I'm a volunteer hunter ed instructor. Part of the course is ethics,responsibility, the hunter's image, etc. When discussing dealing with anti-hunters I point out getting into arguments with them isn't going to work. Hunting is a personal moral issue. You either decide it's right or wrong for you. While I don't have any real proof in my opinion many of anti-hunters are likely to be pro-choice, for abortion on demand. These people think killing an unborn child is ok but killing animals is wrong. I honestly have no idea how you could reason with someone like that.
The Karma bus always has an empty seat when it comes around.- High Brass
There's battle lines being drawn Nobody's right if everybody's wrong
the only reason they are pro choice is they have already been born....if they are pro choice ask them if they will kill their children now no matter what age they are. they don't believe in killing a heinous criminal but will kill an unborn child...that is sick
Liberalism is a mental disorder that leads to social disease.
I really don't have a clue what to say to a pro abortion person. It is a lot like trying to talk to a rabid liberal, there is no reasoning and you are wasting your time and effort.
I really don't have a clue what to say to a pro abortion person. It is a lot like trying to talk to a rabid liberal, there is no reasoning and you are wasting your time and effort.
There is nothing to say, because it is a personal issue: he should not force an abortion on your family and you should not mingle with abortion in his.
Is it too ambitious or too naive to look for an honest politician? Or simply a useful one?
Here is a pretty good book on how to engage in dialog with pro-choice folks. I've read it, attended his training, and practice it whenever I can. It's really quite good.
I think the issue of a fetus being a living child is debateable. I understand how we all came from that process, and ending a pregnancy is a life that would have happened that never will. On the other hand, I think that some people are not fit to be parents. While there are options like adoption, I think that system is not always a good one and has it's flaws.
Simply put, I'm glad we live in a place where people can make up their own minds. Aborting a fetus (unborn child if you wish) is something that people will have to live with if they go that route. The same is true for giving birth to a baby (a living child) and giving it up. Either way, it's a crappy situation.
EDIT*** I'm not a parent. I wouldn't doubt that my opinion would change with parenthood.
A doctor I know, or perhaps knew might be dead by now, told me if you could take a baby out of the womb without it getting to breath you could put it into a plastic bag and through it away because breathing air is what made it human. There was no reasoning with him/
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation." Everyday Hunter
I really don't have a clue what to say to a pro abortion person. It is a lot like trying to talk to a rabid liberal, there is no reasoning and you are wasting your time and effort.
There is nothing to say, because it is a personal issue: he should not force an abortion on your family and you should not mingle with abortion in his.
For the most part I agree with you. I made up my mind on what I believe and generally try not to impose my beliefs on others. But I have been confronted my a few folks who got in my face and were yelling at me about our six kids. And, I mean literally yelling close enough their spray was getting my shirt wet. They were trying to convince me we should have one child at the most and all others should have been aborted.
The funny part about the whole thing was I have only father one child but raised six. The not so funny was it is no one's business how mane I raised as long as I was supporting them and raising them right and not robbing the taxpayers to do it.
There are radicals out there who want to demand everyone have their opinions. I have given up dealing with those kind of people.
I think the issue of a fetus being a living child is debateable. I understand how we all came from that process, and ending a pregnancy is a life that would have happened that never will. On the other hand, I think that some people are not fit to be parents. While there are options like adoption, I think that system is not always a good one and has it's flaws.
Simply put, I'm glad we live in a place where people can make up their own minds. Aborting a fetus (unborn child if you wish) is something that people will have to live with if they go that route. The same is true for giving birth to a baby (a living child) and giving it up. Either way, it's a crappy situation.
EDIT*** I'm not a parent. I wouldn't doubt that my opinion would change with parenthood.
Jeffrey,
You are sort of cheating in this argument. You see that, right? No?
OK. Look, your argument only makes sense if the fetus is not a human being, like us. And if it isn't a human being, then I completely agree with you. But if it is a human being, then by the logic of your argument, a parent who becomes unfit for some reason would be justified in killing their three year old child, for example. That is, of course, ridiculous. So your argument only makes sense if the fetus is not a human being. But that is the very issue under debate. You are putting your conclusion in your premises. Your argument contains a fallacy, you are begging the question. In other words, you are using circular reasoning.
and what does the Lord require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God? (Micah 6:8)
deersmeller: There is nothing to say, because it is a personal issue: he should not force an abortion on your family and you should not mingle with abortion in his.
