Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting Berger bullets for elk?

I'm on board with the Bergers until I find out differently for myself. I've always liked a bullet that expands.


Why anyone would shoot a bullet that does this on anything other than African dangerous game, I don't know....

I think 'Lil John(John Burns) said it best about the Booger bullet.



1-I am not a shoulder shooter and the bullet I choose to use is not particular where it hits to work correctly.

2-This says it all..The Booger Bullet Hype has gone off the edge of sanity and common sense.

600+ yard Elk shots are not in my network,not that I couldn't make them with conditions being perfect but the margin of error at that range is not worth it for simple ole me.

I killed my last two tarps with plain,older than dirt,Remington Core-lokt's because I was to lazy to load up the Noslers on my bench until it was to late.

Jayco

Did somebody sneak into your box again?

Logcutter, unfortunately, since you've never shot Bergers, nor see a need to, you don't seem to be adding a lot to the discussion. Hype is a slang term for hyperbole, I believe, which means exaggeration. What has been pointed out about Bergers on this thread has been factual. I haven't read any claims that haven't borne out from someone's personal experience, so it isn't hype. There are things that Bergers probably won't do very well, but most of the hype I hear is from naysayers that have never shot Berger bullets at game. Sorry to piss on your parade. man, but they really are great bullets, and they really do what people say they do. I agree with John Burns that they don't necessarily produce 'Dead Right There'. All the animals I've seen shot with Bergers dropped right there though. We used a finisher on an elk, because she wasn't hit that well, and was still kicking when we got to her. She was down though, and anchored with that marginal hit. That was when I was utterly sold on the fragmenting bullet in the ribs for undisturbed game.

I'm not asking you to like them, or to try them, or anything like that, but I will happily defend them, with all of the facts on my side, and all the hype on yours.

Well howdy Slim...Long time no talk....Damn,nearly forgot about the box days.I have fond memories of 'flave in my box.

Are you a Booger man too?

Jayco

No hype here.....I am simply saying,once a hunter finds the right bullet for his needs,he should stick with it and not change/experiment because of hype on the net for another bullet.

I found my bullet some 50 years ago.They call it the Nosler Partition.When for some reason I am not shooting Noslers,the Remington Core-Lokt is my choice in loaded ammo.

If Booger bullets work for you and your kind of hunting,by all means,stick with them through thick and thin and don't change because of some new wonder bullet that gets all hyped up on the net...That was all I was saying...

Boogers and shoulder shots for you and Noslers and any shot for me....Gotta love the choices,bullets for anything.

Jayco

'Flave said that was a great time in his life as well.

Don't think 'slave ever got over you letting 'flave in your box though.

Yes, Boogers are good.

Yeah, no. I don't shoulder shoot, as I mentioned. I'm opposed to shoulder shooting, because I love the meat. Burns didn't say you have to shoulder shoot with Bergers. There are a few factors involved in planning and making longer shots, and John Burns was talking about his preferred shot. He makes longer shots than I will ever desire to, and the bone helps the bullet open when velocity has dropped way off. My longest planned shot still gives me plenty of velocity for expansion without hitting bone, which is what I want. I like your choice. If 500 yds was the longest shot I was planning for, Partitions would be a best option. The point I am making is that in my experience, Berger bullets are far LESS LIMITED than guys like you keep portraying. They are actually hunting bullets, just like an Accubond, or an SST, or a Partition. For most hunting that the average hunter does, BC isn't a factor, as shots aren't that long, and neither are mine. What I've found though is that Berger hunting bullets work just fine for all-around hunting, shoot accurately, and are far cheaper than a Partition. It's like magic!

They are awesome! Bergers cured my grandmother's gout! Berger bullets found me the best deal on a used car!

If they cured your grandma's gout---Count me in as the new Booger man.They are indeed a wonder bullet...

Jayco the Booger man....

I like it. How about Jayco the Sofa King?

It continues...... mtmuley

...as it should.

Looks perfect.They work great, its as simple as that.

Well I'd like to see a bit more frontal area myself...

But no doubt that Barnes "works",and penetrates.Besides I would bet $10 that the expanded frontal area(what really does the "work" IMHO) of a Berger is not much larger as it travels through animal flesh and bone.

