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Joined: Dec 2005
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 13,760 |
the only "explanation" needed, is that it's owned by them, and not you ... and they can do whatever the hell they want to with the land ... including telling you to stay the hell off it, even if you're Mother Theresa ...
Now, you explain to me where I'm wrong...
It may not be wrong, but would it be "justified"? Absolutely. Not that you care. And the law doesn't allow you to trespass because you don't like why you were told no.
War Damn Eagle!
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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So you're saying that if someone you didn't know approached you, and gave you "references" to prove they are a nice, honest guy, and then asked to borrow your vehicle since you weren't using it at the time ... you'd let them since you wouldn't be "justified" in saying "no"???
-WGM-
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411 |
two problems with putting stands on the line....one is that it interferes with an existing stand or hunting area by noise or scent. the other is the sort of unstated intent to shoot over the line onto my property. I mean, why would you put a stand right on the line and only be able to hunt 180 degrees....when you could move it back and hunt more area on your own lease?
with good neighbors, these things get worked out pretty easily. with jackass neighbors, or jackasses they lease to....not so much.
Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,471
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2008
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Get over it and quit whining like a little girl.
Why don't you wake up and address the issue rather than simply restating the obvious. For some reason I expected more from you counselor........ Laws/rules are broken all the time when people feel they are unjustified. Understand?
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 743
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 743 |
Yep plus 1 for me too. I have always gotten along with my neighbors even during the hunting seasons. But as of late, we all seem to be getting older and we are spending less time in our own woods hunting, and therefore we are trying to let the younger crowd have at it. The problem is the lack of respect and common sense. We don't have thousand's of acres and neither does the neighbor. All the years he and I hunted our own lands we always did so with the respect and cooperation one would expect from not only a neighbor, but a fellow hunter.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 10,266
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 10,266 |
So you're saying that if someone you didn't know approached you, and gave you "references" to prove they are a nice, honest guy, and then asked to borrow your vehicle since you weren't using it at the time ... you'd let them since you wouldn't be "justified" in saying "no"???
Oh ... one more thing ... in the event that you told the guy "no, you can't borrow my vehicle", I guess you wouldn't be upset if the guy decided to "borrow" your vehicle anyway after you told him that he couldn't use it? ... your lack of sense cracks me up, when it's not making my brain hurt ...
-WGM-
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,910 Likes: 13
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,910 Likes: 13 |
He should hope there's no property owner out there who feels the prohibition against shooting trespassers is unjustified.
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411 |
For some reason I expected more from you counselor........
Laws/rules are broken all the time when people feel they are unjustified.
Understand?
No, I'm trying but I really don't understand your point. we have a name for people who break laws when people feel they are unjustified....we call them criminals. most criminals don't feel laws should apply to them, but they do. A landowners right to bar or allow conduct on his land is absolute.....his reasons may be reasonable...worries about liability, saving the game for his own family or friends, opposed to hunting, worried about his livestock....or his reasons may be spiteful and hateful....or he may not even really have a reason, just doesn't like people on his place. Whatever his reason or lack of it, he is completely justified as a matter of law because it's his land. that is one of the bundle of rights I get when I buy land, the right to exclude whoever I choose. So, you're right....I am completely unable to understand why you seem to think anybody owes you any explanation or justification for their decision to allow or not allow you on their place.
Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 21,830 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 21,830 Likes: 3 |
FWIW:
I hunt boundary lines all the time.
Here in the Pacific NW, they log right up to the line. Usually, we have BLM on one side, Private on the other.
The Boundary lien of the logging creates the hunting opportunity. (timber transitions to browse).
Mot land is not posted, so its not a big deal.
The posted land usually has a home on it, in that case (posted), I don't hunt that side of the land.
BMT
"The Church can and should help modern society by tirelessly insisting that the work of women in the home be recognized and respected by all in its irreplaceable value." Apostolic Exhortation On The Family, Pope John Paul II
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,210
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2007
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A land owner is justified in withholding hunting permission because it is AMERICA. You have a real entitlement attitude. Go buy your own land, use it as you wish.
