Is it time to lay the "pre-64" Winchester crap to rest? That's almost 60 years ago now (for the younger kids that skipped math class). I have a "pre-64" Model 12. It's a very fine pump shotgun. I could shoot it another quarter million times and it wouldn't be worn out. It does the job for sure. I also have an early 90's Wingmaster that when compared side by side is a tin can, but in maybe 10,000 rounds (admittedly not that many) hasn't had an issue.
I will say I haven't been exposed to many Model 70's, although a cousin has a 300 H&H that is a might fine rifle. I just think we are so far past 1964 that it is no longer relevant.
I've put on my asbestos underware and kevlar vest, so flame and hammer away.

I don’t see there being a big demand for them in the future. The people that appreciate them are dying and younger shooters don’t buy anything you can’t call a “platform”.

Yes. Send your pre-64s to me and I will dispose of them properly.

Winchester Model 70's built before 1964 deserve to be SHOT by RIFLEMEN. I can't stand safe queens or the fetishistic prices paid for same.

I think there will always be a demand and they will continue to increase in value as they always have. People appreciate quality.

My next door neighbor and hunting partner has a pre-'64 Mdl. 70 in .300 H&H Magnum. He has killed several elk and deer with it. I think he is going to keep it.

L.W.

Take a look at the pre 64 checkering,inletting and machine work on the actions and tell me about quality. There was a reason they went the direction they did . Take a look at a new Winchester 70. Better all the way around.

This.

I own three pre-64's M70's and they are all "low cost" customs. Most recent is an early 70's Dale Goen's 6.5x55 purchased not long ago. I hope to have it out Friday for the first time.

It’s a quality benchmark…don’t think it’ll ever go away.

It’s also a selling point…that won’t go away either.

I’d guess it’ll always matter. More to the seller right up until it’s sold, then more to the buyer, especially when they might become the seller someday. 😎

Beautiful, EdM

Flawed logic...

Are you saying Winchester moved away from the pre-64 era guns to make them better, or am I misunderstanding you?

I’m in my thirties and I have 6 pre-64 Winchesters. I’ll own more as soon as this house is paid off and my wife and I build the casita which will include a reinforced gun room. 2 more years as long as the world keeps turning….

That appears to be what he said. It’s probably not the first or last mistake of his life.

When you are good enough to disassemble a bolt, take a good look at the machining that went in inside those early bolts. Cheapening the production cost of a Model 70 Winchester didn’t actually start in 1964, they started streamlining the metal work, well before 1964…

And it is well documented that the changes occurred as cost saving measures, particularly to compete with Remington.

This.

Here's my pre-64 Super Grade. You can easily distinguish it from anything they made after 1963.

I have a 16 gauge model 12 that I built from parts All the parts are "pre 64". It is a one of a kind, serial numbers do not match, probably no two parts came from the same gun, Skeet barrel, solid rib, crow foot safety, gorgeous highly figured chocolate colored Herters wood. It's about as perfect a grouse gun as can be had. When I get to the point where I am no longer able to shoot it, I am pretty certain it is going to make someone very happy and proud to own.

Over a lot of years I just accumulated parts as spares for my other M-12s and at some point I realized I had well more than enough parts to assemble a whole gun, plus I had the tools to properly fit them all together.

I like them. I don’t harbor any belief that they are the end all be all. They are just cool old weapons that work. Kinda like an old watch or hand fitted tool.
Besides, I’m a bit of a Winchester fan.

As to them holding or increasing in value. All one has to do is look at what M77’s and 700’s are fetching today. It’s crazy.

Post '64 Winchesters were cheaper to manufacture, end of story.

Pre '64 M70's shoot OK by me. 100 yard group during load development...





It's a boring rifle and I like them like that.

Ahhhh, the "pre-64 crap" applies to the Model 70 rifle, correct?

Pre-64 won't go away. They don't make them anymore. There will always be a market for them.

Pre-64 continues to increase in appreciation, recognizing old world construction techniques that are not utilized in todays manufacturing process. People now assemble firearms, when pre-64 Winchesters were hand fitted with craftsmanship.

Sadly this is the change in modern rifle technology, and it isn’t about quality…

The same can be said about almost ALL firearm brands and manufacturers.

