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The most recent issue of American Riflemen mentions re-newed efforts by environmentalists to ban lead bullets, including bullet cores. My question is: in a worst case scenario, are there viable substitutes for lead? can jacketed bullets be manufactured with tungsten cores or some other lead substitute?
The power to legislate is the power to destroy
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I'd buy a Corbin press and make bootleg bullets.
Islam is a terrorist organization.
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Guess I would be breaking the law the rest of my life as I have enough ammo loaded to last me the few rest of my hunting seasons. Don't plan to change.
If God wanted you to walk and carry things on your back, He would not have invented stirrups and pack saddles
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There are substitutes, but they cost a lot more than lead. As I have posted here before, the ammo companies and the military both would like to see lead in ammunition phased out. It is cheap but it is also a major environmental contaminant and a health risk for those who work with it. Since lead was removed from gasoline, the military has become the biggest source of lead contamination in the environment. They are being pressed to find a suitable substitute. When that happens, you can pretty much kiss bullets with lead good-by.
Ben
Some days it takes most of the day for me to do practically nothing...
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Campfire Kahuna
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The AR story was pretty much dead and gone by the time the issue went to press. The proposal didn't get very far at all, though no doubt there will be other lead-ban efforts in the future. Given today's politial climate, I doubt they will get very far--except in certain states such as California, and maybe Massachusetts.
However, even if for some reason lead is nationally outlawed for bullets there are already many good lead-free bullets that work great for both varmint and big game hunting. I also suspect the price will go down once EVERY bullet maker is competing for market share.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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This is a line of thought that has plagued me for more than a few years now. First the anti's used "cop killer bullets" to ban. Definition of this was to be left to a bureaucrat, probably someone like the turd that Obama just fingered to head the BATF. Then the environmentalist approach( California's lead bullet ban to protect condor's)2/3's to 3/4 of the whole state you can't use lead bullets for hunting. Several other states are also looking at this. Need I mention the use of non toxics for waterfowl nationwide and upland on certain govt owned properties? Over the years they tried frontal assualts with big taxes and limited quanities type laws on ammo and found it was easier to come from the backside on eliminating certain types of ammo.
Several years ago while at a local big box sporting goods store they had a monitor on, playing a infomercial by Barnes bullets.In the infomercial they showed highly exaggerated scenario of what happens to cup and core bullets when they hit a deer. With the lead bullet completely disintergrating and spraying lead thru out the carcass "contaminating the meat". I stood there and watched this twice just to make sure I got it allright and didn't jump to wrong conclusions.Now we all know what happens to cup and core bullets of a frangible design if connected to shoulder bones,leg,and vertebrate, they come apart.The wrong cup and core and big bones don't mix well.One of the reasons I like the double lung shot myself and yeah for the places I hunt its feasable. Now I knew I was watching a rah-rah Barnes commercial to why I should buy their bullets but not everybody knows enough about bullet performance to seperate Barnes "info" from the facts. That fact was promptly demonstrated right on the spot when a younger guy and his gal walked up to watch the infomercial. After seeing the "lead spraying scenario by Barnes" she looked at her guy and said "you don't use those kind of bullets do you? because if you do I am never eating venison again". Right on the spot I made up my mind that Barnes and the liberal media turds they had make their video were on my permanent [bleep] list. Advertise superior accuracy and performance yeah, you bet totally legit,but using bogus crap to advance your product by supporting the anti- lead agenda noway.I'll support Nosler or Hornady if the day comes I need "green" bullets. I also shoot big lead bullets in Sharps cartridges for hunting and haven't seen one of them come apart yet on deer or antelope ,they just whistle thru.Something to think about, bad enough to have to fight all the time for our rights without a company who caters to us doing us in the back to promote their own products. Yeahyeah you tsx fans flame all you want, Barnes bias me BEFORE I ever shot one. Magnum_Man
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I also suspect the price will go down once EVERY bullet maker is competing for market share. .....and places like Mid-South sell blems like the recent flush of GMXs for a small fraction of the cost. Then again, with the volatility of the favored substitute metals like copper, who knows where this could go?
Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
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If the bullets are outlawed it won't matter if you own them you can't hunt with them.
Solid copper will be it.
1st Special Operations Wing 1975-1983
919th Special Operations Wing 1983-1985 1993-1994
"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I also suspect the price will go down once EVERY bullet maker is competing for market share. I sure hope so since I like to shoot my rifles a lot. The price difference between fifty Barnes and fifty Sierras buys the gas for my longish drive to the range and a modest lunch too.
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I'd be legislated a criminal, something that surprises me less and less every day.
Of note: The biggest source of lead contamination in the environment isn't the military, its the environment itself....
