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Old family "shoebox" photo. Typically nothing on the back to help identify! Hoping some of you history buffs can ID the uniforms, rifles and country of origin. I'd like to have something I could write for the genealogy project. Thanks and feel free to help yourselves to a copy if you so desire. Larry

Can't see too much detail except for the guy on the left. Not a mauser as you can see the opening for the mannlicher style clip to fall thru and the bolt is definately in front of the rear bridge. There also appear to be a handguard on the barrelI . Guessing it is either Italian or possiably Greek or Hungarian armed with either a mannilicher -carcano (Italian) rifle or possibly a Styer Mannlicher (Greek). I am guessing from the vintage of the rifles that the picture dates to the 1890's to the 1st world war. It could however be a latter home guard /police unit as they often used older rifles. Let us know something about you heritage ( Italian- Greek etc) and it may help to hone in on the info.

Now that I look at the uniforms more closely the hat appears to have an iron cross on it so It may well be Prussian or Austrian army with some version of the styer mannlicer rifle.

I was thinking Austrian, but could be wrong. The Maltese cross on the Hats may be the key, but I'm not up on it. A quick google search listed about a dozen countries that use Maltese Cross symbols for their uniforms.

Dan

Thanks. The side of my family this came from is mostly of German stock with a bit of French. Time for them was spent in both countries before sailing here. Larry

LGF,

My 1st thought when looking at the rifles was that they are 6.5x53R Dutch Mannlichers. These were used by the Netherlands and Romania prior to WW-II. The prior comments on the clip ejection slots are consistant with this, I believe...

The uniforms look to me like pre WW-I, but that is purely a guess. I'm thinking from what I could find... Greece-Bulgaria, Romania, Serbia...

See:

http://www.wilsonedward.com/2011/05/wwi-uniforms-greece-bulgaria-rumania.html

levergunfan-
My guess is a Gewehr 88 Commission Rifle. The rifle held by the person on the left shows the typical stepped appearance of the barrel heat-shield shroud. Below there's a photo linked from wikipedia. This rifle would date the photo probably between 1890 and 1915. A fair number of these rifles were used by the German army in the opening battles of WWI.
--Bob
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Thanks guys. I have this posted on two other forums and the consenus thus far on the rifle is the 1888 Commission model.
One fella id'd the medal on the far right soldier as the Kaiser Wilhem Centennial Medal.

Gew 88s. Belt buckle on the guy in the middle appears to have the imperial crown in the center. German or Prussian.

Odd that the wedding rings are on the left hands.

Yes, I agree, seems pretty clearly Prussian, or German state of Imperial Germany. Probably not long after those rifles were issued. The small oval piece on the hats, above the cross, are called "Feldzeichen" and apparently the colour would tell you the particular state. But of course, unfortunately, it is a b/w pic. However, they do seem to be white / light around the outside with a darker colour in the centre. That perhaps narrows it down a bit, although it still leaves larger states, such as Bavaria, Saxony and Prussia itself as possibilities.

Maybe try this forum. Although dealing with WW1, someone there might be able to narrow down which state these guys were from.

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?s=47fb6fd0518d44f30ad1cf37f39675f2&act=idx

An interesting topic, at least for us 'history geeks'.

It seems that the old shakos were 'recycled' for use by Landwehr units upon mass mobilisation at the start of WWI. So it is possible that the pic was taken around that time. Another clue is that they appear to be wearing lighter coloured tunics with dark pants. Again, colour would tell the tale, however, those could be light blue tunics that Bavarian units continued to wear. I would expect the tunics of a Prussian unit to be darker.

I have had some comments leaning toward the German state of Saxony (Sachsen Landwehr Shako Plate).

It's entirely possible. The two reasons I thought Bavarian was more likely than Saxony were 1. the relatively light appearance of the tunics in the pic. Bavarian units often retained the light blue, whereas Saxon units would be dark green. I wasn't sure that the Saxon green would appear as light as the in the pic. The other reason is that Saxon units would tend to use the Saxony pattern cuffs. The ones in the pic appear to be the Brandenburg pattern, which was the one commonly used in Bavarian units. AFAIK, the Landwehr wappen (headgear plate) would be the same for both.

Quoting from the Pickelhaubes forum: "The man on the far left is an Unteroffizier (roughly equivilent to a corporal) and has a marksmanship lanyard across his right breast."