So this report was put out by Johns Hopkins U and it had to quickly be buried. Video is long but not bad to scroll through.Basically no more people have died in the US this year, thus far, than in the last 6 years on average . Amazingly the leading cause of death.....heart disease, is down significantly. Elderly are dieing at the same rate as they always do and children are actually dieing at a lower rate than normal. In full disclosure I am nott discarding Covid as not being real...but is it really killing people at a rate that supports our countrys’ and the worlds reaction? This is something I’ve been trying to ascertain for a while and just couldn’t find the facts. How many Covid deaths would have been coded differently in any other year?

https://trevorfitzgibb1.medium.com/...finds-no-increase-in-deaths-4ace7dc22ca0

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/j...hows-covid-hasnt-increased-us-death-rate

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=emb_title&v=3TKJN61aflI

Just think how many would have died if you all hadn’t been wearing your masks....🙄

Ha..... toldya so

More evidence that I should be allowed to work from home forever.

Facts, statistics, charts, and videos aren't evidence! We learned that this month from the fringe left.

Good news is that Flu A&B have been completely eradicated. It simply doesn’t exist any longer.

Excess deaths is only way you can measure the real death rate of Rona. We have been running about 1k a day over average.

This shît is just bad flu juju for some people and regular cold/flu symptoms for others. Call it the flu lottery on how it’s going to affect you.

Personally, for the last 9 years living away from civilization for the most part. I have yet to get sick with a flu bug. When I traveled the US in my former career, I would catch a bug once, sometimes twice a year.

I not worried about catching the covid/flu. I’m also not seeking out any super-spreader events to test theories on the mortality of becoming infected. But, I also hate most people, so I don’t socialize a lot.

IMO, Covid is only differentiated from the other variations of flu bugs we’ve dealt with since birth by it being more easily spread by having a longer shelf life and the political black hat 🎩 work Liberals used to undermine Trumps booming economy and solid lock on being re-elected.

😎

Interesting ... heart disease, along with high blood pressure and obesity, are the leading co-morbidity factors. Those go hand in hand so often they can't truly be separated.

Also interesting, COVID-19 "works" two ways. One is cytokine storm ... cells rupturing, inflammation, mechanical inability to breath. The other is interfering with the hemoglobin's ability to carry oxygen. (Remember that Pres Trump was reported to have had 2-3 episodes of very low oxygen when he was hospitalized.) Both will trigger the heart to work harder to move more blood / more oxygen. In a diseased heart, that increases the likelihood of overload .. heart failure.

"Hmmmm".

Tom

We were told repeatedly that "Deniers" would see. By God you'll see, the increased deaths. Massive.

Data please

You'd best inform those who are counting, then.

The OP says Johns Hopkins contradicts what you are saying. You skipped the whole OP didn't you.

Are you a Russian bot?

From the comments section:
Re-read the article. It essentially says the number of deaths between 2018 and 2020 are the same but the usual cause of death, heart disease, respiratory disease, et al have decreased consistent with the increase in Covid deaths.

So do you think that all the other normal causes of death really stopped occurring or that those deaths still happened but were labeled Covid instead? Either way they proved there are no excess deaths of any significant increase?

That guy was spot on!

The Doctors who are signing the death certificate are saying the root cause of death in 264,875 cases was COVID-19. That is good

enough for me. I think you guys are overthinking this. Why do you not believe the Doctors who have years of experience that you do not

have? Right now there are over 82,000 people in hospitals with COVID-19 and the number is going up rapidly. 2 weeks ago, it was at 60,000

The problem right now is we are running out of Trained people to take care of them. The hospitals have expanded the number of beds, but there

are fewer people to take care of the patients as the Nurses and Doctors are also getting COVID-19 and are off work or worse die from it. Next 2 months

is not going to be good.

