Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Winchester Collectors 1886

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=335288075

Am I missing something? It looks like a lot of wear and is the butt factory?

45-70 lightweight takedown,semi deluxe!! the pistol gripped stocks without checkering are quite rare ,the condition its in is not to bad, i would say its a reasonable price !!!! Don

Thanks. I have never seen that stock before. I knew someone would know. I should have said it looks like it was toted a lot from the underside wear. It caught my eye because it looks like a Model 71

The model 71's evolved from 1886 lightweight rifles, they used the basic frame and changed the flat mainspring into a coil spring. Don

I think those are more desirable than 71's when in 45-70.

Absolutely, the71's are nice rifles and make nice trading fodder. But the 86's are highly desirable. Don

Those lighweight barrels are cool!!!! They look more like the end of a .410.....

I usually hang out in the Savage forum but look at Winchester stuff from the to time. Nice looking rifle, but when you compare wear on the wood against the metal, I'd bet my last dollar the stocks are refinished.

It also appears that the rear sight and its elevator might not be correct. Still gorgeous though.

I'm also a little concerned about the butt plate. Looks like it might be plastic.

They are "HARD RUBBER" on the lightweight 1886 models. Don

Can be hard to tell from pics, but the listing party did take some good pics. I've got to agree with Loggah, that rifle is danged near 110 years old, and that being the case, it is in really nice shape IMO. The wear to the bottom of the receiver doesn't really appear to be carry wear to me. It almost looks like it's some type of scratching like it had rubbed on something. Same with the bottom of the barrel.

As I recall, I believe that all of the LW's had the hard rubber shotgun butt and this one appears original to me. Lettering is sharp and crisp so I don't believe there's been any metal refinishing. Stock's are also very nice, but you can see small dents and dings from use. I don't, however, believe that the wood has been refinshed as fit to the upper and lower tang, as well as the front of the receiver appears to be very good.

gun has been redone in my opinion. rear stock for sure has been redone you can see the screw head next to ser# where they had it apart. blue does not match at all. nickel steel barrels don't hold blue for nothing you can see where the color from barrel to rec does not match the wear on rec does not match look how white the lever is. I would be willing to bet it was touched up. you can also see near the take down point where blue was added over a pitted area dead give away.

I have an NIB 1886 SRC Browning for sale if any one is interested. I have not been actively trying to sell it.

I dont believe its been redone either, ive owned over 20 of these rifles,and one of my friends has over 30 deluxe model 1886 rifles, i have looked at a few of them. no signs of sanding, all the fits are good with the wood proud to the metal. There are dings and a few imperfections in the wood, the bottom of the reciever shows normal handling wear and the barrel bluing is normally a different color then the receiver because of the different steel composition. Don

I'm not seeing any signs of sanding on that stock either, and you typically will in a corner if it has been messed with. You also can't take much off of those old winny's before you have the metal sitting above the wood. I guess I would have to see more than a burred screw to say it had been re-done.

I did look again for signs of bluing in some pitting as that would be a dead giveaway of a touch up. But, I'm not certain what pic smokey is looking at. I do see, in pic 7, some spotting on the barrel, but this appears to me to be some "freckling" in that area, and not covered up pitting. Small area's of freckling, I would exptect to see on a rifle of that vintage.

look at the bottom of the rec right at the take down point. the wear is not even. a rifle will have even wear on the blue and that is right at the balance point where you carry it and the wood does not have no where near the wear as the metal. edges of the rec have no blue so we know the gun has been used. looks to me it has new wood and butt plate added they have 0 marks and we all know if you use a gun it will have a few small marks no matter how careful you are.

Yeah, I would agree that that does look odd, but I'm not seeing any pitting on the TD side. That is right at the balance point, but again, to me, that looks more like finish scratching than it does carry wear, simply because it is an odd pattern. I would expect to seen more of a rounded pattern on the wear from carry, and further up the sides. I'm wondering if that wear was somehow caused when the rifle was taken down and possibly transported?? It would be nice to know any history on the rifle, and of course it is one, that until it is in your hands you probably won't know for sure. I would also agree that the buttplate almost looks "too perfect", but if you look at the rifle as a whole, IMO, it hasn't been used horribly hard. Bluing wear to the high spots on the action, scratches from something, but other than that, it is very nice, and I see nothing indicating a re-blue to me. I just seriously question how much actual "use" it has seen. Case coloring can be fragile, and just sitting in a corner for years with the sun shinning on it can cause it to silver.

Maybe I've just seen too many 3/4 wore out 86's over the years, but I'm still not convinced it's been messed with. I sure would like to see it in person.

A good stock refinish will not show sanding marks. Heavy sanding is a definite no no. Dents, to the maximum possible extent, are steamed out, and you never touch sanding block to any portion of the stock that borders metal. Also, the wood on the wrist actually looks lower than the upper and lower tangs. There are several dark spots on the stock that look like steamed out dents that were oil soaked prior to refinish. Finally, being two completely different mediums, I can't see how after a century the hard rubber butt plate and stock still coexist at the same level. Wood usually changes over time and exhibits a less than perfect fit between the butt plate and stock; regardless of how well it was originally fitted.

PS - nice rifle but obviously not a 5,000-dollar nice rifle.

It is listed at $8250 on their website http://www.americanarmsandantiques.com/listings.php?id=701