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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
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What would YOU do, Komrade MacLorry?
I've read Ryan's plan. A more blouted, overly hyped, blow-sunshine-up-politician's-asses, pipedream I can't recall seeing. It's simply a continuance of the current shell game, does nothing to get every American involved in the system, continues having .gov determine winners/losers based upon a convoluted tax code that promotes class and generational warfare, and gives Congress the perpetual power to tinker with it in order to cover their asses.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2003
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even though all it's doing is shifting the tax burden from the wealthiest Americans to the middle and lower classes. Should I insert a link to the tune of the Communist International melody here? I mean really, just because I am fortunate or smart or whatever that I make money means I have to pay MORE so 47-50% of my countrymen can pay NONE? GMAFB. Equality and fairness is for commies and metrosexuals...
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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.....I mean really, just because I am fortunate or smart or whatever that I make money means I have to pay MORE so 47-50% of my countrymen can pay NONE?.... Hogwash. In a study for the National Bureau of Economic Research, Boston University economists Laurence J. Kotlikoff and David Rapson have found that our all-in marginal tax rate is 40%, give or take a bit. Yes, you read that right: 40%.
Most workers will pay about that much on each dollar of income when all taxes -- federal and state income taxes, sales taxes, taxes for benefit programs, etc. -- are considered.
As a consequence, a 30-year-old couple earning only $20,000 a year has a marginal tax rate of 42.5%, while a 45-year-old couple earning $500,000 pays at 43.2%. There are some exceptions: A 30-year-old couple earning $50,000 a year, for instance, pays 24.4%, and a 60-year-old couple making $150,000 a year faces a tax rate of 47.7%.
The average marginal tax rate on incomes between $20,000 and $500,000 is 40.3%, the median tax rate is 41.8%, and the standard deviation of all of those rates is 5.3 percentage points. Basically, most of us pay about 40%, plus or minus 5.3 percentage points.http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Taxes/Advice/YourRealTaxRate40.aspx
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Those BU so called economists don't have a frikken clue as to their facts,amigo.
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Really?
Care to refute that with other economists actual data and studies?
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I wish I had $50,000 in income. I have worked my butt off all my life. I have a college degree and never broke 40,000 in income. I just retired form a job where the average work week aw between 55 and 65 hours and I still never broke the 40,000 mark. I am now retired and get $1,244 a month. I would gladly pay my fair share of taxes. And I sure as hell would never bitch and cry about having to only pay 18% of a 50,000 income.
So on your $1,244 a month income you are fine with paying another $223 per month in taxes. And you do so because you feel it's unfair for someone making a 50,000 income to pay that much more a month. Ok, I'll accept you have a great sense of fairness. But tell me, of the 50 million plus retired folks, do you think many will vote for such a tax increase on themselves? Be honest. Not going to pay anywhere near that. Our half of the farm mortgage is $850, phone, car insurance is and such $280. All of these would not have sales tax. That leaves only 144 a month for food and fun and food may or may not be taxed. Now tell me again how hard you have it. 
The first time I shot myself in the head...
Meniere's Sucks Big Time!!!
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Yeah...other posted scenarios in this thread and the fact a married couple making 20K pays nowhere near 10K of that gross in taxes.
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Facts, please. Not guesses.
Add in sales taxes, gas taxes, income taxes, Medicare taxes, property taxes, state taxes, school district taxes, telephone service taxes, and all the others.
Guessing doesn't get you there, but they studied it, and published their numbers. If you're going to refute them, doing so with numbers might be a good place to start.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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And I sure as hell would never bitch and cry about having to only pay 18% of a 50,000 income. You probably wouldn't bitch and cry about having to pay 35% of a 10 million dollar income either. Let me think about that.... Nope!
The first time I shot myself in the head...
Meniere's Sucks Big Time!!!
