be bore sighted, test fired, then unmounted, cleaned and boxed. There is range and personnel time, ammunition and cleaning supply costs to consider. It adds up pretty quickly.
Beginning with our July 2009 production, we will discontinue the inclusion of a factory-shot target with each Weatherby Vanguard rifle. However, existing inventory, both in our facility as well on our dealers� shelves, may include the factory shot-target until such time as those inventories are exhausted. In its place will be a letter from me assuring you of the level of accuracy and quality built into each gun, and reinforcing our written accuracy guarantee (1-1/2� 3 shot group at 100 yards when used with premium (non Weatherby calibers) or Weatherby factory ammunition).
All Vanguard SUB-MOA models will now be tested in our new range facility in Paso Robles, CA and an electronic target, as produced by the Oehler system 83 ballistic instrumentation, will be supplied with each rifle.
We enjoy an enviable reputation for excellent performance in the field, both in accuracy as well as knockdown power, and you can rest assured that nothing will be done to detract from that reputation.
Thanks for your understanding and your continued support of Weatherby. Good hunting and good shooting!
Ed Weatherby
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Campfire Tracker
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They stopped the targets last year as a cost reduction. You still get one with Sub MOA models but the regular Vanguard doesn't come with one.
Oh, yeah, that really makes sense!  Ted
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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bad move by weatherby. that was a nice "plus" with the rifle and a touch of class.
so they start to make a lot of money on the vanguards and suddenly they stop doing it? i'd say it's more like they got so busy it was the "bottleneck" in the production line.
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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How much are they making on the Vanguards? My guess is that it's a pretty low margin product, and if they want to continue to deliver at that price point they needed to cut something that didn't effect quality.
Wanted: Vintage Remington or Winchester hats, patches, shirts. PM me if you have something.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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+1 on what jryoung said. Accuracy guarantees and factory targets mean nothing to me. I'd surely rather have them cut out the targets and keep the parts of the rifle which really mean something. Now if they would only make a LH version!! 
The Chosin Few November to December 1950, Korea.
I'm not one of the Chosin Few but no more remarkable group of Americans ever existed.
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Campfire Ranger
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let me put it this way...
if they are not shooting them, how do they know which ones are the "sub moa" ones? they told us that's how they "discovered" them, when they shot less than .75" at 100 yards while test firing.
so basically they're full of sheet. they grab one off the line and put it into a high dollar stock. so now its NOT guaranteed to be less than MOA, right?
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Campfire Regular
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They could still be test firing with electronic targets, but if the QC is high and accuracy is consistent, spending money on test firing and collecting paper targets becomes a waste of time at some point to their way of thinking...these aren't custom rifles.
TC
It ain't all burritos and strippers my friends...
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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Never seen one that wouldnt shoot MOA, they just picked their sub-MOA by which ones shot their factory loads best... That being the case, they have established themselves as good shooters and apparently don't feel the need for the target inclusion. ( Neither do I..) As far as the sub-MOAs go...your summation is just about right...  Ingwe
"...the left considers you vermin, and they'll kill you given the chance..." Bristoe
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Campfire Ranger
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It was just a marketing ploy. They got folks buying them.
If they were still test firing them as before, the expense of using/including a paper target would be negligible.
Any meaningful savings would come by eliminating the cost of ammunition and labor to perform the tests.
Which tells me they aren't doing it anymore or it has been signficantly reduced.
That's not to say they won't shoot as well as the ones that came with a target.
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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I think that prolly hits the nail on the head JM...
Ingwe
"...the left considers you vermin, and they'll kill you given the chance..." Bristoe
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I've become a cost cutting expert in the last 6 months after working for this bunch... I told a corp. bean counter yesterday that we are wiping our azzez with out of date tractor brochures to save money.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Never seen one that wouldnt shoot MOA, they just picked their sub-MOA by which ones shot their factory loads best... That being the case, they have established themselves as good shooters and apparently don't feel the need for the target inclusion. ( Neither do I..) As far as the sub-MOAs go...your summation is just about right... Ingwe I will do an Amen to Ingwe here. I have two Vanguards, and with these two, I get 3 shot groups at 100 yards measuring 1/2 MOA. I read a lot of posts about HOWA and Vanguard accuracy, and never saw one complaint about poor accuracy
Don Buckbee
JPFO
NRA Benefactor Member
NSSA Life Member
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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I told a corp. bean counter yesterday that we are wiping our azzez with out of date tractor brochures to save money. Impressive...you shoulda charged him a consulting fee..... Ingwe
"...the left considers you vermin, and they'll kill you given the chance..." Bristoe
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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A machine rest, acoustic targets and a BoreSnake would eliminate the need for scope mounting, boresighting, scope unmounting, and collecting targets while still giving the info needed to determine Sub-Moa status and still save a bunch of time and money.
Last edited by nsaqam; 05/12/10.
The Chosin Few November to December 1950, Korea.
I'm not one of the Chosin Few but no more remarkable group of Americans ever existed.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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they stopped producing stainless vanguards for the time being because they are selling the blued synthetic models so fast they can't catch up.
Is that the whole reason? I bought a stainless back in December '09 and it was the last one that big store had.
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Campfire Outfitter
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A rifle's reputation for accuracy is far more important to me than seeing a test target; that's if the rifle manufacturer decides to cut the cost of doing the target test.
Vanguard's known excellent accuracy preceeds the need for me, the customer, to see a test target.
Vanguards are glass bedded at the recoil lug, and the barrels are free floated when I get the rifle new.
Based on reading posts by Vanguard and HOWA owners on three different Forums, and listening to owners rave about the excellent accuracy they get with their rifles, I really don't need to see a test target with a new rifle. I go shoot the rifle and see great targets that I have shot.
I can see however, where a new buyer would like some warm fuzzies about the accuracy of a rifle he's about to buy, by looking at a test target.
Weatherby has evidentally decided to remove that sales feature, banking on continued high rifle sales without it.
YMMV
Don Buckbee
JPFO
NRA Benefactor Member
NSSA Life Member
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Campfire Regular
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I thought the MOA rifles should have a target included.
Nice assurance at purchase that such an inexpensive rifle will indeed shoot well. Regards what you have heard in the past.
Shot one for a friend last year (.243) and was really impressed. My hunting partner swears by his HOWA .270.
Hard to beat the accuracy in a hunting rifle, especially for less than $400.
stumpy
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My .300 Wby Vanguard test target showed a nice little three shot .88" group, and it has bettered that pretty much always since.
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I've got a 270 stainless that the factory target was 1.4". I can cut it half with most loads and knock an inch off of it with one load. I would buy another without hesitation even without the factory target. I don't care how a rifle shoots factory ammo cause I don't shoot it.
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