I was twelve years old. My parents were busy, and just did attend church much for while . After my older brother died in an auto accident they stepped it up a lot.
Presbyterian Church, sprinkling.

good question. and thanks for asking.

for me i was 13, during revival at a hard core southern baptist church.

farmers all, or at least for the most part.

in a creek. cold and a bit stained or muddy.

the cows upstream in the beef pastures and milk cattle pastures drank up stream.

a full immersion, but i hear tell a sprinkling might be just about as effective?

it just depends upon who is telling the story, and who do you wish to believe??

I was about 3 months when the first of several took place the first time was in a Presbyterian church.

I was confirmed in the Lutheran church.

For a while my friend in High schools father was a Baptist preacher and i went to his little church in the country.

Because there were some lookers up there and it was on a Wednesday.

Fifteen, but it wasn't genuine. At my grandmother's prodding. Later, I realized that I wasn't really a Christian then, and I should be baptized properly in faith. So I was, about the age of 30, not sure exactly.

I don't hold to infant baptism, nor the theology attached to it. Baptism is for believers.

what i always liked most about the presbyterians was that descended down from the highland scots, didn't they?

i don't know. just asking. trying to learn more about the highlanders and their views of the world.

in the southern baptist church most are free to choose, but they'll draft you for war.

and of course the catholics just hated for the buddhists to take over the nam.

As an infant (maternal grandfather was methodist pastor), again later as an older kid in a less orthodox(y) church.

Don't know that either made as big a difference as the first time I got my willy wet.

Guess I'll find out eventually.

18, after a string of drunkeness and mailbox smashery, my heart was convicted

in the old tail race of an 1850s iron ore furnace, in March, that rushing water around them limestone boulders...

None of that heated baptistry wussy bs 😃

If I was told right 7 days old

Probably a few weeks old. Baptized at St. James Lutheran Church, Golden , Colorado.

Interesting how the different creeds approach baptism. Adult, immersion, all of that.

not to vary too far off subject, but back in the day all s. baptist converts came by the way of a flowing stream, clean, clear, stained or otherwise.

preachers/pastors served for free, and had a real job during the week. they were called to service or so believed.

a seminary trained preacher/pastor now can make big money if their story/lesson/related is proper.

now in the age of the PC, ya can't just go out there and rough it and expect to survive.

i'm not denigrating, or criticizing anyone, group, clan, group, or sect.

people are free to choose, and so they should do so.

13. The preacher that did it was banging a woman he was "counseling" so not sure if that's why it didn't take?

I was a baby. Catholic.

Seen the Baptist’s do it. Those bastards like to drown ya.
Saw another at a new fangled rock and roll church. The kind where everybody high fives. Thought for sure somebody was going to get electrocuted with the light show, sound stage, preacher kid jumping in the hot tub splashing around hollering and carrying on with a microphone in his hand.

Probably 2 or 3 months old, 1950. Catholic church where my parents got married and where mom's family attended. Dad was a protestant and in 1949, when they got married, he had to sign an agreement that any children from the marriage would be baptized & raised catholic.

About 34.

I think I was 26! I never thought too much about religion until I was out of the Army and back home.
Carol was going to The Nazarene Church with Ben. He was about 6 or 7, and wondered why he had to go and I didn’t. So I started going, and The Lord spoke to me. I made a lot of friends there, the Pastor was a great guy, and it was really working for me.
I had always believed in God and Jesus Christ. Mom taught me that, but I never really pursued a relationship.
So I got baptized (immersion) and became part of the family. Carol and I even taught a jr high Sunday School, at least until somebody discovered that I smoked! he asked me to quit teaching, which I did. A few weeks later they were asking for more teachers and someone to work with youths!
I lead a Wednesday night bible study with adults, and continued attending and being part of it.
That is up until Carol walked out. She agreed to church counseling to try and save the marriage, but her mind was already made up (by then we had a new pastor). He gave me a few bible passages to think on, but that was it. My world sorta ended for a while. For about 18 months, I didn’t care if I woke up in the morning. Not one person from that church ever contacted me to see how I was doing or anything. Maybe the fact that her parents were board members or whatever, but for crying out loud!
After I regrouped and found Penny, I attended her Methodist Church for a while, but I felt that it wasn’t getting anywhere, and to be frank, I didn’t care for the direction the Methodist were headed.
As it stands, my faith in God and Jesus salvation isn’t shaken, but my faith in people and churches, not so much. I know God knows me, and when He shows me a new direction or church that leads me, I’m sure to follow.
7mm

A few months old

I haven't been bowfishing for years

18

I was 9 years old, Southern Baptist, had a baptistry in the church. Was I too young, probably, But, I don't think age has anything to do with it, because you're either saved or you're not.