This is beyond doctors, this is about protocol and how the institutions and CDC advise the doctors on how to code a death. For example you are in 86 years old and in hospice, multiple organ failure or heart disease and then you pass and they perform a covid 19 test pre or post mortem and you test positive, you have officially become a covid death by the coding. Everyone knows you were going to die anyway. Just to be clear, I’m not saying that this virus like others before it doesn’t exist , I’m simply stating that it’s not as bad as they are making it out to be. We’ve had 100,000-200,000 new cases every day for almost a month and yet the death rates are no indication that the increased case loads means a [bleep] thing. We were losing 1,000-1,200 people a day months ago when we had a minuscule number of cases and suddenly with upwards of a million cases every 7 days we are still only losing 1,000-2000 people a day? Of course in that 1,000-2,000 people a day most are elderly who I am sure have no other illness? But remember, when they pass, no matter what it’s going to be a covid death! And how do those numbers play into the 7,000-8,000 people who die every day in America when covid wasn’t at play? And how about following the money......what’s in it for hospitals if an elderly person dies of natural illness vs dies of covid, is the treatment compensated differently by the govt? Sorry man....but the numbers just don’t add up to death dolling pandemic of epic proportions as the media and govt would have one believe.

Coded that way. But not really. Not one death in Alaska, to date, coded Covid did not have 1-5 "underlying conditions".

At best (or worse) Covid may have accelerated the time of some deaths. Everyone dies.

Don't lick gas pump handles or doorknobs......i.e. - take sensible sanitary precautions. Even if you do get it, you have a 99.5% chance of survival, perhaps with some future health problems from it.

Pretty good odds.

Socializing, vacations, un-necessary traveling and holidays are way over-rated anyway.

Quick, get in your protective COVID bubble and stay off the 'net.

The New World Order recently stated in their annual meeting in Davo's that the "covid" presented a unique opportunity to implement their agenda. They stated climate change was not working fast enough.
And the covetards cheer....

This needs to be posted EVERYWERE...........................went to get a Christmas tree yesterday & all the idjits were wearing masks.

I am convinced that the significant majority of the population WANTS to wear masks.

Insanity personified....................

MM

The normal response to COVID19 should have been to issue advisories and recommendations about hand washing, not touching one's face, avoiding crowds, etc., while pursuing the best methods of medical treatment, and left it at that.

PS Evidence is coming out that those who've already contracted one of the four strains of the common cold (one particular strain of the four) possess immunity to COVID19. This being the case, exposing everyone to that particular strain would be a viable approach to defeating it, just like exposure to cowpox (a very mild disease) was a preventative to smallpox (a very deadly disease).

Covid pays more than the sniffles so the sniffles is Covid.

I'll go right to the medical staff on the front lines

During this huge second wave of the deadly rona virus:


A good friend is a nurse/case manger in the PNW so she sees all of the intake stats for all of the local hospitals. She and her 2 nurse daughters got covid last month. Daughters mild symptoms for a few days and she was sick for 3 days then felt fine. This week 207 patients and 6 were covid. 2 in ICU on vent's and they are both in their 80's. Seeing lots of suicide/psych related cases, diabetes, heart issues, cancers that went undetected and/or untreated because of Covid, huge uptick in alcohol and drug related patients.


A local kid just died in a motorcycle accident and root cause of death was covid according to the death cert. Parents are suing hospital.

All of the nurses an dDocs I know say the cheap Chinese paper masks are a joke and refuse to wear them

You're gullible. I work with hospitals weekly across 3 states. You really should educate yourself.
Everyone has been wearing masks for months. How has that worked out, True Believer?

This ^^^^^^^^^ ... To use an internet term, Covid has been "monetized". CDC is also playing word games. A couple weeks ago, their website said +200K deaths "involving Covid". Now their website says +200K deaths "involving Covid, Pneumonia, and influenza". First "involving" not "due to". The 6% number is "due solely to" So, currently 15,000 (6% of 250K) due "solely" to Covid. As AlaskaCub pointed out, many, many, many, deaths due to underlying conditions, are being labeled as Covid simply because that is where the money is...

The CDC website also has an interactive graphic that shows Influenza related activity, by state, by week, for the past 10 years. Interestingly, this week shows ZERO states or territories above LOW influenza activity. Same week last year, nine states had HIGH or VERY HIGH Influenza activity for the same time period. Not my data. CDC data. As far as 13 million cases of Covid in past 8 months... Not even close to the 60-80 million cases of the flu two years ago.

