Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Beware of dealing with this man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

From where I sit, dirty laundry should NEVER be washed in public.
Just look what happens. This thread is a classic example of why it should never happen. People taking sides. People getting mad over a commercial transaction that was done outside of this Forum. I don't care who's right and who's wrong. Settle it privately so this kind of crap doesn't get public scrutiny. Just look at all of the hard feelings that have arisen here.
There is absolutely no way that a commercial transaction that went sour should ever have been brought up on this Forum!!!!
Don

CatnTheHat, I agree you are right, he is a standup guy, I am not upset over this, just disappointed. I have had only one money order cash, geez, I am pretty sure that he didn't cash it, so I am just goingto take care of it. No questions asked. Bart if you want the other 50 bullets shoot me an email. I am not going to say not to do business with him or not, Bullets were fine, probably even better for someone with a 25-06. This has just gotten out of hand for all. We will go our seperate ways and I kind of hope the moderator will lift the ban on any that were banned because of this. Bulletsmith knows his business, and would have a lot to contribute to this forum. Les

Very stand up,that say alot about Les!

Mods did nothing to anyone's account. Surprised it even came up.

Will say not too happy about stuff not originating on 24hourcampfire being aired here. That and the posting of personal info, for ANY reason, is not cool.

That said, suspect there is more misunderstanding than maliciousness on all sides, which makes all this brouhaha even more sad. Suspect all parties came out a bit tarnished as a result.

Can you say handled poorly? I can.

I think it's time for somebody to buy a round and change the subject.

Rick

Can we lock this after Bulletsmith and I give a satisfaction finished? Les

It's too bad all of this mess had to happen to finally get a transaction from July resolved. The ironic part is, the same feller who attempted to go above and beyond in getting a customer something fast through his distributer ended up making some friends of the same customer mad by the tactics used to finally get paid for the deal.

Was someone ACTUALLY banned over this??? I sure hope not. If so, Rick needs to take a hard look at this one....

eta-oops, Mr. Bin posted while I was typing....

I have no love for this thread and if everyone agrees, would be more than happy to put it out of its misery.

Any objections? If not, have all parties say when, and we'll pull the trigger.

Rick

PS: Banned???? This is how rumors get started. Mods squirmed along with everybody else as this thing writhed through its convulsions, as usual.

AMEN!

I second that one.

Spot

Guys I�ve been away from this for a while and it took a long time to read it all. Up front I will tell you that I consider Richard and Kirby to be my personal friends of the highest degree. Everyone else got their say so this is mine.

I�ve done business with both for quite some time now and will continue to do so. That said I just find it humorous that some of what has been written, was written. There are really only 3 people that really know what happened, but given what has been posted here, there seems to be an agreement amongst them that the following happened.

� Les wanted the bullets
� Richard didn�t have them in stock
� Kirby had some and to help Richard, and to maintain the customer service they both strive for, Kirby sent the bullets to Les that he wanted. There is no US distributor or sales outlet for Wildcat bullets. As Kirby said, he happened to have some for his personal guns.
� Les sent Kirby a money order for the bullets and shipping. This can be proven.
� It�s my understanding the bullets were to be billed from, and payment sent to, Richard.
� Kirby cashed the one money order and immediately sent Les the amount for the bullets and told him that he needed to pay Richard.
� Les received Kirby�s business check and cashed it. This can be proven.
� Les never did pay Richard and Richard contacted him and tried to get payment. He repeatedly tried and thus started to get upset. I would have too. as Les had the money the minute he cashed Kirby�s check. He should have just sent a second money order to Richard. Hell, it could have been a personal check and Richard would have been fine with that.
� After repeated tries to receive payment, Richard told Les that he would take it public if he didn�t receive payment. Les admits that at the end he just put Richard�s e-mails in the junk bin and deleted them.
� Then this thread was started.

How Richard handled it is his business and I understand how he feels. I�m also a small business owner and would not write off the same amount unless forced to. Would I have handled it exactly the same way? Maybe, maybe not, but when I was Richard�s age I�d have done the same thing plus I�d have driven to Les�s doorstep and got my money.

