Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles Remington double rifle. Ad at Spartan Gun Works.

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Wow! A double rifle for under 600 bucks! It'll be interesting to read some evaluations of it.

I noticed the following statement on their website: "*NOTE: For Use with SAAMI Compliant Loads Only (28,000 PSI / 28,000 CUP Operating Pressure)."

That would be extremely limiting if true. But why, if the statement only applies to .45-70, why? If the action can take SAAMI '06 loads then it would handle around 50,000 CUP in whatever chambering, right?

These rifles, shotguns, and combination guns are the same Russian made junk that EAA has been importing for a couple of years. I have an EAA combination gun in 12 over 6.5x55 that is among the worst POS from a fit, finish, and quality point of view that I have ever seen. I think that Remington will regret ever having their reputation linked to this line of junk.

Jeff

Hey Jeff,
Did you ever gain access to your computer? I still need loading data for my .35-.284 in Savage 99.
Jerry/AK

That "gun" is a POS...

Where, oh, where is Remington's head???

Or, should I say: How far up a certain orifice is it?

RSY

The 45-70 case is about .030" to .050" larger than the 30-06 in diameter so that's a little less meat over the chambers. I don't have one to look at but it just seems CYA on that pressure warning.

I just offered the link as news for a discussion. Over on AR there are some who would spend money on it to bring it up to whatever it takes. With $500 starting point for a side by side double rifle it may be a decent seller.

I have looked at their side by side shotguns and while they need refinement they seem well made. Thus I can't agree that the product is a POS. However there are so many shotguns that why bother with their shotguns!

The double rifle is a different case as there is no competition at that price range in particular for a side by side.

Bad triggers and barrels that won't group equal POS to me. Like a wise man once said, you won't live long enough to learn from your mistakes, so learn from the mistakes of those who have passed this way before. I made the mistake of buying my EAA combination gun because it cost less than $300 from CDNN, but it was a total waste of $$ and is only good for a conversation piece or a tomato stake. I won't make that mistake again and would respectful suggest that you learn from my error. Of course, I could make you a really good deal on my combination gun, if you think that you can turn a sow's ear into a silk purse.

Jeff

There is a reason that decent SxS double rifles start at about ten times the price of this junk. What you get is a 600 dollar useless piece of hardware. Money better spent on a good bolt or lever gun. The whole point of the double is two fast shots when the chips are down---who in their right mind would rely on this thing?

First of all as I intimated above I am not defending the Baikal guns. I just copied the link for a discussion.

As I said there are some smiths who intend to work with these guns. Of course if they cannot be upgraded then it won't happen. I also said that I did not buy a Baikal as it seemed like too much work. The path of least resistance is easy to take on side by side shotguns.

As to Russian rifles being junk. Well maybe they are to your taste but I remind you that the vanted Mauser rifles are consistanly on the side of loosing wars. It was the Russian army that crushed, killed and defeated the German army what with it's Mauser rifles! When you get your country occupied for forty years by your enemy it does not say much for a countries abilty to make weapons!

Just having a liittle fun guys. I am about the last guy to buy a SXS Russian double rifle. I did just make an offer however on a 88. Not the cannon but the Winchester! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Some would say overextended supply lines and the Russian winter had a bit to do with the defeat of the
German army. Didn't Napoleon have a similar problem? So much for learning from other's mistakes.

Dave

The German problem was fundimentally a lack of intellegence. Keep in mind that for every tactic there is a countermeasure.

So the Germanophiles keep repeating "Blitzkreig" and "assault rifle" but that just was the correct tactic for an unprepared enemy. Meanwhile they had their secret code broken and got outfought on the battlefield.

On the other hand I like German drillings and Schuetzens and have some Mauser sporters. Fine guns they are.

There is a lot of emotion here. Interesting......

EAA has a rifle very similar to this, in fact it may be the same rifle. Sonething that folks are missing is the adjustable regulation. If the adjustable regulation works, then it opens the door for a whole bunch of lower cost doubles. One of the things that makes a double so expensive is the time it takes to regulate the barrels, and much of that is trial and error.

I have shot a low-end double, it was either a Merkel or Krieghoff, one of the under $10K rifles. It was in 470 Nitro express. Offhand at 50 yds I hit an inch left of the bull. I pulled the shot with the second barrel about 3" to the right of bull. Why? Because this rifle wasn't put together so well.

The triggers were horrible--must have a 7 lb pull with lots of creep. The stock was also too short for the rear trigger, and in the process of trying to get the thing to fire I pulled the rifle to the right. Further, the stock was crap--both times I fired it it slapped me in the face, and that really pisses me off. It also slapped the guy in the face who owned the rifle and managed to draw blood. The stock likely needs more cast-off, something that should have been done right on an $8000 rifle.......

Now, to fix that rifle would require trigger work and a new stock. So I'd be spending $8-$10K on a rifle that still needs another thousand dollars worth of work done to fix it.

Given the above, I welcome a $600 - $1000 double. Given I'll have to have the trigger and stock worked on with ANY double I can remotely come close to affording, I am not bothered the Rem/EAA rifle will also need such work. An advantage to the Rem/EAA is the adjustable regulation should take care of the accuracy issues, something that is not so easy with most doubles.

Perhaps the action needs to be beefier to handle larger chamberings. I imagine the reason the 45-70 has such a lower PSI limit than the 30-06 has to do with bolt thrust. In short, the larger the rim size for a given PSI, the more pressure is exerted against the bolt, or in this case, the action. To get the forcae against the action within acceptable limits, the 45-70 must operate at a lower PSI than the 30-06.

As for learning from others, The Russians didn't do so well in Finland during the winter of '41 either.
They all got nicely eliminated by their own Mosin-Nagants.

no one will know how good it is until someone tries it, so buy and try and let us know,,, anybody,,,

I'm considering getting one when they arrive in Australia, and over here they're talking in the vicinity of US$1000-1200! Seriously guys, how else can you get into a double at that price? So the triggers will be heavy and creepy, we can fix that! It'll be roughly built, yeah but it's not costing an arm and a leg either and Baikals are known for longevity. It's only in 45/70 and limited to 28K psi, geez I can see the 400gr hardcast at 1600fps bouncing off the deer and pigs now! If this thing regulates and puts two shots within 3 inches of each other at 75 yards, then it will be damn useful for 90% of all my hunting.
Cheers...
Con

The rifle barrel on my combination gun is able to be regulated, but it doesn't work and EAA never cared. Their response was pretty much "what did you expect for so low a price?". On the whole, the quality of my EAA combination gun is poor and the only thing good about it was the price, but even then it was a waste of $300 that could have gone toward something of value.

If anyone wants to try and make a silk purse out of my sow's ear, I'll gladly sell it for exactly 1/2 of what I paid for it wholesale from CDNN, what a deal!

I have shot some of the Winchester 101 Grand European combination guns and o/u rifles and found them to be a good product for the price.

Jeff

Jeff--

I'm going to be getting one of the double rifles, (plus one of the single-shot rifles) on loan to test. I tried the trigger pulls at SHOT and they weren't the finest in the world, but seemed livable. The stock dimensions also seemed OK--but will know a LOT more after they show up.

Have been surprised before, so am waiting to make up my mind only after shooting the things. Luckily I don't have to buy them to shoot them!

Also looked at the combo gun and the stock dimensions were horrible. How are the trigger pulls on yours?

MD

Not that I want to sound like a bigot or anything...