Home Forums Reloading Varmint Rifles MV potential of 40 grain bullets out of a 223?

and folks constantly tell me how RL 7 is NOT a good powder for 223s....here's an example of the MV potential over a chronograph... shot at about 4500 fp altitude..



Bolt action and worked up... current RL 7 data ( if you can find it any more is pretty anemic...and pressures are listed at about 45K to 47000 CUP.. when the pressure limit for the cartridge is much higher...

shot via a bolt action, 26 inch barrel, 1 in 12 twist..

35 grain NTX Hornady and 35 grain Nosler Lead Free Ballistic tips, will fly 200 fps or so faster

Seafire: Now that is SMOKIN!
Once adjusted for true velocity at the muzzle that should be just at or just over 4,000 F.P.S. - shouldn't it?
How was the accuracy at that speed?
I have never tried RL-7 in any of my 223's but if accuracy is good and primers aren't to flat (or blown loose?) then maybe I will give it a shot?
At that speed and with that size bullet a Ground Squirrel struck by it should just about vaporize, one would think.
Be careful out there.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Dude, I thought you were the REDUCED loads guru.

Seafire, my hunting buddy has loaded 28 grains of 2200 powder and chronographed 40 vmax at 3800 in a 22" barrel. That bullet is absolutely a vapor maker when shooting sage rats and really tears up a rockchuck.

I'm a big RL-7 fan in the .223 with 40g bullets also.

Mine are just a tad slower than Seafire's but accuracy is great and that combo kills a lot of stuff......like deer.

I stuffed some RL-7 into my Rem 700 VSSF 22-250 with a 35g VMax just to see what the chronograph would register. High velocity was 4411fps with an average of 4294fps. Makes rock chucks and crows flat out disappear. A wee bit tough on the barrel so my prized VSSF doesn't get these loads often but just once in a while.

Just bought a 5 lb jug of RL-7 for a Rem 700 Varmint and an AR. Love the stuff.

SEAFIRE !! NOW you are just ticking me off. You come up with this a day AFTER I come home with 16 pounds of H335 !!
Is RL-7 very heat sensitive ?? How are the groups ?? Suppose you would PM me your load data on that....PLEEEEAASE ??

Well for those inquiring minds who want to know..

My first priority is accuracy....if this load wasn't accurate, I wouldn't be sharing it on line... so yeah, RL 7 is accurate..in both the 223 and the 22.250....

as always I work up.....

and Dave, I do download varmint rounds for the optimum efficiency at distances that I will engage pesky varmints in..which is usually 200 to 250 yds tops, that 90% plus are taken...

but then, I have ONE rifle sitting around while shooting, that is zeroed and set up for these fast 40 grain loads, for those pesky irksome ones, at longer ranges, or the ones that are busy eating their buddies guts that just got wasted...

for some reason, I like Red 'cannibal' mist that is more righteous than just plain old Red Mist.....

35 NTXs with Rl 7 can hit 4200 fps in the 223... and in the 22.250 with RL 7 it can be ran at 4500 fps plus...

when I usually set up for volume sage rat shooting, I set up two rifles with Blue Dot or SR 4759 loads for 200 yds and under....and alternate between them...

then, I have one for those long range shots...

and then a rimfire of some sort...

my shooting bench is the hood of the old 4 Runner usually..

Dude, i gotta pick up some of that RL 7.

I haven't played with the light pills in the .223, but RL7 is one of my favorite powders and does very well with the 221 f-ball with 50gr v-max.

Pressure = velocity.

What did they used to say? Gas, grass, or ass, nobody rides for free..

As always, thank you for your biased, informative derogatory response...

something else you can criticize without having any hands on experience with...

you see 'pressure problems' on brass that can do this, and be reloaded safely, 10 times plus with no issues?

just some more 'Orange County' wisdom you graciously spread around based on your like or dislike of fellow forum members...

New Berger manual shows seven loads with a 30 grainer over 3,900 (some right at 4,000) with a 24" tube, 3,900 with RL-7; the 40's top out at 3,700, FWIW.

Seafire, you're a kook. Plain and simple..

You're gonna end up looking like Wiley Coyote after some Acme dynamite.


Travis

I used to load a 20 inch .222 up to 3500 ish with the 40 v max and a way over book max load of 21.5 grains of reloader 7. Six inches of barrel might get you 180 fps or 3690 ish. With more case capacity and the ability to run more pressure I could see you getting the velocity that you claim and still having good accuracy.