Even though only 3 people knew exactly what happened I was amazed to see the typical responses attacking Richard and calling him, and his friends names. Some even joked about Les not paying Richard and that�s pathetic. Richard even realized this was getting out of hand and said he had stopped posting to let it settle so it could be straightened out but the posts kept coming and people who knew nothing about everything still attacked Richard. Most said they didn�t like how he had handled this but how they responded, in my view, was handled worse.

Les says only one money order was cashed and that�s because he only wrote one, to Kirby. He never paid the balance due that he had been told repeatedly about, to Richard.

Les says he will write a second money order and he�s called stand up�.. He�d have been more of a stand up guy, to my way of thinking, if he�d written the second money order when he cashed Kirby�s check and knew there was a balance due to Richard.

This is not an attack on Les in any way, I just don�t understand some of the posts that were written in anger to defend someone you�ve never talked to or done business with and then put down the people that are personal friends of Richard�s and that have done business with him and know him personally. I guess there�s a certain amount of loyalty that becomes automatic when one is a member of a certain forum. That�s understandable and to be expected.

I�m sure there will be those that find this post offensive but it�s only my point of view, after all, everyone else got their say. I�ll continue to do business with Richard because I consider him to be a stand up businessman and a personal friend that produces a product that I use and will continue to use in all of my guns.

I�m also sure that this will be straightened out and that both parties will wish it never happened. Sad part is, it never had to happen.

KABOOM!!!!!

It took me 30 minutes to read through this...crap.
1)send the guy $60.00
2) continue to make quality bullets,I'd buy the duplicates
3) no body is a thief or A hole..shake hands and move on
4) VA DON"T GO ANYWHERE!!!!

Jeff ... that's right ... I forgot about VA's proposal that he would leave this site for good if it turned out Les didn't pay as he should have, or was in the wrong, or something like that ...

This should get interesting ... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

VA..............this isn't an absolute right or wrong issue,it's $60.00 for quality bullets.
Let the two parties get the $$$ straightened out and everybody is happy.
1) no more unpaid merchandise..period
2)NEVER post personel info EVER!

Rick,

First off, I must apologize for my heated personal e-mail to you last night as I was unable to log onto 24hour and defend myself concerning this post. I was pissed and took it out on you and want to publically apologize for that, it was wrong of me to do so.

Being a third of the treo of people that was directly involved in this event from the start, I would like to say that as far as this 1/3 is concerned, I am satisfied with the results and would be glad to see this post locked up for good.

So for the three directly involved in this I personally am though with it.

To the members of 24hour, I would also hope that no ill feelings were created over this. Tempers flare and things are said, it happens. THis is not a chat room I would call my home chat room, that would be Long Range Hunting but I do hope we are all welcome to post on here if there are things of interest to us as all of you are welcome to come over to LRH if you are interested in such things.

I will not apologize for Bulletsmith starting the post, have no reason to, in fact I would probably do the same thing.

Its been posted, worked over far to much and now its time to die. The end result is Les and Richard working this out which they seem to be doing.

Have a good weekend and for crying out loud, go out and shoot something this weekend!!!

Good Shooting!!

Kirby Allen(50)

I'll stick around to read all the apologies everyone needs to make. Maybe we could just discuss the word "respect" while we are waiting.

#1, I suspect VA isn't going anywhere. He's man enough to own up to his mistakes, make apologies where due. Besides that, lawyers are like puppies. Everyone should own one. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

#2, Kirby, Bulletsmith and Les are all stand up characters that got caught up in the moment. We've all stepped on our d$cks a time or two. Time to move on. No use for hard feelings, and puck that *IGNORE* [email]crp[/email]

#3, I'm kinda surprised by the people that tried to trivialize the amount of money involved. I've been known to make parts for people I know on the CNC mill I run for a bottle of Pepsi. Screw me out of 20 bucks and you'll be singing alto.

Time for a group hug!!!!!!!!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Wudja make me some parts for a whole lot of beer?
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
GTC <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Sounds like an interner version of a knitting bee to me.I agree with Barak's Woman.
Nice language.

I think that this thread goes under the category of:

"No Good Deed will go unpunished."

Or maybe it's

"The beatings will continue until morale improves."


Chuck