You'd think these "green" people would have a chub over a very plentiful, recyclable metal and find safe ways to handle it....
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Campfire Oracle
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They just pop a chub out of putting us (shooters) out of business..
"...the left considers you vermin, and they'll kill you given the chance..." Bristoe
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"If we could somehow bottle the Brittany's energy and spirit, we'd solve most of the world's problems, if not all of them"
"People who drink light "beer" don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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The most recent issue of American Riflemen mentions re-newed efforts by environmentalists to ban lead bullets, including bullet cores. My question is: in a worst case scenario, are there viable substitutes for lead? can jacketed bullets be manufactured with tungsten cores or some other lead substitute? Then everyone will have to hunt with the best bullets out there. Barnes. On a serious note, IMHO its all BS, just like the lead shot ban on ducks. Lead came from the ground, goes back to the ground really quick, IE does not stay on the surface very long. BUT look at other countries.. no lead fishing weights.. WTF.. its coming here unless we stand up and just say NO WAY.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Campfire Kahuna
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This is a line of thought that has plagued me for more than a few years now. First the anti's used "cop killer bullets" to ban. Definition of this was to be left to a bureaucrat, probably someone like the turd that Obama just fingered to head the BATF. Then the environmentalist approach( California's lead bullet ban to protect condor's)2/3's to 3/4 of the whole state you can't use lead bullets for hunting. Several other states are also looking at this. Need I mention the use of non toxics for waterfowl nationwide and upland on certain govt owned properties? Over the years they tried frontal assualts with big taxes and limited quanities type laws on ammo and found it was easier to come from the backside on eliminating certain types of ammo.
Several years ago while at a local big box sporting goods store they had a monitor on, playing a infomercial by Barnes bullets.In the infomercial they showed highly exaggerated scenario of what happens to cup and core bullets when they hit a deer. With the lead bullet completely disintergrating and spraying lead thru out the carcass "contaminating the meat". I stood there and watched this twice just to make sure I got it allright and didn't jump to wrong conclusions.Now we all know what happens to cup and core bullets of a frangible design if connected to shoulder bones,leg,and vertebrate, they come apart.The wrong cup and core and big bones don't mix well.One of the reasons I like the double lung shot myself and yeah for the places I hunt its feasable. Now I knew I was watching a rah-rah Barnes commercial to why I should buy their bullets but not everybody knows enough about bullet performance to seperate Barnes "info" from the facts. That fact was promptly demonstrated right on the spot when a younger guy and his gal walked up to watch the infomercial. After seeing the "lead spraying scenario by Barnes" she looked at her guy and said "you don't use those kind of bullets do you? because if you do I am never eating venison again". Right on the spot I made up my mind that Barnes and the liberal media turds they had make their video were on my permanent [bleep] list. Advertise superior accuracy and performance yeah, you bet totally legit,but using bogus crap to advance your product by supporting the anti- lead agenda noway.I'll support Nosler or Hornady if the day comes I need "green" bullets. I also shoot big lead bullets in Sharps cartridges for hunting and haven't seen one of them come apart yet on deer or antelope ,they just whistle thru.Something to think about, bad enough to have to fight all the time for our rights without a company who caters to us doing us in the back to promote their own products. Yeahyeah you tsx fans flame all you want, Barnes bias me BEFORE I ever shot one. Magnum_Man I've seen that before too. But they are using it as marketing. Can't blame em for that IMHO. BUT you have other choices already,.. I've tried etips and can't get em to shoot. Waiting on the .284 GMX to get out and the .257 GMX to try as they have better BC than barnes does. PErsonally I don' tshoot much cup and core at game any more. But thats due to performance issues. But Id' hate to have to pay Barnes price for shooting matches....
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Klik,
It's hard to tell, of course, what future copper prices will be. Right now they're at historic highs--but the price of the copper in a 50-bullet box of Barnes 180-grain TSX's is only about $5.
I know from talking to bullet manufacturers that there's considerable profit in lead-free bullets, because they're relatively simple to make compared to lead-core bullets. Grooves complicate things a little, but using two different materials and having to swage them together is more complex. Bonding, of course, adds more expense to the process.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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A box of 7 mm TSX set me back $70.00 two weeks ago.
Apparently I inadvertently purchased the gold plated platinum numbers!
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Campfire Oracle
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 Call me....I'll cut you a deal for ONLY $60 per box.... 
"...the left considers you vermin, and they'll kill you given the chance..." Bristoe
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I generally use TSX's for target work and plinking.......hit a neighbor kid on his bike, but just nicked 'em.
Only question the LEO had for me was "was it a GREEN bullet?"
(laffin')
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"If we could somehow bottle the Brittany's energy and spirit, we'd solve most of the world's problems, if not all of them"
"People who drink light "beer" don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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