Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Deer Hunting Looking for education on Buck / herd management

Here's another one of my "trophies" that will probably get your knickers in a twist.........




I shot this doe last year on a friends ranch......yes, she is laying in a food plot..........you see that ridge behind me in the photo??? I was sitting near the top of it when I took the shot........killed her from 588 yards........BECAUSE I COULD........yes, I could have gotten closer......killed one in the same food plot the year before, at less than 30 yards, with an iron sighted revolver......might try to kill one with a rock next year....and NO, I don't care if it's legal in New York!!

From the looks of those antlers, you could be hunting next door to me. I have killed several over the years that look a lot like that. miles

Baiting deer is also completely illegal here and always has been. Surveys are done by DEC from time to time to get hunter feedback as to how they feel about baiting and feeding and the results always show the vast majority of hunters here consider such practices "unsporting". Unfortunately, those practices, along with selective breeding/trophy management/ etc. have been accepted for so long in much of the South that I doubt most have ever really hunted truly wild deer, in truly wild places in their life. But hey, if shooting farm animals is what blows your skirt up and makes you feel like a bonafide hunter, knock yourself out. Personally, I think it's pathetic {akin to fishing in the ponds at a fish hatchery} and want nothing to do with it. I'll take my hunting grounds and my game in as close to a completely natural and untampered with state as I can possibly get thank you.

Please read more than one biologist's approach to improving your herd. The best biologists don't always agree. I damn sure don't agree with our TX Parks & Wildlife biologists on the regulations in my county.

stumpy

1) do you shoot every deer you see?
2) if so, conversation over.
3) if not, then you must have some decision making process for which to take
4) I am asking for opinions on decision making processes. You are clearly passionate about something. It really isnt clear what you are passionate FOR as opposed to what you are passionately against.

I do know that you are painting with some extremely broad brush strokes and have been since your first post in the thread.

I cant find where, in any way shape or form, anyone has mentioned penning or fencing or breeding deer here. I certainly didnt mention penning, farming, or baiting deer in my OP.

I hunt wild deer on a small farm boud by other small farms. Lots of the guys on these farms are talking about self-imposed minimum antler point restrictions. That is the decision process. the goal? more deer with bigger racks. You see this as bad? OK then.

I questioned their strategy, thinking that MY idea would result in more bucks with bigger racks. You see this as bad? Ok then.

I also would like to NOT experience reduction in deer herd size, and honestly put this as a higher priority than more bucks with bigger racks. They dont. You??? Dunno.

There are no true trophy class B&C deer within a gagillion miles of our farm. If there were, they'd be shot on a farmer cull permit in august or sept long before I sneek around with my musket.

A trophy is a good hunt for a nice deer that you are proud of and eat. And boy do I like to eat them.

I appreciate the input thus far from those who directed me to certain books, articles, etc. and who explained the flaw in my logic/argument.

Blackheart, honestly, you've got a lot of baggage you are bringing to this discussion, and you are tossing some pretty directed insults at guys you dont know from Adam.

Where you at? The regs in Fayette County have been more than a dream come true!

[/quote] The truth is, there are already too many deer in many areas across the country and it's no different here. NYDEC has all it can do to keep the herd within carrying capacity in much of the state and simply hasn't been able to in some areas. We sure as hell don't need any restrictions aimed at increasing the size of the herd. Furthermore, we've already had an experimental "pilot area" with antler restrictions in place for six years now. While it is true that there has been a slight increase in the numbers of 2.5 and 3.5 year old bucks harvested in the pilot area, the overall buck take has decreased dramatically and the number of "trophy quality" bucks has remained nearly unchanged. What it all boils down to is there are fewer hunters filling their buck tags and no more getting those wall hangers they want so badly. In other words it's been a "nobody wins" situation. [/quote]

1- Carrying capacity, yes we are at max in SOME areas and almost void in others . Adirondack state park has zero doe permits because of this while the 4 areas in the state I hunt 2 of them are virtually unlimited doe tags 1 of them I can get 2 permits in and the other I can get 1 in, to that I can kill a doe with my bow as well as my muzzle loader. Carrying capacity and how the herd is made up are two different things and just because there are a lot of deer does not mean there are a lot of bucks. In 3 of those areas I hunt if I don't see 15-20 does a hunt I don't see one. The southerntier region is loaded with deer but the buck to do ratio needs to be worked on .

2-One of the areas I have hunted since 1976 is in the Pilot area and we are killing bigger deer here . What you failed to acknowledge though was the fact that hunter participation is also down in these areas which would lead to less buck take. My camp used to hunt 47 guys every season since 1954 when my Dad joined since 2006 we are down to 23 . The reason for this, guys can't afford it in this economy. Every member we lost was because they were tradesmen and lost their jobs and are now working for half the pay they were making just to keep there homes and feed their kids.We are all blue collar workers. The same holds true for the other camps in that area.

"blackheart
Feeding deer is completely illegal here because it is a proven fact that concentrating deer at feeders spreads disease like CWD. So much for the "management" crowd doing what they do because it's "good for the deer". As I said, most of what is done is simply to make it easier to kill deer and particularly larger bucks."

This is also not true. Legal in Sullivan and more will follow because of this.Please provide the governmental facts facts you so deliberately say are the case.Here are mine.
http://assembly.state.ny.us/leg/?de...y=Y&Actions=Y&Text=Y&Votes=Y

Now the subject of a truly wild experience. Tell me how far from the truck or a road do you usually hunt? I have a feeling that what you consider a truly wild experience and what I consider a truly wild experience to be are totally different.

The OP did not ask for what you are providing so unless you are going to answer his question Shut the [bleep] Up!

Or

Keep posting bullchit and I'll go out of my way to prove you wrong . Us NY's get a bad enough wrap as it is and your making it worse for the rest of us .
If your a meat hunter thats fine, you want to do it on foot thats fine too, go right ahead and do it that way I don't care how you do it and I'm not gonna tell your wrong for doing it that way . But don't think I'm gonna sit back and have you tell me that the way I want to do it is wrong either. I have seen the proof on both sides and my likes don't coincide with yours. You go ahead and have your wild experience while listening to the cars drive by.