Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors Savage 99, 300, Barnes 130 ttsx

I'm looking for practical experience from anyone who's hunted this bullet in their 300 Savage 99.
I have Steelhead's load recommendation of 42-43 grains of H4895, are there others?
How is it on tissue damage vs. cup n core 150?
My buddy wants to set up his EG and his grandpas 99F that he inherited with a single load for both. We hunt close quarters normally, so he's not thinking trajectory improvement, just recoil reduction, and only for blacktail deer. Any thoughts? Thank you.
Roy

130 TSX and 36 gr of 4198 will do 2800+ in both my R and EG (24") and drop 3 in 3/4-7/8". Kills like the hammer of Thor on deer and antelope out to 300 yards.
100% penetration, no animal has traveled more than 20 yards. As best I can count 4 deer and 9 antelope have fallen to this load from 35 yards to 300. All one shot kills.

This is a max load, so work up and don't plan on long case life.

TTSX has different shape, needs to be seated deeper (magazine), might open a bit faster. IME the TSXs shoot better groups in all my 30s from 300 Savage to 30-378 WB. Same was true vs the MRX which appears to have been dropped.

Just as a FYI, TSX/TTSXs don't work at all in 1 in 12 250-3000s. The old 75 gr X was great but is long gone.

Your buddy has a killing machine there.

Thank you. Yes, he is quite a proficient blacktail hunter, but until today has never fired grand dads 99F. We put 50 rounds thru it to make some brass for the new pet loads. Thanks, and we'll try (working up to) your loads, but is that IMR 4198 or H4198?

IMR, not there is any real difference as they are both made by Hodgdon.
Like H414 and W760 ..... exactly the same powder.

Hodgdon hasn't changed the IMR 4198 to H 4198 yet, and the IMR burns a touch faster, also the Hodgdon 4198 is one of their "extreme" line, meaning it is treated to be a lot more temperature stable than the older formula IMR.
http://www.hodgdon.com/extreme.html

Thanks Zookatx.

Marketing hype. Run em' over a chronograph and show us the difference.

Does anyone really believe Hodgdon is running TWO production lines to produce the same powder ?

As in W760 and H414 ? As Barnum said.........

"Marketing hype. Run em' over a chronograph and show us the difference.
Does anyone really believe Hodgdon is running TWO production lines to produce the same powder ?
As in W760 and H414 ? As Barnum said........."


I love it when people make unsubstantiated slams at companies and want someone else to prove em wrong.
I don't have any IMR 4198, just some H, but I have spoken about the powders with folks who know the techs at Hodgdon, and I do own some H 4350 and some IMR 4350, both less than 1 1/2 years old. They not only look different, they SMELL different. And just in case you think I am a shill or something, here are pics.

H on the left, IMR on the right:


The H is not only smaller grained, it is a different color, presumably because of the coating they put on it to make it "extreme".

Hey Zooka, don't let 'em suck you in!

Interesting bullet choice, might have to try a few in my 1920.

But I'm betting it's gonna get fueled by Rel 15 or Varget.

Keep us posted on those powders please...

Just tonite I'm thinking I may try them in a post mil 308 carbine rather than the pre mil 300 since my step daughter is left handed and the tang safety would be better for her. It's heavier, but I can load it down nice for her to shoot. I should probably buy another 300 in post mil with the tang safety as a shooter and save the 99% carbine... Arg!


Thanks, Roy

You been "BIT" !!!! Don

I'm guessing Zook knows very little about powder grain construction, deterrent coating and chemical composition. The hard facts are that any reasonable load with any powder carrying the 4350 number is safe and will produce identical results in the field, regardless of how it looks, smells it even what color it is.
I use AA, IMR and H 4350 with the same load in my 270s and insofar as the deer shot behind the shoulder with a 130 SP,...... well they all die.

If you are a 1000 yard bench rester, it's fine to be anal about getting all cases, bullets, primers and powder from the same lot and spending hours prepping the cases and so on.

For the rest of us, spending more time putting bullets down range in simulated hunting conditions, staying in shape for the hunt and proper game handling after the kill is far more important than whose name is on your powder can.