Difference is the Berger is probably losing that expanded front as the jacket/core is torn apart(we know this because the excessive fragmentation is what some folks like,and even John Burns will say so because as he told me, the bullet just "collapses",and at the end of the wound channel there is more of the Barnes left to see it than with the Berger.

But a common misconception is that we either have bullets that totally collapse and fragment(supposedly great for anchoring game by making jelly of innards; or we have "hard" premiums that make long but narrow wound channels.

Fact is, that there are bullets that expand very well to a broad mushroom,do not fragment at all, retain practically all their weight,penetrate well,and will make an elk's innards look like a bomb went off inside them,particularly at very high velocity.And yes they will give a very high percentage of DRT's. I know this because I have used them on game from pronghorn antelope to Alaskabn Brown bear.

As a long range bullet (beyond 600 yards) they likely are not in the class of a Berger for flight characteristics but I know two Idaho elk hunters who have used them to 700 and 800 yards;one a 250 gr 375 from a 375AI,and another a 165 from a 300 RUM at over 3500 fps.

So,lung soup is not the sole purview of fragmenting bullets.

...and not all elk are killed in the open terrain of the American Southwest with broadside shots (where I have hunted many times);in other places,some have to be killed at rock throwing distances or across broad canyons maybe on the same day with the same rifle and load.Some people may appreciate that Barnes under those circumstances, as much as the Berger guy uses those to hedge bets at 600 yards plus.


For anyone interested Nosler Partitions are completely ethical bullets and perfectly capable of knocking the snot out of bull elk at 500 to 600 yards,not only from the 30/06 but from a number of other cartridges as well. Reading charts and studying tables may not tell you this but seeing it done and doing it yourself, will.

Dam, this stuff becomes cult like for some.

Sure glad I live where elk are all shot broad side in open pastures. It would suck to have to shoot across a canyon or hunt where you can't see 1 mile. Laffin' at that one.

SLM: I have generally found shooting NM elk....pretty "easy".


But I don't live there.So you may know things I don't.

The bullet on the right is the only Barnes TTSX or MRX my hunting partners and I have ever recovered. This one was a 180g MRX from my .300WM @ 3100fps, recovered from a herd of water jugs at about 15 feet. Damn thing lost a petal.



From left to right:
4 jugs == Sierra 200g FP .458" @ 2390fps, 81% weight retention (left group of five, front row center)
6 jugs == Speer 300g Uni-Cor .458" @ 2247fps, 59.6% to 72.5% weight retention, 68.8% average (remainder of left group)
8 jugs == Speer 350g FP .458" @ 2147fps, 87.6% weight retention
6 jugs == North Fork 350g .458" @ 2189fps, 97.4% weight retention
9 jugs == Cast Performance 460g WFNGC .458" @ 1812fps, 76.5% weight retention
5 jugs == Hornady 220g FP .375" @2230fps, 65.7% weight retention
7 jugs == Barnes 180g MRX .308" @ 3100fps, 93.4% weight retention

This cow from 2012 took a 180g MRX at 400 yards (+/- a yard or two per GPS), broadside at a down angle. It swapped ends, took a step or two, turned uphill for another step or two and collapsed. There was no shortage of internal damage. The exit side is shown.



Barnes bullets � just can�t trust them�

I like it, right up there with Booger bullets and hemorrhoids.

Jayco

And of the three, you only have experience with the latter........

Seriously though, it's funny how so many guys who will never use the bullets have such a strong opinion on them.

Not true..I have experience with Barnes bullets..458 that were given to me..My wife calls them the cement bullet.

No experience with Boogers only because long ago I found my bullet of choice..I am not one to fix something that is not broke.No need to experiment on this end.

In the 50's and 60's the Sierra was the king of reloading bullets for game around here.It worked like the Booger...In a few and it blew up...Nice if deep penetration is not needed which mostly, it was sufficient except that 1-2% of the time.

Hell, the biggest complaint I have heard about the Nosler is the front portion exploding off leaving only the rear partition,like a Berger on front with a partition behind..Two bullets in one..What's not to like.

Jayco