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Joined: Jul 2010
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OP
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Don't like the Win AA HULLS AT ALL. Grey color is very difficult to find in grass etc and the plastic material cracks very easily.
Which hulls are you using to reload now?
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,113
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,113 |
To me AA hulls don't last. They start splitting at the crimp very soon. I get 2-3 reloads max, many times, just one.
To me Rem STS green hulls are hard to beat. They will take more crimps than AA's.
DF
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Campfire Outfitter
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Which hulls are you using to reload now? Win AA.  Maybe I'm lucky, but I don't experience the problems that others seem to. One or two loads before they split? Not mine. And it helps that I have a BUNCH, in 28, 20 and 12 ga. 
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Joined: Nov 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
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Maybe you got a better batch of AA's.
IIRC, there are more than one series of AA hulls. I'm not sure, but think mine may be the older ones.
Can you add info about that?
DF
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Joined: Oct 2011
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Campfire Outfitter
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All my reloads have been with hulls I collected between 1975 and 2000. Sometime after that I heard Winchester came out with another series of AA hull. I have no experience with them. For the older AA labeled and top of the line compression formed hunting loads the same load data is used. Winchester also loaded lesser quality ammo that had paper and/or plastic base wads during that time period.
I tried using other brands of hulls over those years but always went back to the AA/compression formed hulls because of ease of reloading.
I've never counted the number of reloads per hull. At the end of a days shoot, I picked through the empties and tossed any that were worn or split. They didn't seem to wear out any faster than the other brands.
I've purchased a few boxes of the Remington STS ammo when I couldn't find anything else. Haven't tried them for reloads but have heard good things about them.
FWIW- John Olin ran W-W for many years. For what ever reason he did what he could to prevent reloaders from using W-W shotshell hulls. Warnings were printed on each hull, warning of the use of reloaded ammo and that any W-W hulls reloaded must be labeled as such. During the paper hull days he had his people attempt to make the hulls so thin that pin holes would burn through the case on the first firing. He also saw to it that Winchester hulls were not made available as components.
All that aside, I still have a few hundred (old) AA hulls and if I reload, that's what I use.
Last edited by websterparish47; 10/07/13.
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,113
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,113 |
Evidently there are different AA's.
It would be nice to have more info on the various versions.
DF
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Joined: Oct 2011
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I have no specific data but something has led me to believe the newer hulls are not "compression formed".
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Maybe you got a better batch of AA's.
IIRC, there are more than one series of AA hulls. I'm not sure, but think mine may be the older ones.
Can you add info about that?
DF Winchester has recently "improved" (in marketing-speak  ) their hulls to now be AA HS (as in High Strength). They have HS inside a squared oval on the hulls. Ironically, it is the older (non-HS) hulls that a lot of guys covet. I use both (HS in 28 gauge, cause my older regular AA's in 28 ga are finally wearing out). The older hulls were a true one-piece hull, with straight sides on the inside. The newer HS hulls have a taper inside near the base. If you use the old-style wads in the new style hulls, they don't work too well. You can usually get them crimped (though you should notice a difference right away), but shortly afterwards, the taper forces the base of the wad back up, and your crimps start to bloom open. As for a "better batch"... I've been loading AAs for ~40 years, so doubt they are all of the same lot number. One of my best shooting buddies swears by the Rem hulls, so it works well when we shoot together. If we happen to be going around the course after somebody who was throwing away brand new (once-fired) hulls, I grab the AA's and he grabs the STS's. Everybody wins!  If I wasn't sitting on thousands of hulls, and cases of wads to fit, I could just as happily shoot Rem hulls. I just got established on this route many years ago, before we had choices, and just haven't seen a reason to change.
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Joined: Jun 2011
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Campfire Outfitter
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Never had a problem with AA hulls. At least 5 loadings.
The people wringing their hands over Trump's rhetoric don't know what time it is in America.
