|
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 23,457 Likes: 7
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 23,457 Likes: 7 |
I think you are in a tissy fit over nothing.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,667
Campfire Ranger
|
|
OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,667 |
The local gunshop I frequent here in my NW AR town has a sign on the front door that says no loaded firearms unless it is holstered and you have a valid CCW permit. I thought that was a good way to handle the issue. That's why I called the guy to see if that's what was meant, and if so to suggest that he be a bit more explicit. But he meant no CCW. And while that's his right, it's a really dumb business decision, and It's my right not to give him a dime.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,667
Campfire Ranger
|
|
OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,667 |
A new gun shop just opened up in my home town. For the first couple of weeks all was fine and rather normal. Today I stop by during lunch to feed my addiction (see if they have anything cool I can�t live without) and as I approach the door I see a sign that says:
No loaded firearms beyond this door.
Just above that sign is a flyer advertising that this shop teaches the Arkansas Concealed Handgun course.
ARE YOU FRIGGIN KIDDING ME?
So, I turned right round, got in my car and left. The guys sign had the phone number posted, so as I left to check out his competitors, I gave him a call. In short I asked WTF?? He basically said that while he supports the right to carry, he�s not comfortable with people being armed in his store. I asked him if he saw the irony and he responded by telling me it�s the right of any business owner. I told him that I don�t support businesses that do not allow my right to self protection and that I would not EVER step foot in his store; he was 100% okay with that. (I would imagine he would think twice if he only knew how many guns I buy per year).
Now I know that many people here who live in large cities see this all the time. But my home town has a population of under 15k. Violent crime is extremely low and things like armed robbery happen about once every 3-4 years. My community is VERY conservative, and you can bet that a high percentage is packing.
I�m just flabbergasted� Piss on him and gun stores that are like his. Wait a minute... I had to read this again.. The sign says "no loaded firearms beyond this door".. Doesn't say you can't carry concealed, just that it has to be unloaded.. With the possible exception of a politician, it's really hard to imagine anything more useless than an UNLOADED gun.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,667
Campfire Ranger
|
|
OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,667 |
I think you are in a tissy fit over nothing. Maybe to you, but for a business that is looking to make their bread and butter off of people buying concealed firearms, and teaching CCW classes, I think this is a dumb, and piss poor attitude. Just my opinion, I see yours differs.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 13,760
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 13,760 |
To me, the better approach would be signage to the effect of: "All guns not holstered and on the person for carry should be unloaded with action open before entry."
But it is his business, and his rules. Also may be insurance rules.
Being so pizzed you couldn't walk in and make a calm inquiry seems a bit of an overreaction, but to each his own.
Also, carry concealed and it's not a problem. It's only his store rules, not a law.
War Damn Eagle!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 23,457 Likes: 7
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 23,457 Likes: 7 |
Would you be happy if you owned a gunshop and Homey G's would walk in with firearms tucked in their waste belts, and wanted to look at other firearms?
I'm sure he has his reasons...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 25,528 Likes: 4
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 25,528 Likes: 4 |
I think you are in a tissy fit over nothing. Maybe to you, but for a business that is looking to make their bread and butter off of people buying concealed firearms, and teaching CCW classes, I think this is a dumb, and piss poor attitude. Just my opinion, I see yours differs. Teaching CCW and supporting the right to carry DOES NOT trump wanting to stay alive when dipchits come into the store waving a loaded firearm around. Do you get all butt hurt when your range has a cease fire and makes you unload your weapon? Chill out....
�Politicians are the lowest form of life on earth. Liberal Democrats are the lowest form of politician.� �General George S. Patton, Jr.
---------------------------------------------------------
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 31,266 Likes: 4
Campfire 'Bwana
|
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 31,266 Likes: 4 |
You're telling HIM to chill out? Geez.
Kevin, you did everything right as far as I can tell. You obeyed the sign, called for clarification and when you learned that he means "no CCW" you promised to obey that wish - forever.
As was pointed out, he is free to alienate all the customers he chooses to, for as long as he manages to avoid going broke in the process.
Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 25,528 Likes: 4
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 25,528 Likes: 4 |
Yeah I'm telling him to chill out.
I can't believe how some "guys" get so worked up and want to take stupid chit personally.
Then they get a good piss and moan going online with like minded chicks all over NOTHING.
Carry on...
�Politicians are the lowest form of life on earth. Liberal Democrats are the lowest form of politician.� �General George S. Patton, Jr.
---------------------------------------------------------
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,509
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,509 |
I can't believe you started a thread with O M G ! ! !
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 13,234
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 13,234 |
I'll have to check, but I'm pretty sure just about every gun store I've been in around here has the same sign on the door.
If I boycotted them all, I wouldn't have anywhere to go.
