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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 852
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 852 |
Just wanting to understand if the consensus here has changed...
There was always a prevalent attitude here that both sellers and buyers operated with some degree of honor, honesty, and integrity. I am proud to say that none of the deals I ever did here (or anywhere else in gunforumland) caused buyers to express remorse or disappointment. Guy did return a PF bolt body once because he didn't specify he wanted CRF and never asked for a pic, but he got his money back. Two of the many "pay some now, pay rest later" deals I did for guys who didn't have $300 or more to spend didn't work out; but all the others did and anyone who sent me $ got refund or part of what the mdse they wanted...
Was kind of surprised recently though when a guy who has been posting A Lot of WTB lisings replied that he wanted to buy my Brand New Win 70 SS CRF takeoff barrel "at a fair price" of about half what I listed it for and also wanted a die set...
We negotiated, I thought, in good faith and then this guy says he don't have the money, but can I hold the gear for him while he buys an action? Guy said nothing about needing a stock, but maybe that was to come later???
Okay, forum ace with around 2800 posts says he can't pay right now for his Want To Buy gear, but he don't mention he needs extra time to pay in his listing or in the first couple PMs...
Really wondering if you guys think this kind of tactic is kosher here? Is the Name of the Campfire Buying Game; get the lowest price firmed up, & then tell the guy you're broke but maybe next month you can pay?
Feel like I was dealing with a Professional Grifter on this deal who was not on the up & up. Have canceled deals a couple times with guys who gave me a bad vibe, especially when the money was very good.
Have come to expect anything I offer for sale on Campfire will be lowballed way down, so don't post much here anylonger; but this is a new one on me.
Doesn't posting a WTB listing imply buyer is ready to buy and has funds or trade item in hand?
Is it "good strategy" to work a seller down to the last dime, and then, after price is agreed, inform seller you can't pay for 3-4 weeks at earliest?
Is it acceptable to post a WTB and structure a deal here and then be seeking other deals for same gear on other forums?
I understand, very few guys still have any disposable income or money to spend... But it is my view that this kind of buyer pushes the envelope a lot further than is acceptable. A business that operated in this fashion would be liable under the law for Sharp Practices and possibly fraud...
Really think that a sincere and honorable buyer would be up-front with how long they expected seller to hold gear before they sent money. Held a Rem 700 action and scope base for several weeks for a guy who got paid once a month. But he didn't game me on price and then ask me to wait...
Just seems like the Grifters are getting more plentiful and obvious. Kind of a bummer to find one so actively working this board.
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 4,597
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 4,597 |
Sorry to hear your issue...I joined the 'Fire based on the majority of the members here having and their use of the principles you listed in the start of your post, with mostly acceptable results. In some forums, the actions you described would get a member black-listed ASAP, and a "don't deal with" label to boot. Hope it works out in your favor, sounds like some quality bovine fertilizer going on there, and no, not how the forum should run.
Last edited by AH64guy; 05/22/12.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,997
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,997 |
I think such behavior is dishonest. I'd like to know his board name so I can "ignore" him. If you don't want to post it here in this thread, then please PM it to me.
Jerry/AK
"Smile, God loves you!"
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,997
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,997 |
P.S.: You should terminate the deal and move on to another buyer too.
Jerry/AK
"Smile, God loves you!"
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 4,918
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2011
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If he worked you to a low price, I am sure there are a whole bunch of us that have the cash and will pay you for it. Post the item!
guns to me are like legal crack
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,369
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,369 |
Doesn't posting a WTB listing imply buyer is ready to buy and has funds or trade item in hand? Not necessarily in my opinion. Yes it means someone is searching but they may not think your price is reasonable or something may come up that takes those funds away, example emergencies... I have ran across many people on here that think they items are made of solid gold and their prices are out of this world for things...
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,821
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,821 |
Remember the rifles that you could put on lay-a-way?
�Nothing is so permanent as a temporary government program." -- Milton Friedman
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 620
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 620 |
I had a similar experience last week. travis3484 posted that he wtb a spotting scope. I sent him an email about an extra that I was not using. After sending him pics, answering many questions and getting low balled down to my bottom price, he says he will take it. I specify that I must receive funds before I ship and about 4-5 days later he sends a PM that he no longer wants it.