I thought I'd be the oldest non-Baptiste here.

Babtism is for believers.

I never was.

Which time?

what does the majic of baptism have to do with it at the end of the day?

just a worthy ritural? methodists, catholics, baptists, others?

we're talking about water here. water is different from air?

can someone make it to 'heaven' w/o baptism?

what kind of baptism and who chooses?

i just hate when lay theologians join.

and then choose to disagree.

and they say everyone else is wrong.

No, it depends on how dirty you are.

I too was 12 years old.

Initially, about 12 or 13 by a "non-denominational" (translation: holy roller) church that leaned heavily Pentacostal/Charismatic in deepest, darkest Appalachia.

About three years ago I converted to Orthodoxy (OCA) and was baptized and christmated into the Church. The best decision I've ever made. I think it really took this time.

did anyone ever get schorched or burnt when escaping from hell?

fire-baptised baptists? say what? who is that, and where from?

no, no worries, i don't fall into that category, but some do.

This. You got to make that long walk to the front your own self. Embarrassing to face the preacher and congregation. But, i had been sprinkled as a baby and i could tell by my actions it didnt take.

Later when a cute gal was going to meet me behind church one night if i got saved.....

Well, suffice it to say i was on the Hallelujah trail.

Well, later on after I got older and married a while I came to the realization I really did need to be saved. Yeah, it was probly that or prison.

Probably about 4 or 5 days old.
Pretty sure I was still shell shocked from getting circumcised after being born.

Thank you god for not letting me have that memory of getting my junk cut.......

Roman catholic...
Not by choice
But if I turn I burn according to them........
Its all about the Benjamin's and lazy fuggs exploiting others beliefs anyways...

13 when I was babptized.

23.

I had been attending a rather (theologically) Liberal (non-UCC) Congregational Church for about a year and decided it was time to make a profession of faith and be baptized. I kinda raised an eyebrow when the pastor said we could have it as part of a service or in a more private family session. “Come again; huh?”

When I married my wife 7 months later one of the first things on my agenda was finding a more faithful congregation.

God uses all kinds of broken stuff to bring about his purposes and I’m grateful for that place where I could recover from my upbringing.

Super grateful He brought us to where we are now and for the Heavenly City toward which He is taking us!

Being born into a Lutheran family I was baptized as an infant. Years later when e switched churches I had to be baptized again per the new church doctrine and I bucked it hard but agreed finally just to not hold up my entire family from joining.

PTL. Great, efw.

Sad but true. I had been told that I didnt need it again, and the baby sprinkle was the gift being bestowed by my family, like a trust or such.

But, HE said to be baptized, not get baptized. Not saying anyone has to take the dive, as one can be baptized by fire and some other MOA IIRC.

Im sure many are more up on that than me.

37

Thanks all there are some great threads going tonight.

Heck if I aint buried or creamated in one of their sanctioned and approved good ole boy outfits where the church ultimately gets a portion of the benjamins.
I burn also.......
The Jesus thing is kinda morbid in the catholic church also in all the ways he is celebrated.
The rope self whipping bloody back stuff in some countries.
Just one example......
No thanks.....

I think youre sharp enough to know thats not what HE said. I think HE said all believers who profess with their mouth.....

Some who add or subtract or reject His word (Bible) knowingly will experience a great gnashing of teeth.

at 53, i found a church i believed in , i felt the calling in my heart, nuff said

Too young to have a say in that nonsense.

Under a year.

The nuns didn't baptize me before they had the closing papers.

29 and still a work in progress. But, if I die tonight I will spend be in the presence of my Lord Jesus Christ for an eternity.

funny you ask. I get to baptize my daughter tomorrow at 3pm. She's 15, and understands the glory of Gods grace.

it will be a good day.

Ditto
Too many to remember all of them.

First time as a baby in the Presbyterian Church.
Then this past February at 61, Baptist style. Full immersion, outdoors (in a hot tub). That was cold but they wouldn't let me cuss.

got it done three times, figured the others had wore off, might need to again...

Like a booster shot.

I was 14 I think the first time in my moms Methodist church. My dad had passed and thought I’d better do it. Lost my way shortly after that and finally my wife made me start going to church and we finally found an independent baptist church that is awesome. Was saved on Easter Sunday and baptized about a month after that. I was 36 that was 2 years ago. Still struggle sometimes but getting better.

I was 9 years old when I decided to take hell off the table.