- Tom
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 23,034 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 23,034 Likes: 6 |
KevinGibson: Insurance and civil laws and liberal courts/juries often mandate this type of sign that so offended you (and maybe rightfully so?).
Let me run past you just ONE scenario that resulted in lawsuits/lawyers/hard feelings AND a death!
I used to work off duty in unifrom in one of the nicest sport shops in the Pacific Norhtwest (Warshals Sporting Goods - Seattle, Washington 1st & Madison).
Myself and a couple other local officers worked there protecting the mostly Jewish shop personnel from the "urban youths" who often brazenly robbed and shoplifted from them!
We worked the afternoons and all day Friday and Saturdays.
One Monday morning in comes a suited gentleman and he walked over to the used gun rack put a shotshell into a shotgun and blew his brains out all over the ceiling and floor.
Sure enough relatives initiated a "civil action" for damages.
At least three employees went off on modest termed sick leave.
Lawyers were hired and MONIES were spent.
Insurance premiums got increased.
Etc, etc etc!
The owner (Mr. Warshal) contemplated and then invoked many restrictions and policy changes from that date hence.
One restriction that was contemplated but was NOT invoked, was, the posting of a sign restricting loaded arms in the store.
The Warshals store that I had shopped at for many decades closed not to long after the head blown off by shotgun blast incident.
You are welcome to be miffed at the restriction - but I am not sure YOU are holding the right party/parties responsible for your ire?
You might just conceal up real good one day and walk in and ask the OWNER how much extra in insurance premiums he would have to pay if he allowed folks to bring in loaded arms?
Aww... you have time for one more - some years before THE incident I just relayed, the same Warshals store had a gunsmithing shop upstairs - the shop employed three gunsmiths during one period of time.
In comes a gun for repair and one of the gunsmith handles the arm - it discharges a bullet and the gunsmith is injured!
IF, there had been "a prohibition of loaded arms" being brought into the store then the person bringing the loaded gun in would have been liable to a greater extent civily (monetarily).
PERHAPS your view of the gunshops restriction is POLITICAL - so be that, and again you MAY have a qualm there.
But I would bet the gunshop owner is pro-gun and just trying to live within the bounds of present day society (liberal judges and juries) and his insurance program/premium!
After all, whats the owner gonna do if you pack heat (concealed) into his shop and foil a robbery, an assault or a kidnapping - sue you?
Maybe, but I think not.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
|
|
Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
Kevin,
I'd not go back and I'd post the business name. That's flat out chickeschit.
Travis
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,712
Campfire Tracker
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,712 |
[quote=KevinGibson]
"... my home town has a population of under 15k. Violent crime is extremely low and things like armed robbery happen about once every 3-4 years."
Kevin, Forget that I am from Canada and also accept that it is legal for you to carry concealed in your jurisdiction. Given the conditions you outlined above can you give me a reasonable answer as to why you feel it is necessary to go armed around town?
Of course the bottom line is, the store owner has the right to impose any rules he wants and it is also your right to boycott his shop if you choose to.
Jim
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 25,926 Likes: 2
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 25,926 Likes: 2 |
guess i see both sides i see the irony. however i would think a gunshop would be about the last place i would need to carry
Not necessarily. A local gun shop owner had a pair of guys come in a few years ago. They spoke very little English, and might have still been dripping water onto the floor. But they did manage to convey that they were interested in purchasing a handgun from the display case along with a box of ammo for same. When the "customer" started to stuff ammo into the handgun, the gunshop owner started shouting "No" and drew his own carry piece. The customer did not desist, and the owner did shoot him once. Whereupon the perp dropped the handgun and left the premises trailing blood as he went. His buddy got him into their vehicle and they quickly exited the area. The local cops never did find any trace of the pair. A guy has got to be really stupid to attempt an armed robbery of a one man show, gun smithing and sales outfit.
People who choose to brew up their own storms bitch loudest about the rain.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,709
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,709 |
[quote=KevinGibson]
"... my home town has a population of under 15k. Violent crime is extremely low and things like armed robbery happen about once every 3-4 years."
Kevin, Forget that I am from Canada and also accept that it is legal for you to carry concealed in your jurisdiction. Given the conditions you outlined above can you give me a reasonable answer as to why you feel it is necessary to go armed around town?
Of course the bottom line is, the store owner has the right to impose any rules he wants and it is also your right to boycott his shop if you choose to.
Jim Since we normally, don't know when we are going to get robbed or mugged, having it with us, takes all the guess work out.
Last edited by sactoller; 04/13/11.
Official member of "The Clan of Turd-like People" ![[Linked Image]](https://i.postimg.cc/050xcBLB/Abbyand-Rum.jpg)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 4,320
Campfire Tracker
|
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 4,320 |
I have been to shooting matches with signs posted saying, "Open or Out", and I agree 100%.