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Nonsense. We ALL pay ALL those taxes in addition to the oppressive tax rates we currently have. A tas System like the Fair Tax, is a tax on what we spend, so if I want to buy a friggin yacht I pay the tax and if I don't I leave the money where it can gain dividends and not get screwed with double taxation when I liquidate my profits. With a FT, payroll, medicare etc would all go away. Given the source (MSN) I'm sure they can manipulate whatever they want to keep this farce going. This isn't worth my time but I'm sure I can dig up an equally opposing article--from a credible source, refuting that BS>
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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They studied it where and what data?
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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..... Given the source (MSN) I'm sure they can manipulate whatever they want to keep this farce going. This isn't worth my time but I'm sure I can dig up an equally opposing article--from a credible source, refuting that BS> Please do and don't forget to include all taxes. And the source was the National Bureau of Economic Research, not MSN.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
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Nonsense. We ALL pay ALL those taxes in addition to the oppressive tax rates we currently have. A tas System like the Fair Tax, is a tax on what we spend, so if I want to buy a friggin yacht I pay the tax and if I don't I leave the money where it can gain dividends and not get screwed with double taxation when I liquidate my profits. With a FT, payroll, medicare etc would all go away. Given the source (MSN) I'm sure they can manipulate whatever they want to keep this farce going. This isn't worth my time but I'm sure I can dig up an equally opposing article--from a credible source, refuting that BS> The paper that isaac is claiming to be false, actually supports your position. If you'd care to look at it prior to ranting.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Don't have or want to. I read enough on my own and I am FED UP with my tax bill and with the 50% that don't/
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,510
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2004
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Are you a closet liberal who wants to see Obama reelected? If not, why are you supporting a Republican candidate who can't beat Obama?
Who did you vote for last time and who are you now supporting and what is their plan to fix the current blatant inequity in our PROGRESSIVE tax system? I never tell who I vote for as it would be a violation of principle of the secret ballot. Shame on you for asking. I don't see the PROGRESSIVE tax system as the number one problem to fix. As I said in another reply, you only need to look back to the late 90s to see that we can have a balance federal budget, low unemployment and a growing economy with the current tax system. The real problem is 25 plus years of good jobs going overseas that has now reached a critical point. The next president can either spend their political capital on fixing the real problems that face this nation or spend it on trying to give tax relief to the highest income earners. So you don't want to admit who you voted for and you continue with the "Buffet pays less than his secretary" democrat talking points. OK, I'll be left to painfully wonder until my earthly departure I guess.  The 'real' problem as you put is jobs going overseas? Really? And WHY do those jobs go overseas?........ (If you say 'slave labor', we can just go our separate ways on this issue. )
NRA Lifer
"It is curious that physical courage should be so common in the world and moral courage so rare." - Mark Twain
"Everybody has principles... until they are an inconvenience." - Me
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Address the numbers, Komrade MacLorry.
You've now got the power to solve all the nation's economic problems. What do you do? Don't you think GeauxLSU can deal with his own posts? I'm waiting for him to post the numbers he promised. Of course of you or he wants to concede that Cain's plan raises taxes on most of the middle-class then maybe we can do the "what would you do" shtick. Do you conced the point or just have more distractions or personal attacks to throw up? Mac, I confess keeping up with all the incorrect statements in this thread is difficult coupled with trying to actually get some work done and a killer cold so sorry if I missed your question. I think you asked if a couple with earnings who currently pays not tax would pay tax under 999. The answer is yes. Everybody will pay the same rate on their earnings and everybody will pay the same rate on their dividends. No deductions (except charitable contributions).
NRA Lifer
"It is curious that physical courage should be so common in the world and moral courage so rare." - Mark Twain
"Everybody has principles... until they are an inconvenience." - Me
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2006
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The paper that isaac is claiming to be false
=================
I never claimed any such thing. I stated their data was incorrect. There are many states who don't even impose many of the taxes stated and I certainly am not going to get all warm and fuzzy over a Cambridge Mass group of economists.
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward
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Joined: Apr 2004
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Right.....
So, in other words, you don't know what their study actually says and can't refute it with any facts.
Folks wonder why we can't fix the economic issues facing this nation....
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Again, we're arguing over shifting the burden of taxes rather than supporting less govt to reduce all our taxes.
Politicians are good at getting us to focus on the wrong damn thing.
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