I used to own a Shooting Chrony. It lied all the time. Liked to read a couple hundred FPS fast.

It eventually went for a ride over Winchester Ridge.

That is my guess as well.

I've owned three Chronys. The first one (many years ago) was pretty good, but the last one varied over 5% depending on light conditions. At its most accurate it was 2% over two different Oehlers. Eventually it started giving readings 10% over reality.

Would love to know the powder charge.

from a guy with the word 'Loco' in his handle...

makes sense to me...

People on these forums tell me I am nuts when I load ammo below book maxes, because it isn't in a manual they use.. and I am crazy when I explain I load it to fit the distances being shot...200 yds and under...

then one gets more MV than others think they can get, and you're call a kook in that direction...

my chrony is a mid 90s vintage, ( if that matters), but compared to a friend's Pact Chronograph, isn't much variation between his readings and mine.. in fact he picked up a Shooting Chrony for himself, when he saw how little time it took me to set mine up.. and he thought that was kind of useful when he only wanted to chrony a load or two... so some of it must be the equipment's fault?

and as far as pressure? well, I have plenty of 223 brass that has been loaded well beyond 10 times using this charge of RL 7...
all of my brass is put into a 'lot' and then spends its life in a zip lock bag, with 3 x 5 cards in it, that show the entire history of the brass.. from the month it was put into service, a list of the charge wt and powder, the bullet, the primer, whether it was necked sized or full length sized, the date loaded... and then on the back the history of each time the batch was annealed, and a history of any brass lost and the reason for it..

so there is no guess work on the history..

and I work up these charges, just like a basic manual tells us to do...

so given the life span of the brass, and paying attention to it, I have no problem at all with it being safe...

when folks do ask for the load charges, I do it via PM, if I chose to send it..with a disclaimer that it is safe in all of MY rifles, AND to work up in theirs, AND this is for a bolt action rifle...

My belief on pressure for my own load uses, is if a load works in brass that is reloadable beyond 10 times, then I personally call it good...

well JB.. respecting your experiences.. I'll respond since the question is from YOU... and do it publicly instead of via PM..

The correct SAAMI pressure for the 223 is supposed to be?

I find using Rem, Winchester and Lake City brass, pretty much all fall in the same durability, and velocity potential.. I do find Federal Brass does take less powder to produce the same results...

Long ago, I worked up these loads with the 40 grain bullets, and have used them with the Nosler, Sierra and Hornady V Max bullets..all available locally or thru the internet..

Reference for my starting work with this long ago, I'll refer to page 95 of the Hodgdon Manual # 26.

top of the page it lists a max charge of 24 grains of RL 7, for a 40 grain bullet, and lists a pressure for that load as a well below max listing of 45,000 CUP...

working up in bolt action rifles ( I own multiple bolt action 223s.. and if I thought the throat was a little tight, I have had a gunsmith open them up... my standards being able to accept a round that is as long as the magazine allows...)

so with the old adage of 'work up' to maximum, that is exactly what I did...

they proved accurate, and then after that I chrony something to see what kind of MV I am getting... THAT IS MY STANDARD PROCEDURE FOR ANY NEW LOAD...

after that I have a requirement that the load must be reloadable in a brass 10 plus times, to rule out any pressure problems...

this load has passed that scrutiny.. and has been serving me fine for many years...

so a charge that is working in ALL of my bolt actions, may not be the same in other guys equipment... but then that is the responsibility of each handloader to determine that in THEIR equipment...

but this is what it gives me and this is how I got there, and this is where my source of reference was to work upon from there...

I hope that answers your question John...

I don't think anyone even thinks about RL 7, in a 223, because it is a long forgotten powder by many reloaders...
they certainly don't think about it in a 22.250...

but then with a 40 grain bullet for the 22.250, I call attention to Lyman Manual # 47, page 208, the fastest loads listed with a 40 grain bullet, is BLC 2 and RL 7... both yielding an MV of 4130 fps...

one charge is 40 grains ( BLC2) and one is 33 grains...( RL 7).. RL 7's data is within the pressure range of the 22.250, plus I found it was more accurate in my rifles than the BLC 2 load data... In fact I have found RL 7 very accurate in all 5 of my 22.250s.. with bullet weights from 35 grain NTXs, 36 grain Barnes VG to 60 grain bullets from various manufacturers, to even the old 63 grain SMP Sierra...

best regards
seafire