I think the age of accountability comes at different times for different people. It came for me then. I listened to Billy Graham on the TV and I understood. Ditto the preacher at church. I read the Living Bible version of Romans and I understood. Maybe not all the nuances, but the big picture.....yeah I understood. I understood and therefore was responsible for it. My folks didn't pressure me into it in anyway, I told them I wanted to be saved. Dad and I went and had a talk with the preacher the next Sunday night after church and I was Baptized soon thereafter on an Easter Sunday in a cold swimming pool.

I was 33 when I was baptized by immersion in the Mullica Hill Baptist Church.

Baptism is the first step of obedience to God AFTER choosing to get saved.

I was a baby who was not Biblically baptized.
There's no reason for babies to be baptized unless the denomination teaches that babies go to hell with out that ritual. The Bible does not teach that.

I was baptized in my mid teens about 6 months after I got saved. If I would not have been baptized, I would still go to heaven. However, I would be out of fellowship and my prayers would be hindered.

Does that make sense Wabigoon?
PM if you have more questions. You've had 3 tonight, so that's your limit. 😉

51 and counting.

Interesting.......

Age 29 at a genuwine Babdist church in Missouri.

Your avatar is a testimonial to your conviction.

9 years old and got a dose in Clear Creek, Ky. Many miles and mistakes between there and here, but I have not doubted since.

May the Holy Spirt be with all.

Same here.


And it didn't take....

12

Old enough to know what I had chosen to do, and why. A very important and determined action, As individuals with unique qualities and needs, such choices differ from one person to another. God knows this about each of us.

I was raised Methodist so sprinkled as a baby. Then was immersed by my own choice at 13 or14 in a creek west of town.

Ingwe, why do you suppose it didn't take?

I was an infant.

Lmao....... I should read the comments, huh😛

On my way.....

I have worshiped and made music in that church in the distant past - across the Delaware from where I was raised.

You prolly had a boner.

Lol

I got baptized and joined the Congregational Church on the same date when I was in the 8th grade. I talked a couple friends into going with me or I wouldn't have done it.
All I remember about the classes etc. is it was interesting and I kind of liked it and have not forgotten any of it!

24

Immediately

Wasn’t expected to survive

Limbo was a thing in 1963




P

We’ve had a couple of wide-eyed pastors that used to like to ramrod kids 5 and 6 years after a few days of summer vacation bible.

Kids that were just friends of kids that went to the church,

I was in with a meeting of a few members and a couple of deacons there, and it looked as if the pastor was the just pushing them through the works to make some fake eye candy aka numbers. “Hey hey, looka here we had a dozen kids get saved and will follow in baptism asap. Partly I think because we used to dump $3k-$4k on associational packages and decorations and logistics. Lifeway media corp mafia, overpriced materials.

These kids had no idea what they were saying yes to, too young in my opinion; brow beat in a corner for 30 minutes, straight exhausting coercion.

I was basically a newborn. Presbyterian Church.

I was 32 or 33. I watched baptismal services for years thinking I’d join in on the next one. Finally one Sunday I decided I was out of excuses.

For those of you who have been baptized twice or more as adults, that is "choosing" to be baptized, I have a question or two.

How many times was Jesus baptized?

And, why the need to re-baptize?

I was 12, It was my choice and I knew what I was doing. I had accepted Christ a few months before and was baptized in a Baptist Church. 57 years later I'm still a member and Deacon in the same Church.

12. In the Southern Baptist Church I grew up in.

My avatar is a statement about an enemy we all face.

I was 12, and also in a Presbyterian church.

Never was baptised.

22

18

Are you a preacher or seminary trained?

7, but it didn't count because I wasn't a believer. About 25 the 2d time when I was...and that one counted.

What the fugk are you guys talking about?

I've been baptized twice....
- Once as a baby Catholic, didn't have a choice.
- Once as a 23-year-old when I made my own choice in a protestant church.

Meant a lot to me at 23, still means a lot at 71.

Taking a bath with another dude standing in the tub.

😎

I was nine and baptized in the Methodist Church (not the UMC).

The Church of Rome had the practice of sprinkling babies in the belief that their sacrament was necessary for the children's salvation.

There were millions if Christians throughout Europe that disagreed with the Roman Catholic religion. They were of the belief that the sacraments did not impart forgiveness or salvation. Long before the Protestant reformation they taught that adults must believe on the Lord Jesus Christ to be saved. Only afterwards was baptism to be used. Then baptism was only a step of obedience or expression of their faith. It did not impart eternal life or salvation.

