Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Muzzleloaders BH 209 in Knight 45?

I tried some BH 209 in my knight disk rifle. Misfires, hang fires and poor accuracy. does the breach plug need to be modified to shoot this powder? 209 worked great in my .50 Encore.

Thanks.

Lefty C

Works fine with the bare 209 primer breach plug and Win209 primers for me. Im not sure if i ever tried using the FPJ plug or not in my 45s.

What projectile are you shooting?

Call Knight. They have a really good tech guy who will tell you if it is possible and how to get there if it is.

You need the new bare primer breech plug for shooting BH209.I use this in all my knights and have never had a miss fire using it.just make sure you do not have blow back around the primer for this makes the primer charge less to the powder and you will have hang fires.
http://www.knightrifles.com/product/bare-209-primer-muzzleloader-conversion-kit/

I use the bare primer breechplug setup in my Knight and BH209 works OK. I also use CCI magnum primers because BH209 is harder to ignite.

You do realize the Knight bare 209 primer plug for DISC and Mountaineer type rifles was designed around a Win209 primer. The extra fire of a mag primer does not help much if it ends up in your action instead of the powder.

Ive burned somewhere between 10 and 12 bottles of BH209 with Win209s in the Knight bare 209 primer plugs and its fired flawlessly.

I would consider a mag primer if i lived in the Acrtic and they sealed as well as the Win209. Fed209As seal pretty good in mine but the CCI209M does not do nearly as well.

I spoke with Knight today. My rifle needs a bolt to convert it to a disk extreme and then a 209 conversion kit. total cost about $240.00! Not worth it to me so I parked to BH 209 to use in my 50. Bought some triple 7. no misfires but dismal accuracy with 2 different wt. power belts and Barnes expander. Like 6-8". Thought it might be my scope so switched the 6x42 for my Leupie 3.5X10. No change.

Powder charges from 95-110.

About ready to give up on this one.

Lefty C

Try some 44 cal XTP's

I was afraid that would be the deal when I posted earlier. The breech plug is cheap enough, but the other mods to be able to use it cost about as much as a new break action from several makers.

In the .50 cal, try Hornady XTP pistol bullets or the poly tipped muzzleloader bullets and you might be surprised. My rifles do not like Power Belts and Barnes bullets. Accuracy was awful, but not quite as bad as you are getting. BTW, the T/C bullets are just the same as the Hornady's with fewer in the package. It took my brother a while to figure that out. He was buying the T/C easy glide loads for a tight bored T/C.

If you have an original DISC 45, it may be a 1-20 twist. That would explain the lackluster PB performance unless you use the heaviest one which i think is 300gr. The 300gr will shoot but you will likely need to drop down in powder a little. Barnes expanders though should be ok. You may need to use the harvester light blue 45x40 sabots. The old dark brown sabots are also problematic.

Obviously 44cal bullets are not going to work in a 45cal ML.

Hornady offers a 40cal 200gr SST also. I would try them and use the harvester sabot if your rifle does not like the supplied tan sabots.

400-490gr conicals have also shot well for me with upto 80gr of powder. Usually 65gr-70 is plenty with big lead.

Precision Rifle sells some heavy 40cal bullets upto 260gr for 45cal MLs. These usually shoot great in fast twist 45s. Dont mind Cecil, he says they dont but i assure you they can and do with the right sabot. Ive shot all the bullets i mentioned in a 45cal 1-20 and a 1-22 with no issues.

You may look for someone with a bad barrel that's no good and get the parts for yours.

Numrich has Extreme bolts for $124. The bare 209 kit is around $39 IIRC.

http://www.gunpartscorp.com/Products/1372040.htm

http://www.knightrifles.com/product/bare-209-primer-muzzleloader-conversion-kit/

The only other thing you need is the small allen set screw that holds the bolt in.

Call Knight and ask for Gordy. He knows what screw is needed.

I was not aware that the Knight bare primer system is designed for Winchester primers. I'll switch to them for my Disc Elite, and use the CCIs in my TC.

Try them, i dont hunt sub zero temps but it still gets pretty damn cold during deer season.

Like i said, if you really feel the need, try the Fed209A also. Its hotter than a Win209A and seals pretty good in the plug. Not perfect but not terrible either.

Win209s though are nearly spotless when removed from mine. Ignition has been instant down into the teens.

I have a original disc 45 1-20 twist. I shoot the Thompson Center HP XTP bullets over 110 grains of triple 7, I get 3/4 inch groups at 100. I killed a buck at a little over 200 last year bang flop. it also shoots the 155 grain XTP Magnum bullet well. same powder charge.

IIRC CCI primers are recommended for BH powder. Had issues weigh the Win. 209 primers.

After changing to these CCI primers I no longer have issues with my .45 Knight rifle. BTW, I'm using an original 45 Disc, 195 gr. Barnes copper bullets and 100gr. BH.

I tried my .50 Disc Elite with the bare primer breechplug, Win 209 primers, BH209, 200 gr Shockwaves. It is slightly cleaner than the CCIs, and ignited well in 40-something degree temps. I got good groups (1.5" for 3 shots at 100 yd)using 110 gr of BH209. Before I got the bare primer breechplug, Win 209 primers did not ignite BH209 well in cold weather using discs, but magnum primers worked better. With discs, there may also be a difference between the convex/concave face breechplugs. The convex face plug was designed to get rid of the 777 "crud ring", if I remember correctly.
Our season for inlines here in PA starts next Saturday.

I was not aware that Hornady made a 40cal 155gr MAG bullet. I cant seem to find one on their website. I only see a regular 155gr XTP. I sure would not want to use a 40 155gr for anything but recreational shooting.

The 200gr and maybe the 180gr 40cal XTPs are ok killers. By the time it reaches 200 yards it has shed a ton of FPS and is probably close to a very hot 10mm or 401 Herters PowerMag at the muzzle.

A 200gr SST or Barnes 195gr are far superior for shots with varying ranges. They fly better and hold up better than the XTP.

The 45cal 1-20 is very versatile with good sabots. Knight won at least one match in 2002 IIRC with fairly heavy Precision Rifle QT bullets. They shoot well and smack well for a soft lead projectile. Big lead full bores also shoot well and are probably unmatched in penetration compared to any other commonly used lead bullets in the 45s.

The fast twist works better with heavy/long for caliber projectiles vs the new 1-30 twist Knights. Might as well make use of that advantage if you own one.

Too bad someone doesn't replicate the White .45/.40 Power Star sabot. It was a pure lead 350 grain .40 cal spitzer. Shoots great out of my 1-20 twist .451 Whites and with only a 70-80 grain charge I have yet to recover one from about a half dozen deer I've shot with it. Probably wouldn't be a big seller now days, everyone's interested in velocity.

I have not seen a source for the Powerstars. Cecil at PR makes upto a 40-260gr bullet in 45cal sabots. These shoot very well in 1-20 and 1-22 barrels.