Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Alaska Pebble Mine

I make a living in the Bristol Bay fishery so I'd rather not see the mine get started. But at the same time i am pretty supportive of people being able to do as they damn well please with their own land.

If the option of extracting the precious metals from this site is blocked, where does this leave those who invested in the project?

Northern Dynasty legally purchased the mineral rights to the land, they find that they are sitting on the largest gold deposit on earth let alone the other metals involved. The project is bigger than they can take on so they set out to attract investors and Anglo American buys in for a half a billion dollars. Through a joint endeavor in research and development they come up with a plan to mine the area. Everything they have done so far has been legal as well as transparent. Should they just be left holding the bag, out millions of dollars due to a long list of "what if's"?

If I was the one paying the bills I'd fight like hell to push the project through.

I make a living in the Bristol Bay fishery so I'd rather not see the mine get started. But at the same time i am pretty supportive of people being able to do as they damn well please with their own land.

If the option of extracting the precious metals from this site is blocked, where does this leave those who invested in the project?

Northern Dynasty legally purchased the mineral rights to the land, they find that they are sitting on the largest gold deposit on earth let alone the other metals involved. The project is bigger than they can take on so they set out to attract investors and Anglo American buys in for a half a billion dollars. Through a joint endeavor in research and development they come up with a plan to mine the area. Everything they have done so far has been legal as well as transparent. Should they just be left holding the bag, out millions of dollars due to a long list of "what if's"?

If I was the one paying the bills I'd fight like hell to push the project through.

...... you will see that all the investors were warned that this was a high risk venture so they know that they may not make a cent . As a commercial fisherman in Bristol Bay I am sure you are well aware of that concept.

...... you will see that all the investors were warned that this was a high risk venture so they know that they may not make a cent . As a commercial fisherman in Bristol Bay I am sure you are well aware of that concept.

Exxxxactly!


As far as the "my own land" thing goes, if you happen to personally own 40 cares someplace and you decide that a certain low spot that harbors standing water occasionally would be a perfect place for your shop or garage and you'd like to build it up and build there, look out. There are plenty of government regulations which can deter that simple act. I'm not crazy at all that money, especially big money, somehow equates to making a huge endeavor right.

The financial resources these guys have can buy a lot of persuasion in the right places. Especially in a gold mining state like Alaska.

I'm not crazy at all that money, especially big money, somehow equates to making a huge endeavor right.

The rainbow trout fishing is not easily matched anywhere. The Talarik and Upper Talarik both dump into the big lake and are very much at risk. A spill in their direction would have the potential to kill a lot of fish for a very long time...

Had a lengthy discussion with the lead attorney representing several Native corporations (Jeff for those curious) and found a number of new things to be pissed about...

Apparantly Frank the Bank smoothed some stuff for Pebble by getting the land there redesignated as having no fish or wildlife value. They did this by using a seashore format which only asked for things like "How many walrus haul-outs are there?"

It did not ask for moose or caribou so they claimed no wildlife value leaving mining as highest and best use. Getting that set to right will require a lot of work.

He suggests the best plan is to buy out the mining company by purchasing the land and setting it aside.

Seems he thinks wasting lots of money to fight it would be counter-productive compared to a simple buy-out... Especially since the price should not be high based on risks...

We just returned this afternoon from fishing the Kvichak River which drains Lake Iliamna. The rainbow trout fishing is not easily matched anywhere. The Talarik and Upper Talarik both dump into the big lake and are very much at risk. A spill in their direction would have the potential to kill a lot of fish for a very long time...

Jeff, If you take time to read the reports from both Norther Dynasty and Anglo- American you will see that all the investors were warned that this was a high risk venture so they know that they may not make a cent . As a commercial fisherman in Bristol Bay I am sure you are well aware of that concept.

Had a lengthy discussion with the lead attorney representing several Native corporations (Jeff for those curious) and found a number of new things to be pissed about...

Apparantly Frank the Bank smoothed some stuff for Pebble by getting the land there redesignated as having no fish or wildlife value. They did this by using a seashore format which only asked for things like "How many walrus haul-outs are there?"

It did not ask for moose or caribou so they claimed no wildlife value leaving mining as highest and best use. Getting that set to right will require a lot of work.

Just one more reason to despise every Murkowski that ever drew breath.

I had been in the "Let the permit process work so we do not have to pay for the to-date costs" camp... No more.

The attorney emphasized the need for a premanent solution so the mining project does not come back in five years or ten years. He suggests the best plan is to buy out the mining company by purchasing the land and setting it aside. Seems he thinks wasting lots of money to fight it would be counter-productive compared to a simple buy-out... Especially since the price should not be high based on risks...

We just returned this afternoon from fishing the Kvichak River which drains Lake Iliamna. The rainbow trout fishing is not easily matched anywhere. The Talarik and Upper Talarik both dump into the big lake and are very much at risk. A spill in their direction would have the potential to kill a lot of fish for a very long time...

Im an underground hardrock miner by trade. That is my living.

There is no way that this mine plan should go forward. We have enough destroyed watersheds and big cities that blight the land in North America.

Theres not that much land left that's undeveloped by man and machines. No matter how much gold is extracted an pristine and clean place to visit and live is far more valuable.

When it's all said and done, the mining companies go bankrupt and leave the taxpayer to pay the tab for their huge enviro cleanup messes. Reference for example Montana's Butte/Anaconda lode and Idaho's famed Silver Valley, and the chat mounds of Oklahoma, and Montana's absbestos mining.

Oil companies use that walrus haul-out trick for permitting drill sites in the Gulf of Mexico. That was exposed during the BP spill investigation. It seems to be an effective paperwork maneuver...





Uhhh, what? The state of Alaska owns the land, Northern Dynasty Minerals Limited has owned the mineral rights since 1987. Watch out if that dude starts collecting donations to "buy the land".

In recent years they have applied for water rights permits to Upper Talarik Creek and the Koktuli River for use in mining operations. A year or two ago they were fined for 25 or 30 violations of extracting water outside of the areas allowed by those permits. After those violations were more closely looked at it was found to be more of a surveying error, they were less than 100 feet at most from their mark.




We fly over to the mouth of the Upper Talarik to fish the Bow's after the Red's start spawning. The Rainbows that come up out of Iliamna and lay in the shallows of the Talarik sucking down eggs are absolutely spectacular. They are very similar to Steelhead. Some of the best Wild Rainbow fishing Alaska has to offer.

I can wade across the Upper Talarik at most any location. The amount of water they are permitted to use from the headwaters would dry out the mouth if they used their limits. If they dry these drainage's out it really will not matter if they damn the head water basins for use as tailing retention ponds. That is until the seepage is realized or the dam fails.

If I am recalling right it was the Talarik head-waters retention/sediment pond that was to be 10 square miles in surface area created by a 400 foot in height earth dam. Pretty simple plan, just dam up the top of the basin and dump their schit into it.

Sitka Deer,

On the issue of "Let the permit process work so we do not have to pay for the to-date costs" camp...;

When the Windy Craggy copper cobalt deposit in the Alsek-Tatsenshini was expropriated into a National Park, the BC taxpayers got a $144 million dollar bill which was the negotiated market value of the deposit (1993) and not the cost of development.

Last year, when NDs sister company Taseko had their environmental application turned down for the Fish Lake project (Pebble sized) by the Feds based on environmental and aboriginal concerns, there has been no mention of compensation, just talk of reapplication.

Just something to think about.

From the sounds of it, money is buying a lot of 'science'