Throughout the middle and dark ages there was much persecution of those churches that rebaptized the adults who departed from Roman Catholic dogma and tradition, practicing believers baptism.
Throughout most of church history Christians have suffered persecution over this issue.

The best book on the subject is Trail of Blood. It's now free. I'm having trouble with the link below. The address is correct for your copy. If you want it and can't find it, let me know. I'll try again later when I have time.

Blessings

https://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Books,%20Tracts%20&%20Preaching/Printed%20Books/trail_of_blood_jm_carroll.htm

Happy Camper. Are you a pastor or seminary trained?

I taught what I posted as a teenager. I realized that someone's eternal destiny was more important than anything else in the world. This led me to study the Bible for myself and seek out the most biblically sound preachers that were within driving distance. After a time, I was offered a full scholarship to the best seminary I know of. I decided to turn it down due to a doctrinal difference.

I am a preacher as I believe that all of the Lord's disciples should be. My congregations are those who are handicapped, poor, and have nothing to give, but need Jesus.

Mark 16:15
"And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature."

I didn’t think so. Having studied The Trail of Blood I’m concerned for you and all that you would point to that view. It is a book that was written to probe a foregone conclusion rather than one that looked to discover truth. If it were a valid treatise it would be widely used in training and education.

I appreciate your zeal but zeal is not evidence for or a substitute for knowledge. Not many should consider themselves to be teachers even if one desires that office. Have you studied anything in depth beyond American Fundamental Baptist doctrine?

I was 10,full immersion in a muddy small lake. Not perfect ,still after 53 yrs trying.

I was baptized in the Catholic Church when I was just under a month old according to a certificate I have. I do not remember asking to be baptized or knowing the Lord God when it happened so therefore I do not believe I was truly ever baptized.

I am a Baptist, and I believe in the following, a person is baptized on the basis of his or her profession of faith in Jesus Christ and as admission into a local community of faith. Believer's baptism is often referred to as adult baptism due to the belief that faith cannot exist prior to the age of accountability. My true to me Baptism, was on September 23, 2006, at Lee Street Baptist Church, in Enterprise, Alabama, where I was fully immersed. Praise God!

Lynn

We are talking about being baptized. Some say it didnt take, some say its BS. But, for some, and I was one, it changed us from being like you.

As I said, it finally took on me after a few tries. It probly saved my life on earth, if it didnt save me forever.

From then on, in college and afterward, I studied the ring fingers of women in nightclubs before i took them home.

No longer did I live in fear.

Wow

Lynn

Miss Lynn
When you are babtized as a baby, isn't it called a christening. My wife was raised Catholic but can't remember the term. I was raised pentecostal, but we are now Nazerine.

IZ, are you saying our Faith is false? Have I studied to disprove Christ? NO, have made a study, nor do intend to!

I need to rather study more on the True Faith.

I was baptized at 18 months in the Methodist tradition (sprinkling babies) . It was 1 day shy of my folks 3rd Anniversary.

Mom got herself into some trouble, or so she thought. That next winter, we all moved into a new house. A few months later, the ladies from the Presbyterian church showed up wanting to visit. Mom let them in, and they talked for a good long while making chit-chat.

As she later recounted to my father that night:

"So we were talking nicely, and I mentioned that [our son] had been baptized at the Methodist church on Christmas Day by the same mininister that married on the day after. It was funny, because they just looked at each other and got up and left."

It was in that first telling that Mom realized what she'd said. Ooops.

She never got a visit from the Prebyterians after that. We joined the Presbys about 3 years later, and there were people that never treated us well.

Certainly not. I have no intention to imply that and don’t think that I did. I was raised in a church that didn’t preach the gospel. It preached a works based salvation. I was brought to faith there because I heard scripture. God sends out His Word and it accomplishes is what is sent for. I was not matured there in any way because it was impossible. Sound doctrine didn’t and still doesn’t exist in that denomination.

As I see it based on my experience and the study that I’ve been driven to because of my upbringing we, as Americans Christians, have a lot of horrible doctrine to unlearn. It took some work and a bit of painful honesty to get there.

To your original question I was baptized at 8 in Sulfur Creek. I’m thankful that it didn’t live up to its name in smell. At 38 I began to learn what my baptism and faith were all about. I believe that there is a mystery involved. Faith is a free gift. I certainly don’t deserve it.

shaman,
Some people seem to love their religion more than they love the people for whom the religion was given. Some people seem to place more importance on ‘the rules’ and the creeds and the catechisms than on the people who are the supreme object of God's creation.

Nice dance around on the question, but how old were you? GW

Miss Lynn must have been rather young, she still can't be a day over twenty-nine.