Can Covid be a bad actor for certain cohorts? Indeed. However, no more so than any of several respiratory infections for the same cohorts. I eaves dropped on the wife's news program this morning. Apart from Trump Bad and Harris Good, three story lines: Covid, Covid, Covid... 20 solid minutes of Covid coverage indoctrination...

Gee, I don't know- maybe a couple basic common sense assumptions would be in order here? First off, it has been widely publicized that the hospitals get paid more for Covid cases than almost any other treatment presently considered. Combine that with the fact it has been reported that flu cases are down 95%, which is obviously untrue to any thinking human being. This alone should make you think all the numbers being reported are suspect at best. Also consider that masks have been required almost all public places for months now and yet cases continue to rise? Apparently, your reaction is to trust everything the media reports? I have a somewhat different reaction to the reporting going on these days....

Bob

So, COVID-19 cures heart disease?

We've shut the country down once, put mandatory mask wearing in place what has changed? Its here cases are going up and what are you gonna do, take precautions and deal with it.
We've got a flu vaccine and the flu is still here, were gonna have a Ronna vaccine and its still gonna be here learn to deal with it or you will live in fear like all the media wants its here just like all other bad [bleep] thats come into this country

No one in America has died of old age in 8 months.

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2771761

This is a quote from this JAMA article on COVID.

“ Between March 1 and August 1, 2020, 1 336 561 deaths occurred in the US, a 20% increase (267,312) over expected deaths ”

Something is really killing a lot of people that wasn’t around in previous years. Hmmmm

You can spin it all you want, but the people dying are not the ones hanging out at bars and hardware stores.

They’ve also been completely neglected. Nursing homes spread like wildfire. Cuomo thought is was ok to stuff them all together.

https://www.heritage.org/data-visualizations/public-health/covid-19-deaths-by-age/

It’s also so very interesting that these co-morbidity haven’t had any effects on influenza A or B, they just disappeared! That COVID just takes over all morbidity categories, and is the only disease recorded now. I’m sure this has nothing to do with how the CDC inputs the deaths of COVID. This phenomenon is similar to how Joe would get 100,000 new votes in an hour, and Trump would get one or two on election night. The vote counters and data inputters can make magic happen!

To date over 212 people in Baton Rouge have died of drug overdose.

Just a micro sampling of the Nation.

Johns Hopkins WAS including number of deaths attributed to covid-19 in their daily updated graph of total tests administered and total positives each day for the entire U.S.A. and each state independently, but for some reason, and without any explanation as to why, they all of a sudden not only stopped including number of covid-19 deaths in their daily updates, they even removed ALL the death numbers from their graph all the way back to when they first started graphing covid-19 numbers.

No, he's just another fuqking moron.

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/USA/united-states/death-rate

Utter BS

1. It's technically a cold virus.

2. It presents nothing like flu.

3. It has a rather unimpressive death rate, especially now that we quit treating it like ARDS and have figured out what treatments are effective.

4. The unlucky ones it hammers, it REALLY hammers.

5. A vaccine won't get rid of it, so these ridiculous shut downs are retarded.

We killed a lot of people in the beginning when they were getting put on ventilators almost immediately. That was a really bad idea that thankfully they learned from!

Yeah, we had a lot of people die in the beginning on vents that would be on high-flow now.

You still do not want to be intubated.

Most of our patients that get tubed die.

Thankfully, the vast majority of our covid+ patients just go home and don't require hospitalization at all, despite mostly being from high-risk demographics.

Are the treating physicians finding that the pathogen is becoming less virulent?

That is difficult to answer. If you are at a top tier institution using up to date accepted best practice treatments in a timely and appropriate manner, and the virus' death rate has plummeted, is it because the virus is becoming LESS virulent, or because your treatment is becoming MORE effective?

Hint: none of the aforementioned institutions will withhold treatments from patients to find out, because even if the virus is mutating to be less deadly, the data shows the best practice treatment regime to be much more effective than other treatment options.

Your reasoning is why I ask this question. It’s too hard for the common man to get sound first hand information. From what I have pieced together severity of cases has diminished across the board. The death rate per infect population is significantly lower. Treatment has improved due to early trial and error. Real on the ground data is golden as far as I’m concerned because the presentation of the illness appears to have changed radically since early summer.