BTW you are just jerking our chains right, you do not really do that do you? Definition of justification; To show a satisfactory reason or excuse for something done. Sorry my friend, but "because it is America" just doesn't get it ......ya' know? I could spell it out for you but am sure you will choose not understand because of your entitlement attitude.....ya know? I akin your actions/reactions as to an admission of theivery. I guess those people not only owe you a place to hunt, but probably owe you a monthly income which will allow you to quit work and pursue your hobbies, such as playing robin Hood....what a socialist.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 7,709 Likes: 1 |
[quote=Steve_NO]
Get over it and quit whining like a little girl. Why don't you wake up and address the issue rather than simply restating the obvious. For some reason I expected more from you counselor........ Laws/rules are broken all the time when people feel they are unjustified. end of quote scroll down SITUATIONAL ETHICS, is bending or breaking the rules [laws ] to benifit yourself, WHAT IT MEANS IS THAT YOU ARE NOT TO BE TRUSTED WITH ANYTHING,WHEN YOU BREAK ONE YOU PUT YOURSELF ABOVE OTHERS no leg to stand on there just more criminal activity  Understand? norm
Last edited by norm99; 11/15/10. Reason: screwed up
There is not enough darkness in all the world to put out the light of even one small candle----Robert Alden .
If it wern't entertaining, I wouldn't keep coming back.------the BigSky
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2005
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I drove home from hunting last night and passed a fish and game truck sitting next to a truck that was pulled off the road along a private stretch of nice deer woods. In R.I. you need written permission. In some towns, you need the police chief's signature on your license, or there's no hunting at all. Next door in Massachusetts, you don't need land owner permission, and can hunt anywhere you can hunt anywhere that is not posted. I know a lot of guys that drive around until they see a nice deer in a field. They get out, sneak up on it and pop it. I can't go onto someone's property without asking. I just wasn't raised that way.
"I didn't get the sophisticated gene in this family. I started the sophisticated gene in this family." Willie Robertson
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 17,048
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 17,048 |
two problems with putting stands on the line....one is that it interferes with an existing stand or hunting area by noise or scent. the other is the sort of unstated intent to shoot over the line onto my property. I mean, why would you put a stand right on the line and only be able to hunt 180 degrees....when you could move it back and hunt more area on your own lease?
with good neighbors, these things get worked out pretty easily. with jackass neighbors, or jackasses they lease to....not so much. The guy I mentioned earlier actually had a very good spot for his blind. Our side has a wood lot and it's brushy along the fence so deer often skirt the edge of the woods and hop over to his side. Plus, I tie the fence right there to make it easier for deer. I pull the top 2 wires together and then the bottom 2 making a bigger gap in the middle for fawns and lower top wire for adult deer. They always seemed to cross there anyway, evidenced by the trail on his side. His side is an irrigated quarter section with nary a tree or any other cover in sight. Where he set up is the only place on the property worth using. And for all I know this might be the only place the man has available for hunting, I not gonig to ruin that for him. There's plenty of deer. No worries. When I wished him good luck, I meant it.
BAN THE RAINBOW FLAG!
PERVERTS OFFEND ME!
"When is penguin season, daddy? I wanna go kill a penguin!"
---- 4 yr old Archerhuntress
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Joined: May 2007
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Here in Texas and our QDMA group it's understanding that land owners will not allow any hunting device within 75 yards of the fence line,meaning stands or feeders and such.
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,697 Likes: 12
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,697 Likes: 12 |
Used to hunt a leased property where the neighbor put a ladder stand on a tree with the property line paint on it. It was on his side of the tree so there wasn't really anything I could do, but still thought it was bad manners. Walking in and out of the area I hunted I had to pass within 50 yds of his ladder. Never saw anyone in the stand, but there was evidence of frequent use. Always made it a point to have plenty of orange showing if I came by in daylight and a flashlight lit if it was dark. Coming out I also made it a point to empty my P-bottle on my side of the tree.