Sounds like the nice church ladies were a little judgmental.

I still have no clue what you’re talking about but you sound like a f a g.

Hahaha. Tff. If they showed a ring mark on the left hand third finger I didnt take them home from the nightclub. Duh.

Did you have a good birthday? Your ol lady slide you $50 bucks to go out and party?

Texczech,

Apparently I was "Baptised" as I was without a name until the moment the Baptism happened and God accepted my given name and me into his realm. The certificate I have says "Baptism". Truth is the Catholic Church has some odd ways about them, and as I got older I began to see things that made no sense to me according to the Bible, and were actually contrary to God's teachings. After my questioning started I drifted from God.

It is quoted that "Christening refers to the naming ceremony (to "christen" means to "give a name to") where as baptism is one of seven sacraments in the Catholic Church. In the sacrament of Baptism the baby's name is used and mentioned, however it is the rite of claiming the child for Christ and his Church that is celebrated."

So, in the Catholic Church both cermonies are a part of the "WHOLE" act of the child being given to God, but only after the parents, and the godparents who are all asked if they will allow for the name and the subsequent baptising of the child into the Holy Roman Catholic Church.

Excuse me for being longwinded in my explanation.

Lynn

10 then 57

Miss Lynn
Thank you for the answer. Not long-winded at all. I think you explained it well. Definitely something I didn't know. I don't have any problem with the Catholic Church, I just don't see the need for all the rituals for me. Personally I believe all the different denominations give us all a place to be comfortable with. Hope you have a good day.

I was 45 years old.

Lynn

I said 10 and 57. I was raised a Baptist at first in a church even at that young age I thought controlling. Sermons about the evils of being Catholic and how they worshiped idols and were all going to hell. To the depth that I didn't realize until I was 27 and was told my father sexually molested and raped my sister. My mom told me that the pastor said, in frustration as I take it, " Maybe your daughter is just a whore." That church eventually folded and we went to a very large non-denominational church. Too big, too impersonal.

When I started following Christ, as I try but am not very good at, I asked myself if when I was Baptized did I do it because I wanted it or because I was expected to. Given my childhood I believe it was because I was expected to.

Hey Free, any start is a good start!

Appears that at 64 years of age I am one of the oldest here to be baptized. Not proud that it took so long. But pleased to be a Christian. GW

Baptized in liquor before I could drive. Had a bit of a drinking problem by the time I graduated H./S. Baptized by fire at 19. Baptized in water in my late 20's or so. Why is it so interesting? How old were you when you watched the first human die? Did it affect your view of life & death? Did it make you want to get baptized?

IZH27,

It doesn't matter what my credentials are. I'm not applying for a job. Your criticism for not attending a seminary of your respect is understandable. Many criticized Jesus and His disciples for not submitting to their own masters. I didn't see a good reason to go to the dead seminary professors to ask for instructions for the living. I would not go to a vegan and ask her how to hunt and process game either.
My purpose is to lead the lost to the Savior.
My purpose is to bless my brothers with that which my Lord has blessed me. One of my brothers had a question and I answered it. Another man asked about baptism and he received a very thorough answer.

My library contains multiple shelves on various religions; more than required by a couple of comparitive religion classes in some Saducees Ivy League seminary. Out of the many books on Catholicism written by former Catholic priests, and by Protestants, I chose one written for the average guy. The book is concise, interesting, and is condensed from the books that survived the dark ages. The rare information contained therein predates the Protestant reformation and survived the Muslim and Catholic library burnings. It will not appeal to those who view baptism as a sacrament necessary for salvation. I won't either, because I teach what the Lord has taught me; that salvation is by faith alone in Him alone, apart from any works.

My questions are simply questions. You present yourself as learned yet it is fairly evident that your exposure is narrow and biased. There is a vast difference in sharing the good news and teaching. All are called to share the good news of Christ if they are believers. Few are called to preach and teach. That is where the danger of false teaching has entered the church throughout the ages.

Every man who calls himself a preacher/teacher claims that God taught him. Many divergent and incompatible views of Christianity as a religion and doctrine and practice supposedly do exist because of this. If the claim of being taught by God is true then why have a library of books from which to learn and why does God teach different men different and conflicting things?

Baptized/christened as an infant in Presbyterian Church, which I later joined at age 13. Although I have not attended a Presbyterian Church for over 40 years and have worshipped at a Baptist church for over 20 years, I have not become a member there because I am not convinced that there is a biblical mandate to be baptized with water, at least not since the days of John. I don't see where any of the apostles were baptized with water; Jesus baptized them, and baptizes us, with the Holy Spirit. I have come to believe that water baptism is a doctrine of man, not a commandment of God. I am glad my salvation does not depend on whether I'm right or not.

oldtimer303,

The saving Grace is you are a Christian now, and that is what counts. We all do things in our own time, and besides that God knew when you were coming to him, and he was content to wait, because he wanted you at your most hungry for Him and his Blessings.