Most of what transpired is due to the consumer market.

Customers shifted gears from wanting a royal blue rifle with high grade walnut to a rifle with much less expense spent on fit and finish, but accurate enough to get the job done.

Then you factor in the bean counters managing most of the firearm manufacturing companies, and answering to investors, and you get what we see today.

Pretty sure pre-64 applies to all winchesters produced prior to 1964, particularly in the smokeless powder era.

I'm talking bone stock rifles...no aftermarket tweaks or parts. In a hypothetical situation, say the hunt of a lifetime in a very remote area with weather extremes, and your rifle HAD to work first time, every time...would you grab the pre 64...or would you grab the 700?

That is true, but the model 70 Winchester was always regarded as a better rifle and cost more than a Remington of the same era…

I’m taking my pre 64 to TZ in 27 days.

The difference between work done by hand and work done by computer controlled designs. People can't duplicate jobs that are done over and over and over again as well as a properly programmed computer controlled machine can.

I like those old guns because they have the sort of character that comes from being worked on by people.

Same here. The people at Winchester knew what they were doing. It is evident in their work which is timeless.

People have grown accustomed to synthetic stocks and finishes that may or may not resist the effects of weather better than the old world blued steel and walnut. But for many years, that’s what people had and they worked fine. There may have been more care or maintenance that went into hunting and caring for such a weapon, but that’s part of being a shooter and a hunter.

I find charm in old guns that show the wear and scars of obvious use. They help tell a story. One of my Model 12s was gifted to me by my grandfather after his passing. There are two small spots on the receiver where some deer blood was left on the metal by mistake, causing the blueing to wear off. I’m sure that irked Grandpa, but I love those little spots on that gun. Ditto for the wear on the blueing where Grandpa carried that gun, right where the action and barrel meet. I carry the gun by the same spot, it’s natural balance point.

You SUCK!

Take lots of pictures!

I own half a dozen pre64 M70's .... but I own even more junky old Mausers... not hard to guess where I stand on the issue...

Good luck in Tanzania.

If you require an explanation about craftsmanship and pride of ownership, no one can help you.
Stick to Savages and Mossbergs.
That ought to ruffle some feathers.

Originally they did it to make them cheaper. They had high labor costs because of antiquated worn out machinery which caused a lot of hand work to be done because of the sloppy tooling they had. Yes the post 64 rifles were better mechanically but not asthetically. The new Winchesters using CNC equipment are a way better product then the pre 64 model 70`s.

Take a look at a Cooper with its hand checkering Vs any pre 64 Win and tell me about quality and character.Hell look at the early Ruger 77`s which were hand checkered and sold in the same ball park figures as the Wins. if you want apples to apples.

You've clearly never handled or shot one.

Obsolete. Nobody wants that old wood and blued steel crap.
Embrace today’s technology.

Not true ,my Dad had about 6 pre 64`s.I have had several and never found one worth keeping. Believe me there was nothing magic about them.

PS The esthetics of the 70 were being sacrificed for higher profits a few years before 1964, also, revealed by such things as switching to a plastic butt plate vs steel, and lower quality checkering on the stock. Some of the latest pre-64 specimens weren't quite up to the reputation, but pre-1962, they were pretty universally very nice rifles. Pre-war, even better.

Blasphemy!

I wouldn't grab a 700 for anything.

Mention "Pre-64 M70" and the term "bean counter" inevitably enters the conversation. I think it's a rule. Kind of like the mandatory use of the word "insipient" when talking about case head separation in an article.

Winchester is a business, and the primary goal of any business is to make money. Had Winchester continued to offer the original version the cost would have gone up dramatically and fewer and fewer rifles would have been sold. They made a choice to manufacture a more build friendly version and kept the doors open. It's always easy to judge in hindsight.

Once a good gunsmith gets a hold of the action ,they are tolerable. Nice looking rifle for sure.

I've read that the pre-war Model 70s were the finest, labor after the war got expensive and quality started to slip in the 50s up until 64 when the rifle was overhauled. Still, I find nothing wrong with the post 64 push feeds as a quality hunting rifle. A pre-war 70 is much like a Rolex divers watch, not for everyone but those who can relate to the quality of a fine thing, well designed, purpose driven and well executed.

