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I have a M77 MkII Magnum 416 Rigby chambered rifle I need to scope. I'd like to keep it under $1K, a 1" tube will be fine. The solution I keep coming up with is the Trijicon TR21G. Don't know yet if it will fit with the supplied D71M Ruger rings because the TR21G has a small bell, so there is a very defined limit between the power ring and the bell. Anyone know if it fits wit hthe supplied rings?
I looked at Leupold's offerings and am a bit underwhelmed. Nightforce has an offering but is a bit too expensive. The Nikon African offering seems okay but it's a 30mm tube and well, isn't made in the USA.
Any other scopes to consider that I've missed?
Last edited by Blue_Sky; 11/08/10.
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Those magnum actions are long and that limits scope choices. My suggestion is to mount the rings and measure from the front edge of the front ring to the rear edge of the rear ring so you know what will fit.
The Karma bus always has an empty seat when it comes around.- High Brass
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Dave, I've mounted the rings, so I know the outside to outside dimension of the rings that will be the minimum required for a fit with no adjustment. I tried yesterday to find a dimensioned drawing of the TR21G but no joy. I guess I will call them to see if they can give me the dimension. I like what I see with that scope including the BAC both eyes open system which is ideal for my application.
3dtestify, I need lower power and a wider FOV. Would like 65' to 100' at 1.xx power. This rifle will be used at or under 50yds, so magnification is not a priority.... but FOV is.
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Campfire Greenhorn
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Here's the dimensions, on the Magnum, it's 5-7/16" bare minimum to clear the power ring and bell. The picture shows a comparison to my 30 yr old M77 in '06. It's rings are ~3/4" closer overall. ![[Linked Image]](http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-11/71084/M77%20ring%20comparo.jpg)
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Campfire Ranger
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Leupie 2.5 Compact
Leupie VXII 1-4 Shotgun/Muzzleloader
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Campfire Greenhorn
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thanks for your ideas.
the M8 2.5x is too much magnification (believe it or not) and the FOV is "only" 39'@100yds. I need something approx. double that for dangerous game. I've been 20yds from a group of Cape Buffalo, no compromising on FOV.
I already own the Leupold 1-4x20mm and is on my 1895 450 Marlin lever gun. I think I want something better than this for the 416 Rigby rifle.
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Okay, I called Trijicon and the TR21G from power ring to bell is 4-7/8".
Ruger sells the 4BO 1/2" offset to the rear front ring but that still means I would have to machine a minimum of 65 thousandths off the backside of the rear standard ring to make it "just" fit. So, I can get the machining done and then just cold blue the exposed metal.
More fun & games just to get a scope to fit.
Any other ideas????
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Campfire Outfitter
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I have a M77 MkII Magnum 416 Rigby chambered rifle I need to scope. I'd like to keep it under $1K, a 1" tube will be fine. The solution I keep coming up with is the Trijicon TR21G. Don't know yet if it will fit with the supplied D71M Ruger rings because the TR21G has a small bell, so there is a very defined limit between the power ring and the bell. Anyone know if it fits wit hthe supplied rings?
I looked at Leupold's offerings and am a bit underwhelmed. Nightforce has an offering but is a bit too expensive. The Nikon African offering seems okay but it's a 30mm tube and well, isn't made in the USA.
Any other scopes to consider that I've missed?
.............Blue Sky,,,,,,,,,,The lower powered 1.25-4x24 Trijicon WILL NOT have enough mounting tube length for your rifle. I suppose you could use offsetting rings, but imho, they are very ugly. As a 1st scope choice, I originally wanted that same Trijicon scope on my 375 Ruger Alaskan. Not enough mounting tube length for the Alaskan, and it certainly will not be enough for your 416 Rigby either. I wound up putting on a 1.5-5x20 VX111. Trijicon has their new 30mm straight tubers out, but their eye relief is too short. The only suitable Trijicon for your rifle will be the 3-9x40, which should have enough mounting tube length. On a DGR, a 3-9x40 scope imo, doesn`t look as good as would the straight tubed scopes. The 32mm to 36mm objectives would look better than the 40mms and larger. Pick out for yourself a high quality 1" straight tubed lower variable scope. You will have to settle for some change left over. There`s Leupold, Sightron Big Sky, Nikon African, Zeiss? (no 1"), Burris? (no 1"), Bushnell 4200? (no 1"). Any hi-end lower powered variable 30mm DGR scope in a Zeiss, Swaro, Schmidt & Bendover, IOR, N/Force etc, will all be more money than you want to spend. In a 1" tube and if you don`t mind a larger objective with more variable power, the Swaro Z3 3-9x36 (12 oz) for under $1100, might just make a very good alternative and wouldn`t look too bad on your MK11 either. Several ways to go.