Don't forget there are some things in life that are just that little bit sweeter when it has aged a bit :-)


God Bless you,

Lynn

Erasmus of Rotterdam was learned. Paul the Apostle was learned. I'm not learned. I must study daily just so that I can continue to learn what was lost. I don't expect anyone to believe me, but I trust the Holy Spirit to reveal what I study from His Word.

"Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual."
I Corinthians 2:13

I believe that He does this with other believers who study His Word as well. However, If any come to me with a different gospel or a fundamental doctrine contrary to Scripture, I reject it regardless of who they say taught them. For instance, the Morman elders told me that God gave Joseph Smith another revelation and another testament of His Word. Their confirmation of this is a burning in their bosom. I rejected that, however, I tried to teach them about the true God and true Jesus out of compassion, for their destiny is not with Him. They also lead many to the wide path that leads to destruction.

You are incorrect about my exposure being narrow. I have been raised Roman Catholic, trained for years in the religion of Darwinism, taught by Hindus who trained as disciples of the maharishi mahesh yogi, experienced a few years of work in the metaphysical disciplines of Taoism and the New Age movement. I've spent unknown hours in the assemblies of many Protestant faiths. Looking back at the past, I consider it as time and experiences flushed down the toilet.
Those differing views were anything but narrow.
I love many people in all of those traditions and count some as friends. However, I reject that which is contrary to Biblical revelation.

I do in fact have very narrow and biased views of spiritual matters. It gets more narrow as this time in my mortal body approaches the end. God's way is narrow. He addressed the religious leaders with complete bias and straight as an arrow.

John 10
https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/John-Chapter-10/

I wish to be like my Friend.

Infant baptized orthodox Lutheran. Since we believe faith is a gift of God, as is baptism (conveyed by water and the Word), it can be received at any time.

Still very happy with that.

67 in a horse trough in my driveway.

My views are very similar to Miss Lynn's. I was baptized by full immersion at the age of 13 in essentially, a Baptist church. Became a born-again Christian several years earlier.

I would agree. It is unfortunate that the Agency of God in giving faith and regenerating has been replaced by the agency of man.

HC
My observation of a narrow view of not based on study of world religion but rather the history of the Church and doctrine. The Trail of Blood is notoriously used by people who want to justify a narrow view. It is also notoriously laughed at by serious Baptist scholars.

The agency of God in baptism is something that was taught by the Apostles, post Apostolic Fathers, post post Apostolic Fathers, in the time of Augustine and forward to the Reformation. This isn’t a matter of opinion. It is a matter of historical fact.

Baptist theology, that from which modern Baptist denominations emerge, began in England in the 1640’s over one hundred years after the Reformation. They supposedly found new doctrine concerning Baptism, doctrine that had been missed for 1600 years. They argued from their present into antiquity. J M Carroll did the same thing. This is not the path to sound doctrine.

If you desire to stand where you do and place the agency of salvation and baptism on the shoulders of man as a choice that he makes you are obviously free to do so. I simply ask that you be honest enough to stop acting as though you are an authority on the subject. You have no ground to stand upon other than that which you have made.

Disclosure: Every comment that I have made on this thread is that of one who is learning and makes no overture as to having arrived.

The Jewish religious leaders were thoroughly educated, highly trained, and well versed in their religion. And they practiced a graceless and hypocritical religion. Jesus criticized them for it. This is what happens when championing religious education and religious training and religious rules and religious regulations becomes more important than the people that these things were designed to serve and benefit. With regard to the above, modern day Pharisees are the same as the Pharisees of Jesus’ day.

Don't remember...I was born very young.

Do you agree with Augustine on the doctrines of salvation? I've been quite open and have taught many places on this subject.

So far I only hear empty criticisms from you toward me. So what do you agree with the church "fathers" about baptism's role in salvation?

As an infant in accordance the lower-case "O" Christian orthodoxy.

I agree with Christ, the apostles and the traditions held and down through the reformation. From the beginning of Genesis to the end of Revelation God’s active agency in the salvation of man is never in question. Throughout the history of the church, Genesis through Revelation, beginning in the Garden, mankind’s repeated mistake is to take that agency and work of God upon themselves. It is our default reaction. Well meaning Christians take this route all too often.

