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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,263
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2009
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We learned that criminals commit lots of crimes. We learned that when criminals are in jail, the only crimes that they can commit are against other criminals. We learned that when criminals are in jail and stay in jail, the crime rate goes down.
Our higher incarceration rate is exactly why crime has declined here for here for the last couple of decades.
I'm better when I move.
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 31,285 Likes: 9
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 31,285 Likes: 9 |
First, you cannot equate incarceration rate with crime rate. The two are practically unrelated.
Second, if you have ever been to many foreign countries, you know what high crime rates really are. Again, committing crimes and going to prison are independent of each other.
Third, (as mentioned) when you make everything from spitting to murder an imprisonable crime, you probably will have a high crime rate. If you can afford an immense prison system, you can have lots of those people incarcerated.
Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult.
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 26,337
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 26,337 |
i am glad the discussion has been engaged on a hunting and fishing forum.
we probably won't solve it, before it hits the skids, but as least the subject has been engaged.
the discussion should go forward, no matter which piece of the puzzle we choose to support. Gus, you are kidding right? something very bad has happened in our past, but what should we do to even consider the damage done, much less how best to fix it? there's a ton of reality staring us in the face. can we deal with it or not??
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 24,293 Likes: 12
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 24,293 Likes: 12 |
I have lived in quite a few countries around the world.
Violent crime stats are sky rocketing now in Europe due to multi cultural immigration. Hundreds of thousands of women and children with hacked-off limbs in African countries.
The original lib tard poster should go and walk around SE DC as a whitey and put some of his wack tard liberal beliefs to the test. Then travel to South Africa and Zimbabwe and do the same.
I think DJS is insinuating we are a gun obsessed culture and the UN should come in and take away all firearms.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,433 Likes: 13
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,433 Likes: 13 |
I know of at least 12 million criminals in the US that no one even attempts to catch. They're bankrupting the country.
βIn a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.β
β George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 26,337
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 26,337 |
I know of at least 12 million criminals in the US that no one even attempts to catch. They're bankrupting the country. OMG! the logic on these pages are killin' me. but, maybe we can elect a President that understands our pain. 
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856 |
If we stopped giving murderers and rapists life sentences and reinstated public executions, we might get somewhere. An absence of flogging results in more bums wanting the benefits of prison life.
Last edited by eyeball; 03/31/12.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856 |
What can account for our higher incarceration rates? Lack of jobs, welfare, drugs, broken families, you know, liberalism. Yet, the US has lower levels of unemployment, drug use, etc. than other nations with lower incarceration rates. And, many of these nations are more liberal (and even Socialist) than we. Multiply our published unemployment by 2 and you will g et a more accurate idea.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856 |
He also told us not to make their mistake and continue to overpopulated.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,899
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,899 |
The 2010 population of the US is 311,591,917 (US Census).
The similar global population is estimated to be 6,840,507,003.
Therefore, the US represents about 4.56% of the global population.
The 2010 US prison population is 2,418,352 (Us Bureau of Prisons)
The similar global prison population (including the US) is estimated to be 8,750,000.
Therefore, the US accounts for 27.6% of those in prison, but only 5% of the population.
Is the US more violent or criminal than than other societies?
What can account for our higher incarceration rates?
Why do other societies have lower incarceration rates, but still have less crime and violence?
Thoughts? Some of the most blatant criminals in this country yet to be hung are congresscritters....that ain't hardly no BS....
One man with courage makes a majority....
~MolΙΜΛn LabΓ© SkΓ½la~
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,828
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,828 |
Well American never in the history of the republic tolerated criminal behavior. I don't see this as a problem. Its one of the few things that Government is charged to do. Run Courts and enforce laws that we the people agree to. thou more and more junk is be enacted that we have not agreed to, the fix for that is voting in people who will revoke such things. We are also 5% of the world population and account for 25% of the worlds GDP too, what is your point?
"Any idiot can face a crisis,it's the day-to-day living that wears you out."
Anton Chekhov
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856 |
That's why brobams uncle walked, I guess. I see where people are sentenced to hard time and get off after 1/3 is served.
Last edited by eyeball; 03/31/12.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,464
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,464 |
There are a lot of reasons. A permanent underclass. A transitory society, where people are easily anonymous. An unusual history,, in that we have a an unusually large variety of races and cultures. We also don't look the other way on petty crime. And we rely on incarceration more that most western countries.
Murphy was an optimist.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856 |
Most have such misery in incarceration elsewhere criminals try desperately to avoid it. Not so here.
Last edited by eyeball; 03/31/12.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 34,261
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 34,261 |
1. We honor rebels. Few nations do that.
2. We put people in jail for trivial crimes that should be misdemeanors with nothing more than fine.
3. We use laws to control human behaviour that should be no business of the government in a free society.
4. We have attempted to federalize just about every crime and behaviour we could.
Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous
"Self-reliance, free thinking, and wealth is anathema to both the power of the State and the Church." Derby Dude
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,464
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,464 |
We have the "good fortune" of a vast criminal uneducated, underclass, for whom a stint in a stinking overcrowded cell is merely an occupational hazard, always willing to head of to San Quentin for 3- 8 years at a time.
Murphy was an optimist.
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 34,261
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 34,261 |
A large percentage of the people in prison are there because they got caught with dope, and those claiming to be "libertarian" call the loudest for their incarceration, while I can't figure out why it's any of the government's damned business what someone wants to put in their body. Not this libertarian. I don't know of any libertarian who calls for incarceration for drug use. Libertarians do call for incarceration if there is a victim of someones drug use such as a traffic accident that results in the loss of life or serious harm.
Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous
"Self-reliance, free thinking, and wealth is anathema to both the power of the State and the Church." Derby Dude
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 34,261
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 34,261 |
If we stopped giving murderers and rapists life sentences and reinstated public executions, we might get somewhere. An absence of flogging results in more bums wanting the benefits of prison life. Hey something we can agree on! I agree, instead of prison for some misdemeanors flogging and caning should be the choice. A real attitude adjustment.
Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous
"Self-reliance, free thinking, and wealth is anathema to both the power of the State and the Church." Derby Dude
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 10,285 Likes: 1
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 10,285 Likes: 1 |
We lock up people for minor drug infractions. The feds started paying the states to do that in the mid 90's. After that the prison population skyrocketed. Ohio alone added 5 new prisons in the late 90's and early 2000's running 2500 or so beds each. Capacities are at 140% on the low end and 210% on the high end.
Now that the fed money is gone we do the rip off of private prisons (massive rip off on the tax payer) And also change the law with H.B. 86 and stop locking up low level drug crimes.
The older I become the more I am convinced that the voice of honor in a man's heart is the voice of GOD.
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