I like the pre 64 70s. But there are problem rifles among any of them too.

The way I see it is true the younger guys fall for all the advertised hype and long range small caliber high BC fast twist stuff
A percentage of these guys will find a passion for the hunt and figure out the advertised hula is not nessesary and figure out that a pre64 mod 70 in 30/06 will do everything pretty well
Is older guys went through that same thing when the belted mag craze hit.
I recall thinking my 03 Springfield was a thing of the past and just had to have a7 mag and 243
I find them both useless for my needs today

I have a pre-64 standard grade 30-06. For a while I had a more recent 30-06 M70.
I used to take them out to the club and shoot one box of ammo I'd loaded for matches a long time ago.
Group size was slightly smaller but more uniform with the old one. The stock on the new one fit me better. Old one feels a little clunky. Trigger goes slightly to post.
Kept the old one for sentimentality. Was an old buddies gun.

Certainly a pre 64 fwt in a quality synthetic stock makes a fine hunting rifle!

Pre 64 model 70's are cool as can be and will probably always have a cult following but they are largely responsible for this fascination with controlled round feed which is one of the biggest loads of crap that has ever been foisted on the shooting public. Everything we have learned about seriously accurate rifles over the last 50 years we've learned from the Remington 700. There's a reason for that.

Frankly? Neither. There's a reason all my serious hunting rifles are based on 98 Mauser actions. I'm not saying the pre-64 M70s are bad rifles. I'm just saying I think the Mauser is better.
PJ

Bugs, ask yourself what the origin of controlled round feed was, then ponder if it just might be useful now and then.

I would grab my post-64 stainless CF 375 H&H M70 which I have done and will do again next year. But it has had a stock replacement by the previous owner. Without the stock replacement it would go as well. Same can be said for my 30-06 FN Mauser that is not modified and worked in Namibia. My M700 rebore worked fine on a grizzly and black bear hunt in BC. My Ruger M77 35 Whelen did the same on an elk/moose horseback hunt in BC.

Controlled Round Feed was never about accuracy. It was about reliability (it prevented user-caused feeding flubs), and was mainly a concern among dangerous game hunters, and (in the days before semiautomatics) military procurement people.

mnmarluney: You are publishing your won stupidity by TRYING to demean a whole class of really wonderful, classy, reliable, valuable firearms!
Needless to say you have failed miserably (probably a lifelong trait!) in your pathetic attempt.
No need for the likes of you to wear any asbestos garments - you would be better served with a "tinfoil hat".
Sad and pathetic attempt at "attention whoring" by you - I surmise.
Sheesh.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

I have a pre 64 model 88 and my son has a pre 64 model 70 Featherweight 308. Those are our main hunting rifles. I have a couple post 63 model 94's. A 30-30 and a 32. I used to have the same pair in pre 64s but they left due to their value. I find the post 63 model 94's work just fine

The Pre 64 was and still is a great firearm. It was expensive to manufacture. Remington tooled up to make a CRF M720 in 1941-44. It was a fine rifle and only 2.5k or so were produced. It has become a Holy Grail of Remington production since the government ended up with them. They made a few m30 after the war from parts they had on hand. The M700 was pretty much a genius design allowing for an accurate rifle produced on the assembly line from single purpose production machinery. It drove Winchester to produce the post 64 push feed design in order to compete. Their advertising along with Mike Walker and Jim Stekl winning Benchrest matches were a one-up for Remington. That was back in the day when Remington actually had craftsmen on the line at the factory. Production costs and Unions have hit all companies but Remington took some bad turns by settling court cases that weren't actually their fault and not changing the trigger design to a less foolproof mechanism.
There are no dual opposed lug bolt action rifles that do not impose on at least one of Paul Mauser's patents. That design is still going strong.
All designs can be improved on and CNC machinery has allowed precision manufacture to blossom into a new level of precision. The M12 is better balanced but it has it's own parts breakage. It'll take a lot of abuse before it breaks though. The M870 is heavier and not so well balanced but it is decent enough.
Many of the great stockers are gone now and many hunters have gravitated to synthetics. That Goens stocked M70 is a fine rifle. We have some good stockers and gun builders today that can compete very well with the older generation, but prices are higher and good wood is hard to come by.

