Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors Cartridge cutoff differences?

I have an early 50s EG or R (not original wood) and a late-50s F, both in 300 Savage. Have them taken down for cleaning as both are new to me.
The cartridge cutoff in these two rifles is very different.
In the older one (SN 651,XXX, 1951 boss stamp) it is thinner, and smoothly ramped where the bolt contacts it, and thus the bolt rides smoothly over it. Moving the bolt from unlock to full open, and back to the beginning of lockup is like glass.
In the newer F model (SN 954,XXX, can't read the boss stamp), the cutoff is fatter, and the ramp/bolt interface is so steep it takes a decent shove on the handle to get it started riding over the guide, well before the bolt lockup begins..
Also, the F's extractor is not nearly as good as its older/bigger brother's. The gap between the extractor claw and the bolt face is longer, which makes a looseness or slackness between the cartridge base and the bolt when the extractor tooth is engaged. Big brother's holds the base against the bolt without this gap. Big brother ejects loaded brass just fine, good arc, but the F wimps out on it.
It's my understanding that this is not a headspace thing but I am by no means an expert.
Is it gunsmith time for my F? Is that mutt rifle actually a spare parts rifle? Sorry, no pics yet. After work.

-Zooka

The 900 thousand F has the magazine that was lengthened for the Winchester cartridges. The automatic cutoff is very different from the old style and not nearly as effective in the overall function. Pay attention to how the cartridge is ejected as you cycle it. You are also seeing the decline in craftsmanship amongst the assemblers. I don't know that there's anything drastically wrong with the F or if it could be improved all that easily. Cycling it faster than slower usually also makes it work better.

If your F will cycle loaded rounds OK, then it should cycle empties better.

I am of the opinion if something is working................don't [bleep] with it.

Put 5 or 6 in it, shoot all of them at the range as fast as you can work the action.

If it works..............leave it alone.

JMO.

Agreed.

Interesting thread.
What I knew when I started reading the Fire-
1) I loved shooting Savage 99's and had a few
2) beer tastes good

What I know after reading the Fire-
1) +1,324,098 things about the 99 and I have a few more 99's

2)beer tastes good while reading the Fire

99 guy, That's the prob with the F that most caught my attention, most of the time with a loaded round (as in, unloading the rifle) it pulls the round on the downstroke, but then drops it across the top of the next round. That looks like it is because of the poor fitment of the extractor claw, so was wondering if that implied a safety concern.
Pics to follow.
-Zooka

Here's a pic of the F's cutoff. Note that the bolt goes back farther, and the cutoff has a steep ramp for the bolt to press down where it meets the bolt at full retraction.


Here's the older 300. The cutoff is very different, and it has a gently sloped ramp, where the screwdriver is pointing. Also, the bolt doesnt go back as far into the receiver. I guess that is because it is the older pre-308 setup.


Next question, will the two interchange? Can I swap a pre-308 for a post? Reason being there really is a significant difference in the smoothness of the action in the older one. I'm building a gun for youths/ladies and every bit helps with the timid shooters.

my guess is that it might try to eject an unfires shell before it clears the front ring if you try to use an older cut-off.

it also does not take that long to just try??? I'm not much of a tinkerer but they are your guns. Let us know what you find out..

No way. They are totally different parts.

Here's the bolt on the loading stroke. Note the brass is pressed against the bolt face.



Here's the brass being extracted. Noticed the gap between the brass and the bolt face. I can't think of any danger this poses except weak ejection. Like 99 guy said, just whack it harder.




-Z

Wow that was fast! OK gents, thanks for the words of wisdom. I might try taking the F down and honing a couple of contact surfaces between bolt and cutoff a little.
-Z

The cartridge is ejected by the little tit on the cutoff. The new style seems to wear quicker than the old ones.

Noticed that little bump, Lightfoot. It is a lot smaller than on the older one. Appreciate your help!
-Zooka

This is a very informative thread! How would you campfire trackers and Bwanas compare the 900,000 F to a Post-mil F? Is the quality of the 900,000 F much better, given what has been stated about the changes to the magazine?

Yep

Sorry 99guy, I should have included rangers. Thanks

Yep [/quote]
AARG, AARG AARG, wow cold was it.