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 286
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Like others, I'm getting around 4 loadings with new HS hulls. I mostly load slugs though. However, I'm geting 5-7 in the sts hulls, but these have all been 1oz target loads.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I heard Win did change the AA shells, to bad, the old one's, red, were tied for my favorite shell. Can't get Blue Magic anymore either but if I still had a 12 ga and found a bunch of them, I'd get every one. In my 16 ga I just use Rem Game load shell's. They are a one piece compression formed shell that have worked well for me for a long time. Started using my 28 ga several years ago and all I use in it are Rem STS hulls. Get them by buying a flat of target loads. Use them dog training and quail hunting. Reload the shell with #7 1/2 shot. They don't seem to do as well as the black 16 ga shells, crimps go bad to soon. But still get several loading from them. Crimp getting bad, I load one more time then throw them away. Just seal the crimp with a bit of melted wax.
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 6,546
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2005
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For 25 years I loaded WW AA 20 gauge hulls with WW 571 powder and WW yellow 1 oz. wads for small game. After running out I go the shop to buy more and find out that Winchester has discontinued both 571 and the yellow 1 oz. wad. Not only that but they had changed the hull too. Now the hull is more like a Cheddite. Sheesh, I had to start over with everything.
Last edited by LeonHitchcox; 10/11/13.
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Joined: Jan 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Rem STS or Win AA would be my first pick. However, don't discount the Remington economy Gun Club shell. I think they are the same shell that DonFisher mentioned as the Game load offering.
laissez les bons temps rouler
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Joined: Apr 2011
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New Member
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New Member
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The Remmington Gun Club Hull very good they should load 6 to 8 times.
The New WW Hulls are called Hs Hulls. Thay have less internal hull space. Needs a dif load then the older comp hulls.But should
load 6 to 8 times. I load Fed Top Guns, Rio,Fiocci, One time an done. There is good loads for every hull. What ever you can get
you can load it....
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,088
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I saw this topic the other day and wished I still had AA Red hulls. Well I was digging out some 410 shells and what did I find, two big bags of Red AA 28ga hulls. Probably close to 300 in them.
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,047
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
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Don't like the Win AA HULLS AT ALL. Grey color is very difficult to find in grass etc and the plastic material cracks very easily.
Which hulls are you using to reload now? Remington STS (Green and nitro 27) if you don't like AA. I've loaded thousands of both with good results..
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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20ga I like Gun clubs. 12ga 2 3/4" hunting loads, Remington yellow base. 12ga 3" Remington Yellow base. 10ga Remington yellow base. Federal Gold metal Is hard to beat if you can find enough. Old style win AA is good. I use what I can get in good numbers. Top gun's get a lot of loads.
The anti American Constitutional party (Democrat). Wants to dismantle your rights, limiting every aspect of your constitutional rights. Death by 1000 cuts is the tactic. Each cut bleeds constitutional rights to control you. Control is the goal.
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Remington's are my favorite. Their Gun Clubs last the longest followed by Sport Loads and the similar looking black hulls. Nitro's and STS's are a close second as they develop holes/"crimp splits" and get "crispier" sooner. No press adjustments needed for any including the older Blue Magic, RXP, etc... . These are all compression formed 1 piece hulls. No separate base wad to unknowingly become lodged in a auto's barrel.
The newer Federal "ribbed" Gold Medals are next on my list. Again, 1 piece plastic hulls. No internal taper so plenty of room in these. The older "smooth" hulls tended to separate above the head after a few firings. They are pain to remove and a real problem if not noticed. Also, the older purplish, ribbed Gold Medals are inferior to the new ones. They split at the crimps much quicker. Top Guns require a little adjustment but are fine for 1 and done loading. I've seen the paper base wad come out as a flaming spiral more than once from guys pushing them further.
Older Winchester Compression formed hulls are great hulls. As I understand it they stopped making them around 2000 and began the HS hulls. The data for both is the same although the HS hulls have less internal volume creating fit issues. The HS hull is 2 piece. The base wad is separate. This causes concern for those who shoot auto's in that the base wad could separate and become lodged in the barrel. Break open shooters can easily look down their barrels for obstructions. I have heard that the early HS variants had issues with the base wad separating. Winchester addressed this by improving the lock between the base wad and the head. The early ones are identifiable by the printed box around the AA on each hull. Improved ones just have a line under the AA. The printing on the "boxed" ones is very similar to the old compression hulls and can be confusing. Once you have inspected a few the differences in the plastic are readily apparent.