Interesting statement. Would you say that there is "nothing to say" about this "personal issue" if he were planning to murder his child one minute after its birth?
Democracy is not freedom. Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to eat for lunch. Freedom comes from the recognition of certain rights which may not be taken, not even by a 99% vote. *Marvin Simkin* L.A. Times (1992)
I think the issue of a fetus being a living child is debateable. I understand how we all came from that process, and ending a pregnancy is a life that would have happened that never will. On the other hand, I think that some people are not fit to be parents. While there are options like adoption, I think that system is not always a good one and has it's flaws.
Simply put, I'm glad we live in a place where people can make up their own minds. Aborting a fetus (unborn child if you wish) is something that people will have to live with if they go that route. The same is true for giving birth to a baby (a living child) and giving it up. Either way, it's a crappy situation.
EDIT*** I'm not a parent. I wouldn't doubt that my opinion would change with parenthood.
Jeffrey,
You are sort of cheating in this argument. You see that, right? No?
OK. Look, your argument only makes sense if the fetus is not a human being, like us. And if it isn't a human being, then I completely agree with you. But if it is a human being, then by the logic of your argument, a parent who becomes unfit for some reason would be justified in killing their three year old child, for example. That is, of course, ridiculous. So your argument only makes sense if the fetus is not a human being. But that is the very issue under debate. You are putting your conclusion in your premises. Your argument contains a fallacy, you are begging the question. In other words, you are using circular reasoning.
A two month baby isn't viable on it's own... neither is a 85 year old that has Alzheimer's ...
Anyway, homicide is homicide, the question is is it justifiable... whether it's an 90 year old or fetus. In rule of law, justifiable needs proving in court, but fetuses don't have that right.
In human existence people kill others all the time with no consequence...
In the end it's still homicide... not some soundbite like 'pro choice'
Dave, I think you are correct in feeling many pro infanticide supporters are also anti hunters. It is much like the baby killers being the ones that show up at the anti death penalty vigils for murderers that are being executed at the State Prison. While 'down' with killing innocent infants, they are aghast at the thought of killing a person who is guilty of vicious crimes.
I think the issue of a fetus being a living child is debateable. I understand how we all came from that process, and ending a pregnancy is a life that would have happened that never will. On the other hand, I think that some people are not fit to be parents. While there are options like adoption, I think that system is not always a good one and has it's flaws.
Simply put, I'm glad we live in a place where people can make up their own minds. Aborting a fetus (unborn child if you wish) is something that people will have to live with if they go that route. The same is true for giving birth to a baby (a living child) and giving it up. Either way, it's a crappy situation.
EDIT*** I'm not a parent. I wouldn't doubt that my opinion would change with parenthood.
Jeffrey,
You are sort of cheating in this argument. You see that, right? No?
OK. Look, your argument only makes sense if the fetus is not a human being, like us. And if it isn't a human being, then I completely agree with you. But if it is a human being, then by the logic of your argument, a parent who becomes unfit for some reason would be justified in killing their three year old child, for example. That is, of course, ridiculous. So your argument only makes sense if the fetus is not a human being. But that is the very issue under debate. You are putting your conclusion in your premises. Your argument contains a fallacy, you are begging the question. In other words, you are using circular reasoning.
Even if the fetus is not viable on its own?
You are begging the question too. A person in a coma isn't viable on its own either. Does that mean we can kill that person? Of course not.
and what does the Lord require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God? (Micah 6:8)
Doesn't matter. It is still a person with feelings.
Mary Visits Elizabeth (Luke 1)
39 At that time Mary got ready and hurried to a town in the hill country of Judea, 40 where she entered Zechariah�s home and greeted Elizabeth. 41 When Elizabeth heard Mary�s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. 42 In a loud voice she exclaimed: �Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the child you will bear! 43 But why am I so favored, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? 44 As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy. 45 Blessed is she who has believed that the Lord would fulfill his promises to her!�
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