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Campfire Ranger
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OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
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In order of whom you think has the best chance
Which model I guess depends on how the whole caliber things Here's how I see it:
Top contenders: Sig (P320) S&W (M&P) Glock (17 or 21) Beretta (PX4) FNH (FNX) CZ (P-09) H&K (VP9 / HK45)
Wild Cards (meaning not likely, but have a chance): Ruger (SR Series) Springfield Armory / HS Produkt (XD series) Taurus (24/7 series)
Not likely, will be eliminated early on: Detonics (MTX)
I think the big wild cards in the whole thing are: 1 - Caliber, which will they decide to go with? 2 - Modular? How modular, and what meets the requirement for "modular"?
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Joined: Apr 2008
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2008
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Something union made.
But seriously I don't know.
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Joined: May 2007
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2007
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The Ruger, Taurus and XD are dead in the water and the FN and CZ are right behind them.
I'd bet money on the 320 and M&P.
your flippant remarks which you so adeptly sling
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
The Ruger, Taurus and XD are dead in the water and the FN and CZ are right behind them.
I'd bet money on the 320 and M&P. Yep. Clark
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Oct 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,672 Likes: 1 |
Just some notes on that list.
I have the Sig 320 (or that series) as the top contender because as best I can tell it meets all of the requirements, and is by far the most �modular� of all the pistols out there. My top contenders list all have a good track record for being major military suppliers (although one could argue either way regarding S&W).
Ruger is a wild card because they have never bagged any really big contracts, just a bunch of small contracts. But they�re a HUGE manufacturing concern with a LOT at their fingertips. If their gun fared well in competition, I don�t think anyone would question Ruger�s ability to fulfill their obligations. Springfield / HS Produkt � They don�t have much track record fulfilling/supporting large orders/customers; but they do have an excellent pistol. And perhaps they can convince the US that they could setup at Springfield and build the guns�who knows.
The Detonics is under the unlikely for a number of reasons. While it�s a very interesting pistol (I�d LOVE to test drive one), I don�t see anything �modular� about it. But then again, it�s no less �modular� than some of the traditional double action pistols in the running like the FN, CZ, or Beretta. But I see two major strikes against it. 1 � The grip is what it is, doesn�t seem to be much in the way of adjustment. I guess you could change the backstrap but it�s a very small section of backstrap and the only thing you�d be able to do is increase the grip circumference; meaning, their grip frame solution is pretty weak. 2 � And to me this is what really kills the Detonics. Detonics is a VERY small company with little to no track record. I am not aware of any agency, military or LE, that has bought/adopted a Detonics product, so I just see a ZERO chance our military procurement would put that much on such a small, untested company; it would be bordering on criminal negligence. It�s too bad, Detonics has a very interesting pistol.
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Joined: Oct 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,672 Likes: 1 |
The Ruger, Taurus and XD are dead in the water and the FN and CZ are right behind them.
I'd bet money on the 320 and M&P. Yeah, I really see those two as being the real battle, and I'd have to say I'm leaning toward the Sig 320. If this program goes through, unless something fails miserably for Sig, my bet is the 320 would be our next service pistol. I see it as theirs to lose.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 28,420 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 28,420 Likes: 6 |
If they are to stay competitive S&W better start lining up Board of Directors slots for the soon to retire Pentagon brass and golf junkets for Congressmen to places where child prostitution is legal, plus make some really big campaign contributions...
Of course, I may be just a tad cynical about the military procurement process.
Gunnery, gunnery, gunnery. Hit the target, all else is twaddle!
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Joined: Jul 2011
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453 |
Which ever company has the best lobbyists and the most politicians bought off.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2011
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My money is on Beratta. NATO and 9mm
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 14,654
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 14,654 |
The Ruger, Taurus and XD are dead in the water and the FN and CZ are right behind them.
I'd bet money on the 320 and M&P. Yeah, I really see those two as being the real battle, and I'd have to say I'm leaning toward the Sig 320. If this program goes through, unless something fails miserably for Sig, my bet is the 320 would be our next service pistol. I see it as theirs to lose. The issue with the 320's modularity is that it's so modular. You've got three frames to keep track of with every pistol instead of just a pocket full of backstraps. It's a lot to keep track of.
your flippant remarks which you so adeptly sling
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,445
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,445 |
S&W teamed with General Dynamics
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2007
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And the 320 has absolutely NO safety. The Glock and M&P trigger safeties are a joke, but at least they can claim to have one.
The 320 controls were in the way of how I grip a pistol and I wouldn't start changing everything just to have one. It wasn't that good.
your flippant remarks which you so adeptly sling
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,330 |
And the 320 has absolutely NO safety. The Glock and M&P trigger safeties are a joke, but at least they can claim to have one. The M&P besides the trigger safety(?) can be had with an ambi. thumb safety. from Sig's website; " A frame-mounted thumb safety version will be available for law enforcement needs." Jerry
Last edited by jerrywoodswalker; 01/06/15.
Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Joined: Feb 2001
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2001
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Don't sleep on Glock. They developed a pistol with an external safety for future military bids (per a former Glock salesperson).
Who is John Galt?
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,965 |
My money is on Beratta. NATO and 9mm More M9A1's. They're already on order
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2011
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I should be a Glock, or the FNH, but it won't be. The S&W would be my 3rd place choice. Nothing against the S&W, they just don't fit me.
My bet is that they go with the Berertta in 9mm.
When the US Military is involved, the powers that be will make it a classic cluster fugg.
"Allways speak the truth and you will never have to remember what you said before..." Sam Houston Texans, "We say Grace, We Say Mam, If You Don't Like it, We Don't Give a Damn!"
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2014
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I understand that Glock has a safety. That to get a certain few contracts they have produced and delivered guns with a thumb safety, down to fire like it should be. They do not want to fool with it as an option so have kept quiet about it. May also be a liability thing, "If your gun is so safe why did you make some with an additional safety." $$$$ for a liable lawsuit.
Parents who say they have good kids..Usually don't!
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Joined: Nov 2004
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I dont see DoD buying pistols without safeties.
There is no way to coexist no matter how many bumper stickers there are on Subaru bumpers!
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Campfire Ranger
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OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
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I dont see DoD buying pistols without safeties. They bought the M-11, it has no safety.
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Joined: Apr 2008
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 17,198 Likes: 7 |
Glock 21sf and be done with it. If the f'ers can't be trusted with a Glock,they shouldn't have anything, or need more training. The Brits went with the G17.
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