Unfortunately, the stupidity and carelessness of a few put a hardship of others, who practice safe gun handling.
Most of the posters on here have seen people come into gunstores that you would not want to even be in the same county with. Some of the stupidest and most careless gun handling I have ever seen has been in gun stores and at public shooting ranges.
I shot competition trap for many years. One day I was visiting one of those shoots where people shoot at released birds. They had a practice trap field where the hunters could warm up and practice. I watched for a few minutes and left. If that had been a registered trap shoot, every single one of those shooters would have been kicked of the field within 5 minutes. It still amazes me that someone was not killed.
Folks, THESE are the type people you will see in gun stores 99% of the time. I don't blame the owner. I would not want to be in a gun store with some of these people carrying a loaded gun, either. I certainly did not feel safe standing near that trap field, and you KNEW the guns were loaded, because I had watched them load 5 shells before they even got to the firing line to shoot at ONE target.
You ever see them in a gun store wanting to buy a box of cartridges the night before opening day, and they do not even know the caliber of the gun they borrowed for their first ever deer hunt?
I would be offended if the owner let someone like this walk into a gun store carrying a loaded gun
Have any of you ever seen someone who has a gun and doesn't even know how to check to see if it is loaded? I have. It is not a warm and fuzzy feeling, if he has just swung the muzzle across your face.
Everyone makes his own decisions. My decision is that I would not even go into a gun store where I knew the owner was lax in enforcing gun safety, and to me, gun safety is not allowing the general public to bring in a loaded gun.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 673
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 673 |
Much like opinions, we all have choices to make. If you don't care for mine that's fine, I might not care for yours either. It is what it is.....
Huntinut
Huntinut
"If it's the truth it ain't braggin" Will Rogers
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 17,230 Likes: 2
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 17,230 Likes: 2 |
The oldest gunshop in our town has a sign on the door (for years) that says:
"Please unload gun and remove ski mask before entering!"
Sycamore
...Actually Sycamore, you are sort of right....
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 817
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 817 |
KevinGibson: Insurance and civil laws and liberal courts/juries often mandate this type of sign that so offended you (and maybe rightfully so?).
Let me run past you just ONE scenario that resulted in lawsuits/lawyers/hard feelings AND a death!
I used to work off duty in unifrom in one of the nicest sport shops in the Pacific Norhtwest (Warshals Sporting Goods - Seattle, Washington 1st & Madison).
Myself and a couple other local officers worked there protecting the mostly Jewish shop personnel from the "urban youths" who often brazenly robbed and shoplifted from them!
We worked the afternoons and all day Friday and Saturdays.
One Monday morning in comes a suited gentleman and he walked over to the used gun rack put a shotshell into a shotgun and blew his brains out all over the ceiling and floor.
Sure enough relatives initiated a "civil action" for damages.
At least three employees went off on modest termed sick leave.
Lawyers were hired and MONIES were spent.
Insurance premiums got increased.
Etc, etc etc!
The owner (Mr. Warshal) contemplated and then invoked many restrictions and policy changes from that date hence.
One restriction that was contemplated but was NOT invoked, was, the posting of a sign restricting loaded arms in the store.
The Warshals store that I had shopped at for many decades closed not to long after the head blown off by shotgun blast incident.
You are welcome to be miffed at the restriction - but I am not sure YOU are holding the right party/parties responsible for your ire?
You might just conceal up real good one day and walk in and ask the OWNER how much extra in insurance premiums he would have to pay if he allowed folks to bring in loaded arms?
Aww... you have time for one more - some years before THE incident I just relayed, the same Warshals store had a gunsmithing shop upstairs - the shop employed three gunsmiths during one period of time.
In comes a gun for repair and one of the gunsmith handles the arm - it discharges a bullet and the gunsmith is injured!
IF, there had been "a prohibition of loaded arms" being brought into the store then the person bringing the loaded gun in would have been liable to a greater extent civily (monetarily).
PERHAPS your view of the gunshops restriction is POLITICAL - so be that, and again you MAY have a qualm there.
But I would bet the gunshop owner is pro-gun and just trying to live within the bounds of present day society (liberal judges and juries) and his insurance program/premium!
After all, whats the owner gonna do if you pack heat (concealed) into his shop and foil a robbery, an assault or a kidnapping - sue you?
Maybe, but I think not.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy I bought my first Filson Mackinaw at Warshals many years ago. That was a wonderful sporting goods store with that old timey general store ambiance. Sorry hear it's no longer.
|
|
|
|
|
212 members (257 mag, 160user, 1OntarioJim, 257 roberts, 222Sako, 2500HD, 20 invisible),
1,782
guests, and
987
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,192,372
Posts18,488,347
Members73,970
| |
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|
