Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Canada - US Softwood deal is a total sellout!!!

BigUglyMan - +1 Your right about that, bad day I guess... But your nuts if you think the 270's better than the 280! Why just the bullet selection alone.... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> CEJ...

Ignorance such as yours can often be addressed through education, but, the type of stupidity demonstrated in your sniveling bullschitt is incurable. Forget your Prozac today?

Are you Hillary's son?? Nephew, maybe???

Got to be related somehow............

RO

I really liked it when he said"You want to stand on your own two feet? Then do it! For GOD's sake do it! You've been trying for years and can't figure it out yet!"
Hillary's kin..Don't think so...
Canada is not capable of much anymore......
Bart

Back to the original post; I'm of the opinion that the deal is about the best that we could expect to get - it's not necessarily fair, but then I don't remember there being any promises about fairness in politics, economics, or life itself, for that matter. Our next door neighbour is the Big Boy in the 'hood, and he tends to get what he wants, so I figure we came away from the party with at least something to show for our bitchin' - certainly more than we had two days ago, when Big Boy had the whole 5 billion.

Ergo, I'm not angry with S. Harper for cutting this deal with Dubbya; I think he did about as well as he could have and a whole hell of a lot better than Jean C. could/would do.

kutenay - re-read your bullshit and tell me who's whining! You lost a judgement and you go on a tirade! Your the one who needs the prozac or a good enema! River Otter, was your father that dimwitted frenchmen that just got voted out of office? You guys are worse then our Democraps, the guy's not in office for a year and your already want his blood and his resignation... Quebec's got the right idea, sucsession.. Bart, +1... Can't waste anymore time on this! Biguglyman and I have a debate going on the 270 vs the 280...

What would a urban wannabe who lives in a schitthole like Connecticut know about trees, lumber, mountains or anything worthwhile? You are just a typical mouthpiece who probably needs a "guide" to find a barren doe Whitetail in a zoo. We will win in the end and you will freeze in the dark without Canadian electricity, oil and gas. So, "fermez la bouche"!

BTW, regarding enemas, sorry, I don't share your homoerotic, anal obsession.

That's the kind of brainless reply I would have expected from someone like you... Have a nice day... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Well, at least your spelling is better in this post. However, you are still a wannabe and a bigot; it's not ...frenchmen..., it's "Quebecois".

I tend to avoid participating in this section of the forum, since the posts usually degenerate into a pissing contest. In this case, I cannot resist making a few comments.

First, I agree that Canadian lumber producers have been screwed by the latest deal on softwood lumber. Canadian producers, backed by their government, have consistently won every trade arbitration appeal, and American state and federal governments have just as consistently refused to abide by those arbitration decisions. The U.S. government did in fact illegally pocket $1 billion in lumber duties, which, if refunded, would not go to the Canadian government but to the companies that produced the lumber. This is not a question of whether the U.S. is in a position to flout its trade agreements, since there is obviously no enforcement mechanism that can ensure compliance with trade arbitration rulings, nor was the U.S. coerced into signing NAFTA. This is instead a question of whether flouting both solemnly-made agreements and international law is the right thing to do. I don't think that too many people would argue that reneging on a deal or ignoring the laws that make free and fair trade possible does not speak well of one's character.

Did the Prime Minister sell us out? Maybe. Maybe not. He might have held out for who know how many more years for a better deal. Why anyone thinks that he would be more successful at obtaining the agreement of the U.S. to abide by its trade agreements after repeated failuress by a succession of earlier governments is difficult to say. I also wonder why anyone believes that the U.S. will abide by this latest agreement when it has ignored its past commitments. Frankly, the agreement is probably not worth the paper on which it was printed.

Should Canada attempt to "punish" the U.S.? Yeah, right. Punish our closest ally and largest trading partner. There's a good idea. Should Canadian companies withdraw from the American market and seek a better deal by trading overseas with India and China? I think that our American neighbours could tell us a lot about what considerate friends and trade partners the Chinese are. If we are having difficulties making things work smoothly with the Americans, we might as well lube up and bend over once the Chinese have us where they want us.