I only have one pre 64 model 70. Chambered in 300HH. It's the back up for my Mauser. It's a fine rifle, it just doesn't fit me well. I will take any pre-64 Model 70 offered, if the price is fair. As far as lever action pre-64, they take second place to my 99 Savage, all day long!

Very good knowledgeable post. I enjoy some older Win bolt actions, but favor Mausers for the most part.

I’ve owned several Pre 64 model 70s in various calibers. I’ve owned a couple custom made rifles and some custom made rifles from the 1930s-1950s. If you have or had a pre 64 model 70 and think the inletting, checkering or any part of fit and finish is better on the newer Japan made versions you are completely retarted and or need to get your eyes checked. The Pre 64 model 70s I’ve owned were about as close to a custom as can be had. My model 54 270 has some of the best metal to wood fit I’ve ever seen. The inletting was all done by hand on the older Winchesters.

The stock fit is another thing that escapes the dullards. If you automatically strap your 3x9 tasco on any rifle you buy you have no idea what I’m talking about. If you however shoot with a reciever site you will see the difference. You cannot shoulder my model 54 and not be looking directly thru the Lyman peep to the front site. No adjusting the head or trying to center the front site just shoulder and your there. They made rifle stocks that fit riflemen back then. Now the stocks main purpose is to reduce felt recoil for sissy men lol. Big plastic garbage that points like a crowbar with a thick rubber pad for the vaginas. How many “hero’s” you know that have a rubber recoil pad on a .243? lol absolutely embarrassing to watch.

Anyone with common sense will like them. The problem is that it is getting harder and harder to find.

Pre64 Model 70s are not light and in some ways they aren't pretty. But there was a lot of thought that went into their design and the American workers who were involved in their production had a great deal of pride. There are rifles out there that might be more accurate but it is the sum of the Pre64 Model 70 parts is what counts. You can tell yourself that they are overpriced and that getting a Marlin Lever action makes you look like a character from the television show Yellowstone or the Taylor Sheridan Movie Wind River and that is cool and the fad right now but the bottom line is that they tend to go bang every time you pull the trigger and they are more than willing to finish the job. Corporate penny pinchers don't always make the best decision. There really aren't a lot of them if you really think about it and they have a lot of mystique and represent one of the high water marks of American manufacturing and gun culture.

I have killed 13 animals with 3 different pre 64 M70s that I rebarrelled, re stocked, and re scoped.
I have killed 9 animals with 4 different Rem700s that I rebarrelled, re stocked, and re scoped.

You don't have to read De Hass "Bolt Action Rifles" to know the pre 64 M70 is better.

I've got rifles from Remington, Mauser, and Winchester and like them all. Each has its own charm and aesthetics, but for working rifles I would have a hard time telling you which one is more reliable, accurate, or comfortable to shoot , to be honest. A lot of rifles have taken shortcuts over the years to save production costs- anyone own a Remington 700 with the pressed checkering? I switch over between my Remington 700s and Winchester Pre 64 70s and Post 64 CRF models for any hunt, depending on the mood. Personally, I don't see a huge difference in build quality between any of them but the sentimental value is with the Pre 64 70s for sure and I often carry one of them for a hunt if the caliber is suitable- just for the nostalgia.

My 46 year old son has his choice of any of my rifles he chooses to hunt with and he always chooses my Pre 64 Model 70 30-06 for deer and my Pre 64 Model 70 300 H&H for elk. He just prefers the feel and additional weight of those rifles when shooting and he has done very well with them over the years. I doubt I will be getting either of them back any time soon. Any perceived shortcomings in any of them is a moot point to him and many others since they do their job so eloquently when called upon.

I bought the FW in the classifieds a few weeks ago and handed it to my 15 year old grandson yesterday
He’s first comment through a smile was it’s soooo smooth

Me too brother, me too. Since it was a Winchester thread, I stuck with it...but the reality is if you bump into me on a hunt...it's a Mauser on my shoulder. 6.5 Swede, 7x57, 7.65 Belgian, .30-06, 8x57, 8mm-06...1896's and 1898's.

Well said.