Because this sounds very similar to what Hogan is bringing up, I just went back and looked at travis3484's history and ALL of his 80 posts are WTB postings in the classifieds. I'm now convinced he was hoping I would just send the scope before payment was received. Nothing lost on my end but a little time, but just a warning for people to be careful who they deal with.
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 7,511
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 7,511 |
I had a similar experience last week. travis3484 posted that he wtb a spotting scope. I sent him an email about an extra that I was not using. After sending him pics, answering many questions and getting low balled down to my bottom price, he says he will take it. I specify that I must receive funds before I ship and about 4-5 days later he sends a PM that he no longer wants it.
Because this sounds very similar to what Hogan is bringing up, I just went back and looked at travis3484's history and ALL of his 80 posts are WTB postings in the classifieds. I'm now convinced he was hoping I would just send the scope before payment was received. Nothing lost on my end but a little time, but just a warning for people to be careful who they deal with. 80 posts all WTB..incredible. Maybe if guys were forced to participate in some form on this forum other that the classifieds it would curtail that crap. Admittedly my initial reason for joining the fire was to find a good LH rifle. A friend recommended the classifieds, but since then I've really realized the fraternity between everyone around all of these forums.
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,137
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,137 |
Doesn't posting a WTB listing imply buyer is ready to buy and has funds or trade item in hand? Not necessarily in my opinion. Yes it means someone is searching but they may not think your price is reasonable or something may come up that takes those funds away, example emergencies... I have ran across many people on here that think they items are made of solid gold and their prices are out of this world for things... In my opinion, those are very different situations. It's one thing for circumstances to change after posting a WTB listing, which leave the OP unable to buy at the moment. It's quite another to post a WTB listing, knowing that you don't have the funds to buy at the time of posting (and not saying so in the post). If price is the issue, it doesn't really apply to this thread because that's simply a disagreement of value between a seller and prospective buyer. JMHO.
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 569
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2001
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Sometimes it is grifting, sometimes they are hoping to find something similar at a lower price.
If the guy wants to dick around by wasting your time, rescind your offer to sell.
Life is too short to deal with people like that.
George
Shoot straight, shoot often, but by all means, use enough gun!
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,369
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,369 |
Sometimes it is grifting, sometimes they are hoping to find something similar at a lower price.
If the guy wants to dick around by wasting your time, rescind your offer to sell.
Life is too short to deal with people like that.
George Very true, no binding contracts here. Just the honor system.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 22,884
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 22,884 |
I "WTB" many, many, many things--I just don't post it because I don't have the money to buy them!
Tell the guy to move on. Hopefully you didn't lose any money on the deal.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 |
Just wanting to understand if the consensus here has changed...
There was always a prevalent attitude here that both sellers and buyers operated with some degree of honor, honesty, and integrity. I am proud to say that none of the deals I ever did here (or anywhere else in gunforumland) caused buyers to express remorse or disappointment. Guy did return a PF bolt body once because he didn't specify he wanted CRF and never asked for a pic, but he got his money back. Two of the many "pay some now, pay rest later" deals I did for guys who didn't have $300 or more to spend didn't work out; but all the others did and anyone who sent me $ got refund or part of what the mdse they wanted...
Was kind of surprised recently though when a guy who has been posting A Lot of WTB lisings replied that he wanted to buy my Brand New Win 70 SS CRF takeoff barrel "at a fair price" of about half what I listed it for and also wanted a die set...
We negotiated, I thought, in good faith and then this guy says he don't have the money, but can I hold the gear for him while he buys an action? Guy said nothing about needing a stock, but maybe that was to come later???
Okay, forum ace with around 2800 posts says he can't pay right now for his Want To Buy gear, but he don't mention he needs extra time to pay in his listing or in the first couple PMs...
Really wondering if you guys think this kind of tactic is kosher here? Is the Name of the Campfire Buying Game; get the lowest price firmed up, & then tell the guy you're broke but maybe next month you can pay?