The lesson here is that this is business, and business means negotiating the best deal possible for both sides. Good business practice is not a savage free-for-all, and good business practice reflects our character just as clearly as anything else we do in life. We now have a soft-wood lumber deal. If Canadian companies cannot sell lumber in the U.S. at a profit, they will have to look elsewhere for business. If American, home buyers cannot afford new homes because of the high cost of domestically produced lumber, maybe the U.S. government will take a closer look at the problem in the future. At the moment, however, this is likely the best deal possible, and both sides should in good faith try to make it work.

This is a very well written post, but, it typifies the attitude prevalent in Ontario and also the Canadian approach to international affairs that has got us into the current imbroglio. We in B.C. are suffering due to both the U.S. refusal to abide by the terms of the accursed NAFTA sellout and also by the attitude of Ontario concerning western Canada. The Chinese are out for what they can get, but, we CAN deal with them, if we STANDUP for ourselves.

This is funny.If you think that this is true...You're insane...
The U.S.A. doesn't rely on Canada for ANYTHING!
We are neighbors,that's it.Wow, you think alot of yourself...
Bart

Too much "Mescal" last night, Bart?????

long been a believer that about 5-10% of the population causes about 90% of the worlds problems.

It's discouraging to me that a few Canucks that are pizzed at our government, (welcome to the club boys, I ain't real fond of our government much of the time either) that want to jump on the Anti-American bandwagon can begin to create some of the hostility we're seeing here.

What little I know of the world, if I couldn't be a citizen of the USA, I've always figured Canada or Australia would be about the only places I'd stand a chance to fit in.

Maybe it's changed and maybe some of the posters bitterness towards the US is more prevalent in the Canadian genreal population than I wish against us, but I hope not.

My own personal experience is limited, but while traveling through Canada, I've met some of the nicest folks and have never been treated better anywhere by anyone. I've really enjoyed visiting with Canucks while on vacation in Mexico as well.

I really appreciate the thoughts expressed here by Big Ugly Man and Sam Steele, and hope those attitudes are more representative of how Canadadians really feel about the U.S.

Hell even my best friend and I don't see eye to eye on everything, and I am sure we both have had times where we felt we were getting the "short end of the stick" in our doings and relationship. But we normally have found a way to work past that and remain friends, instead of becoming enemies.

I hope we can do that as nations as well.

I guess it's what makes the news, but I think we give waaay too much attention to guys that like to thump their chest and make threats, whether they run a little country somewhere or just participate on an internet forum. YMMV

To the Canadians that our government has done wrong, I offer my apology, but hey boys, it ain't just you, I just sent in my tax return! And to you Canadians that realize we're more alike than we are different, even though we'll probably always have differences that need to be worked out,and still offer your friendship, mine is offered in return as I believe many Americans are.

It remains an amazement to me how this thread demonstrates that it only takes a little provocation by very few, to get friends ready to takes sides and do battle.

I hope that Canada and the U.S. remain allies and friends for generations to come. I've always lived a more rural setting, but common sense tells you it pays to get along with your neighbors, even if you don't see eye to eye on everything.

No...Can't do T'kill'ya...
Lighten up Kute...I know that you are one of the good guys...
But some of the things that you say are far-out...
Bart

I can't even LOOK at that stuff! O.K., a truce, BUT, only for the weekend!

Deal...
I'll bet you that I can be nice longer than you <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />...
Bart

well thought out post, thank you for making the exception to participate this time.

Our government has a pretty dismal track record of living up to it's written contracts, whether it be what "income tax" is or what it is to be used for, or the purpose and use of SSN #'s. It's been a problem for as long as I can remember, if you don't believe me, ask a US Indian, if you can find one.

again, thanks for your post.

Very good post. A deal is a Deal, they never benefit all parties concerned equally. The lumber indistry and the govt in BC both support the deal, this fight has been very hard on the lumber industry. Now they have a framework, not perfect, but a Framework. Several large canadian producers would have gone under if a deal wasn't done sooner rather than later. Kutenay can bitch and moan all he wants, this was and is necessary.

The support for this here in B.C. is lukewarm, at best and it is "early days yet". But, WTF would I know, I only spent almost my entire working life in forestry, starting in '65.

The whole deal is just another corporate rip-off of the ordinary people of North America, look at the position of the organization representing U.S. homebuilders. The corporate elite are laughing, while working people will pay AND this same scenario will eventually come to pass in other resource sectors; we will see who moans and bitches then.