I've handled hundreds of pre-'64 Winchester 70s and still own a few of the less common ones from when I traded the majority of my Father's collection to Bearrr264 for a section of irrigated farm ground. I prefer the newer 70 FWTs made on CNC tooling. QC is tighter and I happen to like the aesthetics of a forearm with a well proportioned schnabel tip.

LOL...to each his own. Keep selling grandpa's M70's if it makes you happy. It sure makes me happy. We can all be happy!

I took my first and biggest whitetail with a pre-64 M/88 in 1974 and since that time have used only pre-64 M/70's for my hunting adventures. Never had a problem of any kind with my model 70's most have been factory but I've owned customs too.

I have 3 Pre 64 Model 70's in 22 Hornet and 1 Copper Model 40 in 22 Hornet. Yes, the wood on the Cooper is better than the Winchester. However, the Winchester has a much better action and overall metal work is superior as well.

I'd rather have a Mosin than what's being peddled off by today's manufacturers, and I hate Mosins.

Still enjoy shooting this Pre 64 30Gov't06 once in a while.

I can almost smell that stinking sob.

There is nothing wrong with a Pre 64 Winchester. I own 5.

There is nothing wrong with a 1963 Corvette.

BUT as with anything from that era there has been progress.

As Charlie pointed out decades ago bolt actions have been surpassed.

A quality Semi auto is just as accurate, handles well and is far quicker if a second shot is required.

No Corvettes now have the slower manual transmission ---- hint.

The advances in metallurgy and the advent of CNC machinery to make modern firearms, has made the myth of pre 1964 Winchesters moot. Even cheap firearms do MOA nowadays, and I doubt many old Winchesters did that. Granted, there's something to be said about "old school" craftsmanship, but these were never custom firearms or made to that level.

Can I borrow your Kevlar??

Times have changed and so too has the technology used to manufacture the things we use. Modern rifles are phenomenally accurate off the shelf and the optics we’re using today allows us to more fully utilize the inherent accuracy in our modern rifles. The problem for me is that a new rifle doesn’t have any soul or character and it won’t have any until it gets used and can no longer be considered a new rifle. The pre64 model 70 comes “pre-loaded” with character and a soul….even the newer model 70’s inherit some soul from their forebear.

The model 70 is more representative of a time period in our history and less about “being better” than another rifle. The model 70 to me is the quintessential “rifleman’s rifle” and represents a time in our country where getting outdoors and celebrating the freedom of being an American by hunting, shooting and exploring were booming. With the federal freeway system and National Parks Americans were stretching their legs and exploring the wilderness which included hunting.

All my pre-64 bolt actions shoot MOA or better. Not sure where this idea that pre-64s aren’t accurate came from. I have had much more trouble getting new rifles to function and shoot accurately.

When my grandson, Owen, was 12 and getting ready for his first deer hunt he had some good choices out of my safes as to what he wanted for a deer rifle. I had some real good rifles to choose from.

He chose a heavily carried but seldom shot pre-64 Winchester FW 243 that a late friend in Tombstone AZ had used as his saddle gun. He used it for javelina and cous deer since the time he bought it new. It shows years in the scabbard. He has some newer and excellent rifles now at age 20, but the 243 FW is his pride and joy.

I have my dad's Mdl 70, originally in 30 govt 06, now in 375 H&H, put together by Dennis Olsen with an original Mdl 70 barrel. My dad shot his last deer with snow in the muzzle and commented on the new dog-knot under the front sight.

My other is an '06 three digit serial number, 36X. These three rifles are the last that would ever leave the family.

My next favorite is a plain-Jane commercial FN 98 9.3X62. An FN 98 is about as good as it gets IMO.



He also likes his Husqvarna 98 270.

My one remaining Model 70 is a pre-war. It isn't stock but pretty close. Serial number indicates a 1937 build date. It is the second bolt action centerfire I ever owned. It isn't going anyplace.

It has a transition safety. I cut half a coil off the trigger spring to get the pull down to three pounds. I altered the extractor so it would fit over a round dropped itn the chamber. I put a Pacific Research stock on it. That's all.

The pre-64 Featherweight I had is my oldest boys now. It has been restocked (Bansner) and matte blued but that is about it.

I find the Pre-64 FW to be very workable. Maybe the most ready to use sporter as it comes out of the box.I have drifted toward stainless rifles lately but still use the blued ones.