Feel like I was dealing with a Professional Grifter on this deal who was not on the up & up. Have canceled deals a couple times with guys who gave me a bad vibe, especially when the money was very good.
Have come to expect anything I offer for sale on Campfire will be lowballed way down, so don't post much here anylonger; but this is a new one on me.
Doesn't posting a WTB listing imply buyer is ready to buy and has funds or trade item in hand?
Is it "good strategy" to work a seller down to the last dime, and then, after price is agreed, inform seller you can't pay for 3-4 weeks at earliest?
Is it acceptable to post a WTB and structure a deal here and then be seeking other deals for same gear on other forums?
I understand, very few guys still have any disposable income or money to spend... But it is my view that this kind of buyer pushes the envelope a lot further than is acceptable. A business that operated in this fashion would be liable under the law for Sharp Practices and possibly fraud...
Really think that a sincere and honorable buyer would be up-front with how long they expected seller to hold gear before they sent money. Held a Rem 700 action and scope base for several weeks for a guy who got paid once a month. But he didn't game me on price and then ask me to wait...
Just seems like the Grifters are getting more plentiful and obvious. Kind of a bummer to find one so actively working this board.
When dealing with something as moronic as this, "GFY" is perfect acceptable. Then, you simply repost the item. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 394
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 394 |
When posting a WTB, I think you should be prepared financially to buy it, but reserve the right to back off if it is unreasonably priced. Bottom line is don't post a WTB, if you don't have the money to do the deal...
Get involved. The world is run by those who show up!
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 450
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 450 |
Honor is all we really have in a transaction, the product and money exchange is all secondary. There is no honor in haggling if there is no means to finish � IMHO it is dishonest, just like haggling for something one really does not intend to buy.
�If it doesn�t feel right regardless of how much or what is involved, bail!� - Vibs (and common sense) are all we have to work with regarding internet transactions. Most of my gun transactions have been on the web - I have not been burned, disappointed a few times but most were my fault; those that were not were made right by the other party.
I have only been accused of low balling one time, I considered it an honest mistake and wanted to know what I had missed in the seller�s post/offer he refused to talk to me � I moved on. The �classifieds� only involve things, stuff we can�t take with us.
As has been said, life is too short to deal with folks without honor - drop him or anyone else like him if he/they cannot pay, want time, low ball, etc. In my experience, there are a lot more good folks than flakes on the Fire wait for them.
If things were as obvious as they initially appear . . . then men would be riding horseback sidesaddle . . . and not women. - Will Rogers
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,824
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,824 |
There are a lot more ½" rifles than ½" shooters.
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,981
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,981 |
How many on here have a draw of stuff that you posted I'll Take It and discovered later that you had miss read the classifieds...I have several of these items. They where bargain items but not really what I was looking for. It pays to read slowly when ever reading the classifieds or does it....
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 27,500
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 27,500 |
When posting a WTB, I think you should be prepared financially to buy it, but reserve the right to back off if it is unreasonably priced. Bottom line is don't post a WTB, if you don't have the money to do the deal... Agree 100%. If I ever post 'looking for' or want to by I will have some spending cash on hand. As to the OP, don't let this one bad transaction spoil your opinion, I have been party to many excellent deals here. Only one went sorta bad in the past 8 0r so years and only money back was required to rectify it (I re sold the guns iin question the following weekend for more than I had offered them for here  )
LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.
About 2016 team "R" candidates "We definitely need a crew with a sack of balls the size of hot water bottles, bloviated estrogen leaking feel-gooders need not apply." Gunner 500
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 20,892
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 20,892 |
I have dealt with a few jerks here. The worst stiffed me for $300. But, the jerks are the exception and certainly NOT the rule. I reckon I've made 200 or more transactions with the fine people here, either buying or selling.
When someone tries to do me like the guy did you I rescind any agreements and go on my way. I have been able to buy items here that I could never have found elsewhere. I believe in paying a decent price for a decent product.
"I never thought I'd live to see the day that a U.S. president would raise an army to invade his own country."
Robert E. Lee
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