13 Since then, I've felt His presence when having close calls with danger.

Jesus thought less of man-made ‘traditions’ of doctrine and obedience than either the Pharisees of His day, or the modern day Pharisees of today.

And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?... you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition. - Matthew 15:3-4

Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written:
“These people honor me with their lips,
    but their hearts are far from me.

They worship me in vain;
    their teachings are merely human rules.”

You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to human traditions....You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions!... you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. - Mark 7:6-13

By definition a Pharisee is one who follows rules, liberal or conservative, as a means of earning God’s favor and salvation.

ALL denominations within Christianity follow traditions. All are liturgical in that all follow an order of service be it high order or low order.

The definition of Pharisee does not apply as you are using it. Neither does your definition equate needless tradition that is extra Biblical to traditions that are sound examples of Christian orthodoxy.

Tough to beat a good baptism thread.

Well that ain’t the way that Jesus saw them. He didn’t just call em’ hypocrites, He also called em’ vipers, and whitewashed tombs...which outwardly appear beautiful, but within are full of dead people’s bones and all uncleanness. Meaning that they also outwardly appeared righteous to others (and themselves), but within they were full of hypocrisy and lawlessness. Jesus’ opinion of the Pharisees was clearly different than yours is. No they don’t. Sayin’ it’s so doesn’t make it so. Man-made ‘traditions’ of doctrine and obedience, just like man-made creeds and catechisms, are clearly all important to some...while others choose to put their hope and salvation in the righteousness and resurrection of Jesus alone.
Yes it does. Jesus’ opinion of them...which He made very clear...is an opinion that I happen to share with Him. And it applies to the Pharisees of His day, and to the modern-day Pharisees of today. The history of the church is ripe with examples of ‘Christian orthodoxy’ that is extra Biblical to the Nth degree. If one chooses to live by man-made creeds and catechisms and man-made traditions of rules and regulations and doctrines and obedience...all man-made standards of holiness...that’s their prerogative. Others prerogative is to put their hope and salvation in the righteousness and resurrection of Jesus alone.

Idk, them threads ‘bout shavin’ your ballsack or schittin’ in Pelosi’s driveway or what kinda coffee pot do you like are all
right up there too.

"Baptize Me, John." Something about the Holy Sprite descending upon Him?

Amen Antlers,. ☕ 🙂 👍 Jesus put it best!



"But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear."
Matthew 13:16

21 years of age. I am now 62 & feel as good about it as the day it happened.

Wabigoon,

I appreciate your question. It shows that you have a sincere interest in our Lord's Word and this event concerning Him.
There was lots of truth packed into that event.
Although these are some brief highlights, you'll benefit most by reading this a few times to remember.

Matthew 3

"Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him.
14
But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me?
15
And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
15
And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
16
And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
17
And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."
--------------------------------
Baptism is taught by my former denomination as a "sacrament," which imparts grace to the one baptized, to have original sin washed away from babies among other things.
I do not agree with that teaching. As many things, the true teachings in the Bible often get changed by unbelievers to mean something different.
Jesus rebuked the Pharisees for this as did the Apostles warn the churches. If it happened back then, it is certainly much worse today.

Did Jesus sin at any time?

Of course not. You've probably read dozens of verses proving this and doubtless agree.
Jesus is Righteous and without any sins.
Whereas man tries to justify himself before God with the sacraments, (good works), Jesus is the only One Who is righteous. He is the acceptable Sacrifice as a lamb without spot or blemish.

Did Jesus require the Pharisee Nicodemus to be baptized in order to be saved?
Read the first half of John 3 for the answer. I think you already did and sent it to me now to think of it.
Verse 16 ! 😄 👍

Here:
https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/John-Chapter-3/
He told the man that he was already condemned and that he must believe on Him (Jesus). Verse 18

Now, back to Matthew 3.
Jesus came to fulfill the Father's will. One of those things that righteous Jesus did was to give the example of Himself demonstrating the death, the burial and the resurrection yet to come. This is one reason why I believe that this took place in a river.

When you lost your bull, your son in law probably did not sprinkle it or pour a little dirt on it did he?
He covered it completely.
A burial is under ground. This is demonstrated by immersion or dipping under the water. The word "baptism" actually means to submerge, immerse, dip under.

Since John was not washing away sins, then why did Jesus tell John the Baptist to do this?

He gave us a physical demonstration of what would happen to Him when He fulfilled the Father's will in being crucified, buried, and arisen.
When you stand upright in the water, it horizontally crosses your body. Jesus was nailed upon a cross.