I, for one, don't think it is time to put them to rest.

There isn’t a stainless/plastic gun that is capable of killing more game or making a better hunter out of the owner, just by virtue of it’s machining and close tolerances. If there is anyone that needs 1/2 inch more accuracy from a rifle, I doubt he could use the extra accuracy to his advantage.

The entire shooting industry has been hungry for some sort of improvement in accuracy and cost of production, only to produce a POS like a Ruger American, which incorporates all the attributes that the more recent shooter has embraced. If this is improvement, I stand firmly in the past, with an outdated, but capable rifle that won’t give up a single measurable feature to the new standard.

60 years from now, a Ruger American and many of the now hyped rifles and cartridges, will hardly be the collectors items a Pre-64 Winchester is today…

Well said, Shrap. I’m a millennial, but I have the sense to know soul and craftsmanship when I see it.

I hunt primarily with Kimbers these days, but there is no replacing the feeling of an old American made rifle that was built in the hands of craftsman. If someone can’t acknowledge the difference between a modern rifle and a pre-64, I opine that they probably haven’t handled the pre-64 much. I think I could easily tell the difference between a new Model 70 and old while blindfolded and wearing gloves.

Maybe I really am older than most of you guys - in a thread about pre-64 Mod 70s I have been comparing those with two Win Mod 54s here.

i must be getting old too. let's see....

1891 Argentine Mauser in 7.65x53, 3 of them
1944 Mauser in 8x57
1916 Spanish Mauser in 6.5x55 and 7x57
1937 Husqvarna m46 in 9.3x57
1898 Springfield Armory in 30-40 Krag, 2 of them
19?? Carcano m36 in 6.5x52 and 7.35x52
19?? Arisaka Type 99 in 30-06
1908 Brazilin Mauser in 7x57
1924/30 Venezuelan Mauser in 7x57
1898 Springfield Armory action, 2 of them
1895 Chilean Mauser action
1926 Remington m14 in 30 Remington
1943 M2 in 30 Carbine

the newest rifle i still have is two TC Encores' in 20 Vartarg, 444 Marlin and 500 Linebaugh (all 3 of them are 23" MGM barrels) and High Plains Laminate gunstocks.

i have other "newer" rifles, but they are wood and blued steel. i got rid of my "plastic" rifles about 6 or 7 years ago. wood and blued steel have a soul. "plastic" guns do not.

There are couple outstanding examples worth considering: .270 Featherweight, .338 Winchester Magnum.

The folks that care about pre 64s won't be around in 20 years.

As long as people collect things, there will be at least a few folks around who will still care about pre-'64 Winchesters, pre-'60 Savage lever actions, Marlins built in North Haven, pre-WW2 Remingtons, etc.

When are you moving to California?

100% correct. Nobody collects Model Ts anymore, nobody collects Rev war anymore. The fools paying a million for a Graveyard car better enjoy it now as in 50 years no one will care.

Fine American single shots are now selling for 1/3 what they did 30 years ago.

pre 64s are well made massed produced items. Cult status will fade when the Boomers pass on.

Oh look.

Another dumbass sockpuppet.

Surprise, surprise. LOL

in 20 years i'll still be shooting my old rifles, i doubt that you be shooting your "newer plastic" guns.

And this is exactly the point. I think many of the naysayers here are simply trying to justify the purchase of the “paint by numbers” rifles that will end up in a pawn shop rack with dust on them.

Which leads to another point. Go into any dingy pawn shop and see what’s in there. There is a reason that you don’t just walk into any pawn shop on any given day and see classic rifles sitting in the racks. They either get bought when they do show up, or the people who own them appreciate what they have and understand that they just don’t make them like they used to.

Who is building these "plastic" guns?

Fine American Single shots selling for 1/3 of what they did? Go try to buy an Ithica Sousa grade Single barrel trap or a Parker and get back to us on the price. Fine guns are Fine guns and will always bring premium prices. The Ruger American was/is made to a price point. The Winchester M70 pre 64 was essentially a factory produced simi-custom rifle. A lot of handwork went in to producing them. As the dollar has devalued and wages went up it becomes impossible to sell at a price most can afford. Idiot management goes a long way to driving a company under as well. LC Smith gave up making fine doubles to make typewriters and Parker slowly died on the vine as American shooting public wanted more firepower of the simi-auto and pump shotguns. Remington, like so many companies, was acquired by a holding company that only cared about the bottom line.