I believe that it was in July that I read an article written by an Italian epidemiologist. Having worked in one of if not the most heavily impacted areas of the world his observation was remarkably different from most of the information being disseminated. His observation, cases in Italy having peaked, was that the virus was mutating and becoming less virulent. His observation was made in consideration of better understanding of the pathogen and the establishment of sound treatment options. At that time he was not seeing ninth and tenth decade patients are n the respiratory distress (generally speaking) as they had been earlier in the event.

Have you had the opportunity to see cases through the entirety of the American side of the pandemic? While not scientific, anecdotal clinical observation has its place in synthesis of data to reach conclusion. That’s the stuff that interests me at this point in the process.

One thing they already know Vaccines will get rid of the virus, not 100%, but close enough. Moderna new drug tried in

15,000 patients only one person got COVID-19 and it was a mild case. In the 15,000 that got a shot with Saline in it,

187 people got COVID-19. That is very good results. It is thought the others will have almost as good as results, over

90%.

They have years experience with a supposed “novel coronavirus”? Mmmmmkay

Vaccines “get rid” of viruses? You’re a dumb son of a bit ch !


The Flu comes every year while millions get the vaccine.

Doubt it was an "accident"

2700 died today from COVID-19. About Feb. it will be more than all the USA deaths in WW2.

9700 in the hospital with it tonight with COVID-19 . Nation wide they are at 97% capacity. The hospitals

can expand to at least 120%, the problem is they do not have the personnel to man it. Some places will be short

equipment and PPE .

At least old people are no longer dying from anything except the Kung flu. Flu deaths are at an all time low of zero this year so that’s good news...

I refuse to accept that you are really that gullible and stupid, but I'm getting damn close.Wear your mask! Jeezus.

The latest is Red Cross blood samples from December 2019 were recently tested and are showing Covid in many of the samplings and in some cases all samples tested in Oregon, Washington were positive for the VID.

Wifey got back from working in Amsterdam in late Dec. then came down with a 2.5 week case of wicked flu. She had all the VID symptoms except for loss of smell.

I ended up with a couple days of feeling like I was coming down with it, but it never took ahold.

I must’ve been an asymptotic super spreader. Damn.

😎

More than 100,200 patients were in US hospitals Wednesday, according to the COVID Tracking Project.
There were more than 2,670 deaths reported Wednesday, according to Johns Hopkins University.
Those totals have never been higher.

P.S. I would not believe anything on OANN. It is a wacky, tin foil, conspiracy site. In the OP some guy on OANN is pushing the narrative a certain drug is safe and effective. It is NOT effective. Google reliable medical sources.

OK OK - the disease seems unique and somewhat mysterious, some "expert" medical people have differing views and some strongly disagree on important points, the data are all fouled up and specious for more than one reason, and a thread like this is inevitable. But, the OP made a point.

So, two hypothetical questions.

If you know that the US experienced a total of xxx,xxx deaths per year on average for the past several years (maybe expressed as a % of total population) from all causes - and some expert told you last January you that in 2020 the US will experience about the same number of deaths in 2020 - what would be your reaction to that?

If you know that the US experienced a total of xxx,xxx deaths per year on average for the past several years (maybe expressed as a % of total population) from all causes - and some expert tells you that the US will be stricken by a horrible and devastating killer virus during 2020 and that yyy,yyy people will be declared dead from that virus - BUT that the number of total deaths in the US during 2020 from all causes will be the same as in previous years (xxx,xxx) - what would be your reaction to that?

Given the experience to date, what is the medical significance? What is the social significance? What is the political significance?

My reaction??
Covid has a great publicist.

Excess deaths... This year... 250.000 more Americans have died to date, then in the previous 5 years at this date.

Meaning... there are 250.000 more deaths then there should be, including every cause of death.. But... Covid 19.



.

"She had all the VID symptoms except for loss of smell"

Some antibiotics will cause you to lose your sense of smell and taste. It happened to me when I was taking antibiotics for an infected finger. I know 2 people who lost their sense of taste after bypass surgery, I guess from the antibiotics they took.