28 Nosler,,,,300WSM,,,,338-378 Wby,,,,375 Ruger
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thanks for your ideas.
the M8 2.5x is too much magnification (believe it or not) and the FOV is "only" 39'@100yds. I need something approx. double that for dangerous game. I've been 20yds from a group of Cape Buffalo, no compromising on FOV.
I already own the Leupold 1-4x20mm and is on my 1895 450 Marlin lever gun. I think I want something better than this for the 416 Rigby rifle. ..............Well! You can`t get 80' FOV @ 100 yards unless you go down to about a 1x on the bottom end. The only 1" straight tubed scope for under $1K that I can think of with enough eye relief, with a good FOV (75'?) on the low end which would be better optically than your 1-4x20 VX2, might be the 1.25-5x20 Sightron Big Sky. The 1.5-5x20 VX3s have only 66' FOV on the low end, not the 80' that you say you need. I don`t think that the Leupy straight tubed tacticals will give you enough eye relief and you`ll need 30mm rings. Interesting dilemma. You`d like a 1" straight tubed 1-4x20 or a 1-5x20 Swaro, Zeiss, S & Bendover, N/Force, a hi-end Burris, or a hi-end Bushnell Elite 6500, IOR, Meopta, with the needed eye relief and the needed FOV that nobody builds, or you can cut and modify the rings to use the 1.25-4x24 Trijicon. Good luck.
28 Nosler,,,,300WSM,,,,338-378 Wby,,,,375 Ruger
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Campfire 'Bwana
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The Zeiss Conquest 1.8-5.5x38mm has a very long tube. As well as long eye relief. Very bright and optically friendly scope.
I can measure it between the bells if you want.
The CENTER will hold.
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79' FOV @ 1.25x for the 1.25-5x20 Sightron Big Sky.
If you want something better than your VX2 or the Big Sky, with equal FOV, you`ll have to step up to 30mm rings and go with one of the straight tubed high enders, such as the Euro Diamond from Burris for under a grand or something like the 1-6x24 straight tubed Swaro for well over a grand.
28 Nosler,,,,300WSM,,,,338-378 Wby,,,,375 Ruger
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thanks for your suggestions Big.
My ideal scope for this application would be 1" tube, eye relief >3.75" & preferably 4" or more is better, FOV >80'@100yds, fit in 4-15/16" ring spread easily to allow for some positioning, good reticle options for quick sight picture acquisition when chaos is unleashed, low weight due to recoil inertia / stresses on the mount and known reliability on heavy caliber rifles.
I would like to stay with a 1" tube so the scope and the windage turret don't crowd the access for quick reloading, if it were ever necessary. I feel a 30mm tube + windage turret are encroaching on this aspect. The M77 MkII Magnum "only" carries 3 shots of 416 Rigby and on Cape Buffalo you keep shooting til they're beyond dead. The "dead" ones have been known to kill or injure people, as you're probably aware.
Ugly isn't so much a factor for me as functionality is paramount.
The 1.5-5x20mm VX-3 you chose is not quite what I am after, as I would prefer even lower power, like true 1x or up to 1.25x max and more FOV than the 65'@100yds that the VX-3 offers.
I own one Sightron SII, it's marginally okay. I have a friend that has his SII back for repair right now because it shook loose on a 8x57 sporter, not the heaviest kicker in the world. Although, looking at the Big Sky 1.25-5x20mm, it does satisfy all of my criteria except for one...... it is suspect on reliability.
Already saw a Burris scope fail during one expensive trip on a Freedom Arms 454 Casull. That was a real let down, plus, they didn't handle the repair very well, quite contentious. Needless to say, that scope was sold after being repaired.
