Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Heard a guy who opts out of social security.......

He claimed the attorney fees at the end of the year were cheaper than the tax and he was able to move funds where he wants them. Anyone hear of this, or was I hearing bs?

The legal fees might be less but if you lose, you pay them PLUS the tax, plus interest, plus back taxes, plus penalties.

He said he is audited every year and wins every time....but spends a fair bit on his attorney.

A few years ago a liscensed minister could opt out.I don't know if that's still possible.

It would seem you'd have to be earning big dollars and/or self employed paying both sides of the payroll/self employment tax to even begin to make such a thing worth considering-- and that's assuming this is truly legal.
And all the trouble just for the opportunity to save & invest the difference between the non-paid dollars and the legal fees on your own? Now? In this investment environment?
IMHO, by far most people would be better off gambling that SS will still be there...

It was legal for ministers,no legal fees necessary.

If he's doing it out of principle, I kinda understand. If he's doing it for financial reasons, he's gotta be losing money. Unless SS really won't be around for him. Then every penny saved is a penny saved.

But that's a big if. A few of them

I don't remember all the details but the classification may have also included deductions.I remember the guy telling me he could deduct anything bought for his home including toilet paper.

Most IL teachers aren't in the SS program...

I understand that there's a movement among radical libertarian types to not acquire SS numbers for their children from the start, and then to teach them never to enter the system. Some of these kids are now adults and have never received a Social Security card, and apparently have had rulings that said they cannot be denied employment based solely on not having one. Not sure if any of it's true, but I've heard of such cases through the grapevine.

I, myself, didn't get a Social Security number/card till I was fifteen or so when I got my first paying summer job, the employer of which insisted on my having a SS number. Didn't see any harm it getting one back then, and went ahead and did so.

Been researching this question and discovered that Old Amish Mennonites are exempted from paying the Social Security contribution since their religion forbids them from participating in any form of insurance, public or private, considering it a sin which demonstrates lack of trust in God. They are the one and only exception actually written into the Social Security law. So, if you want to avoid participating in any way you need to officially convert to Old Order Amish Mennonitism. Don't let the IRS catch you driving any sort of motor vehicle, though. Horses and horse drawn carriages are fine.

My wife's dad was a minister. He was paid his gross salary by the church with no deductions and then paid his own fed., state and local taxes and SSI contributions quarterly as if self employed. He was required to include into SSI contribution the average market rental value of the free church provided parsonage where he and his wife lived as part of his income.

The minister who was at our church when I got saved (our "talks" prior to my conversion were something to behold) opted out of social security. Problem was he had a heart murmur and was having it repaired. He died on the operating table at age 39. He left a widow and three small children. No life insurance. She made it but it was a struggle, both financially and mentally. She struggled with hard feelings toward the man she adored.

Paul's been dead about 30 years and Ellinor, his widow, never remarried. I don't think she has ever had a date.

One day I'll tell about the night Paul was visiting me and trying to get me to see the error of my ways. Ellinor feared for his life and called him three times to check on him.

I loved Paul Nelson more than a brother. I had to call him one night and tell him that he was right and I was wrong. He yelled out, "Hallelujah!" for he knew that I had surrendered and in the words of C. S. Lewis, I had to admit that God was God.

Same with most teachers in Texas as well. I taught for 19 years and only paid self employment on my little cattle operation. I am now only paying SS.

On top of that, if I try to collect a retirement for both, SS will deduct my teachers retirement off the top of any retirement check from SS. Henceforth, I will never get back any I have paid in in my lifetime(way over 40 quarters).

I am no longer in the SS system.

Ministers must have a legitimate "conscientious objection" to receiving govt aid, and if so have a one-time opportunity upon being credentialed to opt out of SS.

Most ministers file as self-employed.

I have opted to continue to pay SS, but not expect to see a cent in return , smart huh?

Gunner

Paul sounds like a great guy but no one ever talked to him about term life insurance it appears. I'd opt out of SS in a heartbeat but would never be without term life insurance to keep my wife covered if a bull elk gores me to death.

Folks with families and no term life insurance are taking a huge risk. Give up pizza or beer and buy a policy, it is very cheap.

siskiyous6, that's nice to put that out there with nothing to contribute to the question at hand.