"Given the experience to date, what is the medical significance? What is the social significance? What is the political significance?"

What is the financial significance as well?

This post runs quite counter to the data presented by the person with Johns Hopkins U in the OP. Please provide a credible source for your statement.

Well... just look up Excess deaths US... and you will see.

Its not to difficult to find out yourself.


Raw death numbers: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/...p;time=earliest..latest&region=World

Compared to the previous last 5 years, mortality exceeded expectations by 250.000+ Americans.


The JHU article you want me to read was retracted...

Briand claimed no increase in deaths... but when looking at the numbers, Briand found that nearly all causes of deaths have gone down in 2020.. but more people have died then "normal" compared to the previous 5 last years. To the tune of 250.000+ by now.


"When Briand looked at the 2020 data during that seasonal period, COVID-19-related deaths exceeded deaths from heart diseases. This was highly unusual since heart disease has always prevailed as the leading cause of deaths. However, when taking a closer look at the death numbers, she noted something strange. As Briand compared the number of deaths per cause during that period in 2020 to 2018, she noticed that instead of the expected drastic increase across all causes, there was a significant decrease in deaths due to heart disease. Even more surprising, as seen in the graph below, this sudden decline in deaths is observed for all other causes."

"Briand concludes that the COVID-19 death toll in the United States is misleading and that deaths from other diseases are being categorized as COVID-19 deaths."

---

"Robert Anderson, chief of the Mortality Statistics Branch of the National Center for Health Statistics, also disputes Briand’s analysis. According to Anderson, Briand didn’t account for seasonal changes in deaths. “In the spring of 2020, during a period where we normally should be seeing declining mortality, deaths continued to increase and were at unusually high levels through the spring,” he told Lead Stories. “So, the comparison of the most lethal weeks in 2018 with the most lethal weeks of 2020 is not appropriate.”

“In 2018, deaths followed the normal pattern (although at a higher level than normal). In 2020, deaths did not follow the normal pattern…they should have been declining in the spring, but instead increased substantially,” Anderson added."


Again... Raw death numbers: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/...p;time=earliest..latest&region=World


.

I have - went to the graph you cited and a bunch of other death info sites. The graph from which you quoted "excess deaths" does show a meaningful spike in all deaths in March through April, and another uptick later. However, that same graph has been headed sharply down and almost down to the annual lines by October - and indeed may well be sharply below the annual lines by the end of this year. The "excess" could be greatly diminished or even eliminated when the year final accounting is valid.

This could mean that the viral surge did account for a higher death rate for a period of time (maybe taking those most vulnerable), but that the sharply decreasing rate may show something rather normal overall as final for the year.

I'm not so smart as to be able to predict an accurate year total, but the Johns Hopkins study and its findings seems still to stand credible.

Well.. more and more people are admitted to hospitals all over the US.. so it seems more people are getting sick. Its exponential... Resulting in less and less beds available, even for those that need it for other reasons and the Covid patients.

Right now it´s 1000+ excess Americans deaths, each single day, compared to a "normal" day for the last 5 years.


So.. at the end of the year we will most likely see a huge uptick in more excess deaths...

In NH, the vast majority of deaths are related to long -term care facilities. It sucks but those folks are compromised anyway. Those locations are also where PPEq use has been at its highest locally.
Nationwide, given that a high number of deaths are in urban schitholes such as NYC, I find it difficult to muster up any type of emotion.

My father in law age 75 got it, lasted 10 days, about like a flu all healed up. Wife’s god parents both 70 and 71 got it about 7 days sick , typical flu both healed up. All tested positive. This is in the last 2 weeks.

Saw a report yesterday that said over 50% of all deaths in the US came out of nursing/long term care facilities. Do very many of them die with any regularity when Covid wasn’t here?

"It's exponential.."

The World Health Organization say, there was 275,000 excess death in the USA from i Jan to 16 Aug . Of that number 169,000 were covid.

CDC say pretty much the same things, they said there was 299,028 excess deaths from 1 Jan to 3 Oct.

I agree with Northman. CDC and World Health Organization have very similar numbers Northman gave.