The new HS hulls don't last like the older Compression ones. They get holes at the crimp folds quicker and the body splits vertically more often. That being said, I like them and will use them for up to 6 or so firings.
Back to the internal volume of the HS hulls. Downrange make a series of wads called DRA that address this issue. They are fantastic. For fit problems you can also step up a size a gain needed room. Example; 1 1/8 wad for 1 ounce load. Not a problem with all powders, but some "fluffier" ones cause tented crimps shortly after loading.
Some report success using the euro hulls. I have no experience with these (ie Rio, Fiocchi, Nobel, etc... .)
I'm by no means an shot shell loading expert. The above is simply my experience and understanding to date. More experienced members might certainly have more to add.
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Posts: 7,197
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Ring 3, I appreciate that tip on the new Vs old AA two piece hull.
Last edited by keith; 10/26/13.
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,047
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,047 |
Remington's are my favorite. Their Gun Clubs last the longest followed by Sport Loads and the similar looking black hulls. Nitro's and STS's are a close second as they develop holes/"crimp splits" and get "crispier" sooner. No press adjustments needed for any including the older Blue Magic, RXP, etc... . These are all compression formed 1 piece hulls. No separate base wad to unknowingly become lodged in a auto's barrel.
The newer Federal "ribbed" Gold Medals are next on my list. Again, 1 piece plastic hulls. No internal taper so plenty of room in these. The older "smooth" hulls tended to separate above the head after a few firings. They are pain to remove and a real problem if not noticed. Also, the older purplish, ribbed Gold Medals are inferior to the new ones. They split at the crimps much quicker. Top Guns require a little adjustment but are fine for 1 and done loading. I've seen the paper base wad come out as a flaming spiral more than once from guys pushing them further.
Older Winchester Compression formed hulls are great hulls. As I understand it they stopped making them around 2000 and began the HS hulls. The data for both is the same although the HS hulls have less internal volume creating fit issues. The HS hull is 2 piece. The base wad is separate. This causes concern for those who shoot auto's in that the base wad could separate and become lodged in the barrel. Break open shooters can easily look down their barrels for obstructions. I have heard that the early HS variants had issues with the base wad separating. Winchester addressed this by improving the lock between the base wad and the head. The early ones are identifiable by the printed box around the AA on each hull. Improved ones just have a line under the AA. The printing on the "boxed" ones is very similar to the old compression hulls and can be confusing. Once you have inspected a few the differences in the plastic are readily apparent.
The new HS hulls don't last like the older Compression ones. They get holes at the crimp folds quicker and the body splits vertically more often. That being said, I like them and will use them for up to 6 or so firings.
Back to the internal volume of the HS hulls. Downrange make a series of wads called DRA that address this issue. They are fantastic. For fit problems you can also step up a size a gain needed room. Example; 1 1/8 wad for 1 ounce load. Not a problem with all powders, but some "fluffier" ones cause tented crimps shortly after loading.
Some report success using the euro hulls. I have no experience with these (ie Rio, Fiocchi, Nobel, etc... .)
I'm by no means an shot shell loading expert. The above is simply my experience and understanding to date. More experienced members might certainly have more to add. ring3 is correct. I've seen a gun blow supposedly because of the change to the AA hulls. Some guys at the club stopped using the gray AA hulls and went back to using the older red AA hulls. I don't shoot competitively anymore and haven't loaded for shotshells for about 5 years now so my experience comes from the older stuff I used to load. Like I said in an earlier post, my favorites were always STS/Nitro27's and AA hulls. I've loaded the remington blue magics, cheap gunclub's (make sure they have the brass and not steel base), and federal gold medals (paper and plastic). I always used the sts and nitro's for my "long bomb", "run what you brung" money shoots. Sounds like ring3 has been there and done it as well..
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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