When John laid Him backward, submerging him under water, He was pointing to Jesus' burial in the tomb upon His back.
When John lifted Him up out if the water, this represented resurrection!

Do you see how rich the meaning is?

Jesus wasn't saved by this act. Of course not.....Neither is anyone else.
It is an identification with our Savior's sacrifice in Whom we believe.
Is it for those who place their faith in the water?...No.
Is the gift of salvation given in exchange for our obedience,(good works), of being baptized?....No.
Does salvation = the Savior PLUS obedience to baptism?....NO.

Salvation is only through faith which is in Christ Jesus the crucified and risen Savior. Period. Exclamation point.

At the moment you quit trusting baptism or any other good work and trust Him alone, two things happen.
1. You are given the free gift if Everlasting life.
It never ends, even though you will sin afterwards. Why? God did not forgive us because of any of our plans to quit sinning. That should not even come to mind. He did so because of His Son's sacrifice. No adding to that.
What happens when we sin afterwards? Discipline happens to His new children upon our time on earth, but he doesn't through us into the fire afterwards. We have that gift forever....

2. We receive the Holy Spirit. One of the very few times in history that He becomes visible to man is in verse 16 above. At the moment of faith in the sacrificed Savior, demonstrated by Jesus in His baptism, the Holy Spirit lives in us. We do not see Him, nor feel this occur. We take it by faith that our body has become the temple of the Spirit of God.

Salvation requires no work on our part.
Walking with the Lord and for growth to occur after that requires consistent work. This distinction must be made in spite of the denominations and church leaderships disregard to do this.

Do you have any other questions about this subject? If you prefer to PM, do so any time.

Lastly, the Trinity is clearly shown and heard at the same time. We see the Son here, the Holy Spirit descend, and the Father speak so that John and the others could audibly hear Him.

"And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."

Hopefully, this study answered your question.

Best regards,

Happy Camper

So who are the modern day Pharisees in your opinion?

Which historic confessions, creeds and catechisms to you hold as teaching doctrine contrary to scripture?

It's all well, and good to get into the fine points, never forget the Gift of His Grace.

No disagreement with that. The finer details help us see the graciousness of Grace all the better.

35.

Those who place more importance on religious rules and regulations than on other people, including other believers. They place their own holiness above that of others; because of the importance they place on religious rules and regulations and creeds and catechisms...they think they’re better and holier than others, including other believers. They love their religion, and especially the minutiae of its rules and regulations and creeds and catechisms, more than they love the people for whom the religion was given. And when other believers disagree with some of the theology of modern-day Pharisees, the Pharisees openly doubt, and even openly deny, that that believer has knowledge or is even a Christian. Such as:
Modern-day Pharisees castigate others for not believing the right things, according to them, and also criticize others for not fitting into one of their religious categories...or for not going by everything that they consider to be orthodoxy. Modern-day Pharisees exhibit no grace toward others...they look down upon others for not believing as they do regarding religious rules and regulations. They major in minor things, like religious rules and regulations and creeds and catechisms, to the neglect of major things, like grace and love toward others. They are the polar opposite of Jesus, and what He taught.

If you will read carefully the statement that you quote in isolation you should realize that it does not question the Christianity of whoever it was that I was responding to. To say that there is nothing Christian in what is read is not to say that person isn’t a Christian. I used to say a lot of unbiblical things as a Christian before I knew the issues better.


Do you find offense in the Westminster Confession of Faith? The Apostles Creed? The Nicene creed? The Athanasian Creed? The 1689 Baptist Confession? The Book of Concord? The Heidelberg Catechism? The Lutheran Small and Large Catechisms? The Shorter and Longer Westminster Catechisms?

“Examples of ‘Christian orthodoxy’ that is extra Biblical...” are:
That the communion elements become the actual blood and body Jesus. Praying to saints That the Roman Catholic Church is necessary for salvation. That sacred tradition is equal to scripture. That grace can be merited. That the Catholic Church is the one true church. That forgiveness of sin and salvation is by faith ‘and’ works. Indulgences. Purgatory. The infallibility of the Roman Catholic Church. That only the Roman Catholic Church has the authority to interpret Scripture. Mary as Mediatrix. Full benefit of salvation is only through the Roman Catholic Church. That penance is necessary for salvation. That Mary delivers souls from death, and that she brings us the gift of eternal salvation.

Nope. But I don’t deem ‘any’ of em’ bein’ important in relation to the message of the Gospel, or the extension of grace and love and forgiveness to other people, or in putting my hope and salvation in the righteousness and resurrection of Jesus alone.

Thank you for being specific. That helps with the conversation immensely.

33....same age as Jesus was when he died