Looking only at the State I live in:
Oregon Health Authority data. Total deaths, all causes.
2017: 36,640
2018: 36,191
2019: 36,397
2020 Jan - Oct: 32,330

sad poems to make you cry

[quote=longarm]Looking only at the State I live in:
Oregon Health Authority data. Total deaths, all causes.
2017: 36,640
2018: 36,191
2019: 36,397
2020 Jan - Oct: 32,330


Seems its been starting to spike in November..

23 deaths on Nov 25
13 deaths on Nov 26
6 deaths on Nov 27
9 deaths on Nov 28
8 deaths on Nov 29
12 deaths on Nov 30
19 deaths on Dec 1
24 deaths on Dec 2
12 deaths on Dec 3
30 deaths on Dec 4, compared to 3-8 regularly sine July.


We´ll see by year end.

I don't disagree with Northman regarding the sources/data he is quoting - I think he is noting what he sees there. All well and good.

I simply doubt the accuracy, and maybe the veracity, of those sources. I tend to trust the statements of medical academics somewhat more than government agencies. Hence, the questions posed.

The discussion will be moot when 2020 ends and IF we are able to get the actual death numbers from a reliable source. "Excess" or not, there is something final and definitive about death - and soon we should be able to get an accurate total number for 2020. One would hope.

Isn't it curious that China isn't reporting huge numbers? In fact, it's all but gone there according to the numbers.

Based on current infection rates by the end of the year we will see 4,000 a day die.
No it is NOT just like the flu.

Anthony Fauci, MD, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Disease, put it plainly: "The seasonal flu that we deal with every year has a mortality of 0.1%,” he told the congressional panel, whereas coronavirus is "10 times more lethal than the seasonal flu," per STAT news.

Don’t worry if Biden makes into office the corona will be in the rear view mirror by February.. But they will roll out the corona from time to time, when they need to get all you sheep to fall back in line.

4K a day in the United States?

go to the hospital with the flu and they will put you in the Covid line, flu line doesn't exist anymore.

While covid itself is 10 times more lethal , he then takes his statement out of context and states it as an absolute, without consideration the main cause was heart disease.

Lots of reasons more people being admitted, everything from insurance pays for emergency/hospital, no wait as opposed for month and 1/2 appointment wait at doc., more baby boomers, and the biggest one

the PLACEBO effect

Personally Im playing SCI,,, service corp. international

Can't believe some folks believe the words that come out of Fauci's mouth. Do your homework as most of us have. All the numbers have been swayed politically!

God you people are morons. No wonder the virus is spreading so rampantly

Hey we don't go on your knitting forum and call you a moron.


anyway since the readership numbers of Campfire is not statistically significant to be a consideration as a covid vector----- I guess you just pointed out who is the Moron.

Winter has always been hard on old people you moron.

74 million Trump voters. I wouldn’t be surprised if at least 1/3 of those are ravenous cult followers like the folks on here.

That’s a big enough population to do the damage that is being done.

It's a virus. It knows no religion, color, creed or political persuasion.
It can get to you regardless of your precautions or belief system.
Diagnosis and treatments are reflecting improving results.
But the elderly do pay a high price when they catch any virus.

I see the news every night, Mich has 380k cases of the virus, it also has a population of 10 million
Do the math, less than 4% of the population has been diagnosed with Covid, That's still a lot of folks, but it also means 96% have not caught it as of now.

Na. Most cult followers are liberals
Called
Socialists
Communist
Maoist
Democrats

My favorite part about the internet is how everyone can find a site or link that supports their view. Then post it into discussion like it is irrefutable proof of their righteousness.

Go on, tell me more about what you read on the internet.

Laffin..

Simple mathematics should be explanation enough.

If that were true and the bolo was real, it would kill randomly, including politicians, famous actors and musical stars.

Athletes and those famous for bein famous.

But of course, it hasn't.

The NFL has proven the stupidity of the situation.

The same week, they test positive, then negative 3x, then they can play.

OBTW, this is about the time in the thread that some believer posts that someone they know died from it, so everbody else STFU.

PREZACTLY

Dominion was used to calculate death rates?

This.