Let's be honest .... we handload for fun not because we have to. Factory premium ammo today is excellent stuff and will kill anything that walks or flies if the hunter does his/her part.

interthem, to put it plainly for you...

Anybody who interchanges ANY powders without checking manufacturers suggested loads for each powder (and preferably comparing that to a 2nd source) is a moron.

I'm glad you haven't blown yourself up yet. Have a nice Holiday season.

This post is why I don't shoot someone else's handloads. I prefer to be anal thank you.

One other hard fact I'm looking at here is that you shouldn't be throwing stones at others just because YOU are the risk taker. Reloading data is published for a reason. Follow the guidlines.

Sorry, but I have to reload. Even if I wanted to shoot nothing but factory ammo, I couldn't afford to. Thank god I find it to be fun. Thank god also that all of my reloading gear has been amortized long ago, leaving me with nought but the cost of primers, powder, and lead (and an occasional c-n-c bullet).

I have to admit that I handload for fun, because I have no excuse for not buying those factory loads in 300 Savage and Nosler Partitions that my guns shoot so well.

42 gr of Reloader 15 under 150 Sierra Flat Base Spitzers gave me excellent groups in a couple of different EG's, and velocities of ~2620 fps. Alliant says 44 is max with 165's. I probably won't go beyond that velocity with a 99, but I may cautiously work up a bit in the 1920. I have lots of Varget on hand, and will probably switch to it (with appropriate load development) when I am out of R15.

Alliant and Hodgdon also have some new powders, like AR-Comp and CFE-223, which show some good numbers in the .308. I have three .308's, so I'll probably try them in my gas guns. With caution, they might prove nice in a .300 Savage as well.

Hummm, bad guess, Interhem.
Have you ever looked at any of the Powder Burn Rate charts published by the various manufacturers? Have you ever run same-weight loads of different lots and makers of same-number powders named 4350 or 4198 over a chronograph, all other factors equal? Or compared groups and point of impact "in the field" between those powders? Do you understand the significance of the photos I posted showing different grain diameter, length, and coating of two powders that both have "4350" in their names? Do you understand that different "reasonable loads" of different powders will group in different places and in different group sizes "in the field", which can make that 130 grain .270 bullet miss, or gut shoot your deer, especially on longer shots?
Sure, you can load any maker's 4350 or 4198 in a given gun and it'll shoot a bullet out when you pull the trigger, and can be made to shoot at a velocity that'll punch a hole in a deer without blowing up your rifle; but the simple truth is they are different, some burn hotter/slower/longer than others and some are mpore resistant to temperature changes than others. If you are playing with top-of-the curve loads the difference in manufacturers can blow up guns.If you are talking hunting loads the changes can cause misses, or lost, wounded game.
Your bringing up the concept of "reasonable" (I would think that means "well below maximum") loads for hunting now, is merely a red herring from your original (incorrect) assertion that the powders were identical.
My own testing has demonstrated that the newer powders with temperature stabilization make a difference. I won't even load (untreated) Win 748 or 760 ball powder for shooting in Texas summers any more, my results were very scary, sometimes a 4000 PSI increase in chamber pressure as indicated by chronogtraph velocity and computer modeling of those results; but Big Game and Tac, two other ball powders with temp stabilization, do not get nearly as squirrly when it is 104 degrees. They do burn hotter in the summer, but not nearly so much. RL 17 same. I have corresponded with a number of shooters and hunters who have told me of their comparisons on colder weather, between the stabilized powders and the old school formulas, and they ALL say the temp stabilization works even better at keeping velocities equal in cold temps than for very hot shooting. Some are reporting variances of only 15 fps from 80 to 30 degrees with RL17.
If you disagree with these assertions of mine, do so with some evidentiary proof beyond "my gun goes bang and when the deer is hit by the bullet it dies and my gun hasnt blown up yet". That is not rational debate, it is high school red-herring debate tricks. You started this debate by saying that same-number powders in the Hodgdon family were identical - they "came from the same production line". I proved you wrong with my experience and better yet a photo. Now it's your turn to either prove me wrong with your evidence, or accept that your assertion about the powders was incorrect, not change the subject.