Any other thoughts?????
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The Zeiss Conquest 1.8-5.5x38mm has a very long tube. As well as long eye relief. Very bright and optically friendly scope.
I can measure it between the bells if you want. .....Any around? Didn`t Zeiss discontinue that scope? Though it won`t have 80' FOV set on 1.8x. Probably around 60' or under?
28 Nosler,,,,300WSM,,,,338-378 Wby,,,,375 Ruger
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I would like to stay with a 1" tube so the scope and the windage turret don't crowd the access for quick reloading, if it were ever necessary. I feel a 30mm tube + windage turret are encroaching on this aspect. Is .091" really a big deal here?
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thanks for your suggestions Big.
My ideal scope for this application would be 1" tube, eye relief >3.75" & preferably 4" or more is better, FOV >80'@100yds, fit in 4-15/16" ring spread easily to allow for some positioning, good reticle options for quick sight picture acquisition when chaos is unleashed, low weight due to recoil inertia / stresses on the mount and known reliability on heavy caliber rifles.
I would like to stay with a 1" tube so the scope and the windage turret don't crowd the access for quick reloading, if it were ever necessary. I feel a 30mm tube + windage turret are encroaching on this aspect. The M77 MkII Magnum "only" carries 3 shots of 416 Rigby and on Cape Buffalo you keep shooting til they're beyond dead. The "dead" ones have been known to kill or injure people, as you're probably aware.
Ugly isn't so much a factor for me as functionality is paramount.
The 1.5-5x20mm VX-3 you chose is not quite what I am after, as I would prefer even lower power, like true 1x or up to 1.25x max and more FOV than the 65'@100yds that the VX-3 offers.
I own one Sightron SII, it's marginally okay. I have a friend that has his SII back for repair right now because it shook loose on a 8x57 sporter, not the heaviest kicker in the world. Although, looking at the Big Sky 1.25-5x20mm, it does satisfy all of my criteria except for one...... it is suspect on reliability.
Already saw a Burris scope fail during one expensive trip on a Freedom Arms 454 Casull. That was a real let down, plus, they didn't handle the repair very well, quite contentious. Needless to say, that scope was sold after being repaired.
Any other thoughts????? ...........Any other thoughts you ask???? Yeah! This one is a tuffy! OK! So no 30mm rings. 1" rings only and no Big Sky Sightron due to potential reliability (recoil) issues. Must have 80' FOV with good eye relief and have better glass optically than your 1-4x20 VX2....Damn! You`re not too hard to please are you???!!!  Well sheeeet! How about this then. Call Leupy and ask them if they can put VX3 glass into your 1-4x20 VX2 while maintaining the 80' FOV you want and the eye relief you`ll need. Turn that 1-4x20 VX2 into a 1-4x20 VX3?
28 Nosler,,,,300WSM,,,,338-378 Wby,,,,375 Ruger
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mathman, did you see the part about the windage turret? It's not just tube diameter but a combination of the tube size increase plus the turret dimension stack up variable.
plus different scope brands & models have wildly different turret dimensions.
So, under the tremendous pressure of a worst case scenario where you've expended 3 rounds and your butt is on the line.... Yes, I think it is significant and no, I don't think I'm being pedantic here.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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plus different scope brands & models have wildly different turret dimensions. That's why I didn't worry about them. A 1" tube scope could have the bigger turret than a 30mm scope, so that's to be considered case by case. The turret covers on this 30mm Z6 seem pretty understated: ![[Linked Image]](http://www.eurooptic.com/img/products/Swarovski-Z6-1-6x24-CD.jpg) For a fixed turret size there's just the difference I stated.
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LOL!!
well he11 Big! if it were easy, I wouldn't have posted the question to begin with. :-)) I've truly been struggling with this one and I own 12 scopes and even more rifles, so making decisions in the past haven't been difficult.
The more I think about it though, the more I'm leaning towards the Trijicon 1.25-4x24mm Accupoint TR21G and just machine the rings a bit to accomodate it, along with a front offset Ruger 4BO ring. I have full access to a machine shop, so no issue there.
Thanks for your help!
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