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OP
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So, the other day I saw a statistic that said that the average family of 4 with a $60k income only pays about 4% fed income tax rate. (After all the deductions our politicians have built over the years) I'm thinking that might be pretty close to correct.
So my question is how many people will be willing to go for a 10% flat tax as MAYBE proposed by the Reblican party. That would result in more than doubling the tax burden for middle class america.
On top of that it appears that there are almost a million people working in the tax prep business. Don't know how much lobby power they have but it seems like alot of jobs would quickly go away.
So, if you work in the tax prep business do the numbers for that scenario sound right....and where do you think we might head under Romney as far as taxes and the future of the tax prep business?
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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I would like to see the proof of the 4% as I highly doubt that is attainable without being creative with your taxes at $60K
Liberalism is a mental disorder that leads to social disease.
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This is my first post, but since I was working on a tax return it seems like a good time to respond. If the family had a W-2 form in the amount of $ 60,000.00 and the two children were under the age of 17 the income tax would be $ 2,194.00. This does not include the include the social security and medicare tax.
The effective income tax rate would be $ 2,194.00 divided by $ 60,000.00. This results in an effective tax rate of 3.65 per cent. The income tax was reduced by $ 2,000.00 in child tax credit.
If the children were 17 or older the tax would be $ 4,194.00.
With an effective tax rate of 6.9 per cent.
I do not have an opinion on whether the tax burden is fair or not, just posted an example.
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I didnt work this year taking care of a family illness. I claimed $48k which was a combo of rental income and some capitol gains which i planned with my tax man. End result was a total fed liability of just 2.6%...thats crazy cheap....but how it was. Thats why i figured that family rate was totally for real.
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Campfire Ranger
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I didnt work this year taking care of a family illness. I claimed $48k which was a combo of rental income and some capitol gains which i planned with my tax man. End result was a total fed liability of just 2.6%...thats crazy cheap....but how it was. Thats why i figured that family rate was totally for real. Rentals and capitol gains you're one of those rich people the turd wants to tax more. LOL
NRA Lifetime Member
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Well my tax guy must not be very darn good 
Liberalism is a mental disorder that leads to social disease.
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Campfire Ranger
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I'd love a 10% flat tax, and everybody has to cut the check each month vs. having an automatic deduction.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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and welcome to the 'fire accountant.
Liberalism is a mental disorder that leads to social disease.
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So my question is how many people will be willing to go for a 10% flat tax as MAYBE proposed by the Reblican party. Not to worry, if the Reblican party was dumb enough to propose a flat tax they wouldn't win enough elections to put it into law, or if they snuck it in, it wouldn't stay the law for long. Polls show that over 60 percent of voters support a progressive tax and would actually like to see Obama get his way on increasing taxes on those making over 250k. Even the ultra rich pay much less than the tax bracket rate. For example, Romney is only paying 13% not anywhere near the 35% rate for his income bracket. BTW the top tax bracket was 94% in 1944 and 1945 and was still 50% in 1986. The problem with a flat tax is that while it's simple and the same for everyone, fairness is a moral judgemnt, not a mathimatical one. Most people believe the Biblical teaching of to whom more is given more is required. The Ryan plan seems to be to gut deductions and keep a progressive tax structure, but at reduced rates.
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OP
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The idea of the 10% and 25% tax rates with very few deductions is pretty clear if you look at the Republican 2013 pathway to prosperity plan. Also clear is they DO NOT INTEND to reduce spending from todays 3.6t dollars. Well...I think they intend on spending $3.4t the first year
They intend on raising revenue by about $�3t per year over the next years till it matches that spending...it is very clear...per their charts. Whats unclear is how they plan on getting that revenue.
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Rentals and capitol gains you're one of those rich people the turd wants to tax more. LOL
The other part that looks like "a go" under current republican plan is that families earning under $200k per year will be exempt from taxes on capitol gains, dividends, and interest. So here I sit....not working....and pay nothing. While my neighbor who works his ass off and wants to try and get his house paid someday and get his kids some schooling after high school gets a 10% flat tax when they take away his deductions. Thats what he gets for earning a 1099 in th plan. Doesn't seem real fair to me. I'm feeling bad for him.
Last edited by kraky111; 09/17/12.
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A tax plan with different brackets is not a flat tax, so it would have general public support. However, I doubt they'll end up just two brackets. Cutting deductions is where it gets tricky. Everyone with a lot of kids want's to keep the dependent deduction and everyone who gives a lot to charity wants to keep that deduction and so on, which is why Romney/Ryan are keeping quiet about what deductions they would cap, reduce, or eliminate.
How to raise tax revenue is based on the belief that a simplified income tax and smart rather than punitive regulations will allow the economy to grow, which increases revenue. It happened under Reagan. In the longer run the only way to fix the federal spending problem is to pass a workable balanced budget amendment. Otherwise, we'll be back to deficit spending with the next election.
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You are right that two tax brackets arent a flat tax....but compared to what we have today...without deductions is pretty close.
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Campfire Outfitter
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I don't care if the rich or poor pay more or less. I only care about what I have to pay.
Let me keep more of my money and you've got my vote. Try and feed me some BS gimmick where you tell me I'll pay less but actually I'll pay more and you can go to hell
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Campfire Outfitter
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One thing I do know, Romney is so vague in explaining his tax cuts, I really have no idea who will be paying more and who will be paying less.
In an interview with NBC's "Meet the Press," Romney said he would offset his proposed 20 percent tax cut for all Americans by eliminating loopholes and deductions for high-income earners. He argued that his plan would in effect lower taxes for middle-class Americans while keeping tax rates the same for wealthy Americans.
"People at the high end, high-income taxpayers, are going to have fewer deductions and exemptions. Those numbers are going to come down. Otherwise they'd get a tax break," Romney told NBC. "And I want to make sure people understand, despite what the Democrats said at their convention, I am not reducing taxes on high-income taxpayers."
Romney argued that limiting deductions and exceptions would keep government revenues up and "encourage more hiring" and "encourage growth" in the economy. He said he wants to make "sure we don't put any bigger burden on middle-income people."
But asked about "the specifics of how you get into this math," Romney declined to offer any additional details, suggesting the "principles" of his plan should be enough for Americans to judge his tax proposals.
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I don't care if the rich or poor pay more or less. I only care about what I have to pay.
Let me keep more of my money and you've got my vote. Try and feed me some BS gimmick where you tell me I'll pay less but actually I'll pay more and you can go to hell That's pretty much how I felt about Cain's 9-9-9 plan. Lots of retired folks at the fire, but they didn't seem to comprehend just how much Cain's plan would tax them, even their savings that they had already paid tax on with the 9% federal sales tax. Only when voters started believing Cain was a womanizer did he drop like a rock in the polls.
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Campfire Outfitter
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lol Yeah, people would rather pay a flat 15% tax than be taxed at 25% but have an effective tax rate after deductions of 10%. Not sure if people just are that bad at math or they just don't care enough about their money to figure it out. Effective tax rate chart. http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=456
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I don't think the tax prep business will ever be affected by rate changes.
Are we talking effective tax rate or marginal tax rate? Two different critters.
Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous
"Self-reliance, free thinking, and wealth is anathema to both the power of the State and the Church." Derby Dude
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OP
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Well...if you take away all or most the deductions you wont need much help doing taxes. Remember the debates when Perry said hed have you doing your taxes on a postcard? So much for HR BLOCK etc.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Income taxes started out on the postcard but they didn't stay that way for to long. To many special interests. I'm not worried.
Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous
"Self-reliance, free thinking, and wealth is anathema to both the power of the State and the Church." Derby Dude
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