“When Tyranny becomes Law, Rebellion becomes Duty”
Colossians 3:17 (New King James Version)
"And whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through Him."
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Posts: 35,293
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 35,293 |
Neighboring property to me has a stand 10 feet off the line and the stand faces my property.
That one burns me pretty bad.
I often sit in a hang on stand on my side of the line facing my property near that stand. They are behind me maybe 20 yds also facing my property. I�ll turn around & yell to them �Hey thanks for backing me up man, if you see anything from there that I can�t see from here give me a whistle ok? You watch the left & I�ll watch the right.�
Something clever here.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130 |
While I can't know exactly what tone of voice and/or body language you were using when you said "I informed the neighbors friend that the 10x10 building with the smoke stack is a deer blind that I hunt from and that shots comming in my general direction will result in return fire!" I can only assume that the way you wrote it means that you were rather forceful when you delivered that message. That said, I can understand how the guy receiving the message may have been pissed, but that doesn't excuse him (or whomever it was) in any way from firing shots into your stand. Now that I have that out of the way, I'm just wondering if you considered that the window in the neighboring stand you were/are so upset with was/is merely there to observe game that might be headed toward the neighboring property from your direction? And even further, that they might be able to tell when someone was/is hunting your stand - and of course if/when you're not there at the same time, a shot in that direction wouldn't be 'dangerous'? As to the original question about etiquette, I guess I would prefer a neighbor not set up a stand on their property line so close to a stand that I already had set up there, but it's not like I have any say about it, and definitely wouldn't want anyone trying to tell me where/how I might erect a stand on my property. I guess that means that if it happens, so be it ... just let it go ... move your own stand if you don't like it. It's not like you have any 'right' to the stand location just because yours was there first. Again, I realize we're talking "etiquette" and not "rights" ... but I think it would be just as poor a display of etiquette to try to tell a neighbor that they shouldn't put a stand in a certain location on their own property - and that's regardless of whether it's the property owner who's hunting it, or some "city slicker" that only shows up during hunting season. Wish I had seen this earlier...pretty much my thoughts exactly, and well stated. WGM has a way of hitting it on the head, don't he? Well said.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130 |
If you want to explain to me why a landowner is justified in refusing a polite request to hunt on his vacant and otherwise unused property by a responsible individual (who is willing to provide references attesting to that fact) then we can go on from there............ or we can do it the hard way.
It's his property. Fundamental law at the BASE of the foundation of Western and American law. If you can't fathom that, and respect the lawful ownership rights of another, then you are below the lowest of slob-hunters. What you describe yourself doing is poaching, pure and simple, illegal, immoral, and unethical in EVERY jurisdiction. The sooner one of those property owners catches you, and your ass loses your hunting privileges through due process of law, the better for all the rest of us.
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 2,715 |
Wow, this post sure is somethin. I miss the days when we alll hunted together.
No posted signs, no border disputes, even shared treestands.
We were out for fun and good times and if someone got the big one well great. It was pure enjoyment, love of outdoors and shared good times we enjoyed.
How can the young ones just learn to enjoy the outdoors and be sportsman if we act like this. Our land remains open and we enjoy meeting other hunters, our motto the more the merrier.
Everyone wants the trophy and will fight for it I guess.
Me, I want good enjoyable memories with friends and family.
Sorry to ramble, jst seems if we would work together it would funner for all.
"That's what happens when your leaders stop being an American and start being a politician." George S. Patton What would Yoda do...your ass kick it he would. ![[Linked Image]](http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj387/HorenSehenLeben/Icons/thcanyourun.jpg)
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130 |
rrroae;
Make contact with the neighbors. They may not know the line is where it is, and the contact may be mutually beneficial.
Worth a try that way first, at least.
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