Smart man....


But the old ones had the GOOD trigger.... That MOA pos needs to be relegated to the dump...

I had a custom pre 64 70. It was ok but I’ll take a Sako or Rem 700 any day.
Glad some like the pre 64 and are not competing with me.

Some folks are easily triggered, but sometimes the truth hurts. Your kids/grandkids won't care about most of your crap when you're gone, and that's just how it is. I'll be one of those gone in 20 years and all my blued steel, fine walnut stocks won't impress anyone. Sorry, I've no plastic guns to shoot now, so yep, I doubt I'll be shooting any from the grave. If I did have some though, that's what the grandkids would ask for.

The number of people who care about pre 64s have been on a steady decline for years. 20 years from now they will be such a small segment of gun ownership to be statistically insignificant. Sure, there will be a very small number of people who want one, but it will be very small, even compared to todays number. I'm sure you raised your kids right and all the blah, blah, blah, but pre 64s aren't what they once were and 20 years from now will be even less.

Yeah.... antiques are a thing of the past and lose all value!!! lmao

You didn't answer my question.

Since I'll be dead, I'd have thought you could work that one out on your own, but no, in 20 years I most likely will not be moving to California.

There will always be these discussions about the Winchesters, but I seriously doubt that there has ever been a more accurate mass produced rifle than those Model 70 Heavy Varmint rifles built back in the 1990's.

I have owned countless rifles, dozens with custom barrels etc.... and my pre64m70's have consistently been among the most accurate.... pretty good for sloppy tolerance, handmade, obsolete junk

LOL. Yep, everyone knows that.

Say hello to Whitefeather's best friend...

Historic interest but far better choices today.

Are you sure?

1955 M70 Featherweight at 100yds off the shelf. My last 1963 Featherweight did damn near this at 200yds witnessed, have the group in the man cave. Yea they suck.

Right?

savage axis, thompson center venture, Remington m783...any cheap gun will satisfy you.

That right there is indisputable logic!

https://www.gunsinternational.com/g...model-54-405-w-c-f-.cfm?gun_id=102363020

https://www.gunsamerica.com/915260082/Winchester-Model-70-Supergrade-458-Win-Mag-25-Barre.htm

Yeah, people are definitely losing interest in them.

My pre 64 Winchester looks like either this...



or this...



I had a very nice Pre 64 Winchester Model 70, but passed it on to my first son when he graduated High School. If I came across a good standard weight Pre 64 Model 70 in 30/06, I doubt I could pass it up... It is, to me, one of the best looking commercial rifles made.

The Supergrade seller's 63% approval rating was the first thing that popped out to me. Guess I've bought too many guns online....

Only have one, 1951 .257 Roberts and a Super Grade in what I'd call 98% new condition.

I like my old rifles to say Bofors on them.

Exactly whatinhell are you talking about? Don't get out much do you, Larry?

I’ve never owned a pre 64 M70 but it’s been high on my radar for years, something else always comes up first.

I was on the verge of buying a very nice unmodified pre war M70 in 300 H&H several years back that was for sale by an older guy selling off his collection.

I didn’t have the full asking price at the time but after a long phone conversation talking guns we agreed to 1/2 then and the other half in six weeks. I sent him a M/O for half and when I called him to tell him that I would be sending the other half he told me that the rifle was already sold. It turned out that he was suffering from dementia which was his reason for liquidating his collection. He forgot about our agreement and sold it to someone else. He sent me a check on the spot to refund the 1/2 that I had already paid. I’d have loved to have had that rifle.

This happened the first time i took my pre 64 Fwt 243 out after getting the xxx stock put on. 5 shots, 5 hogs IIRC.

Yeah, like Clovis points.

Hog hunting is tough stuff.



My Kuiu clothes.





First bull at 70 or so yards via 338-06 and the 210 gr Partition.



Another not far from my first. A Remington KS 375 H&H with the 260 gr Nosler.







Sadly those 10,000 mountains are history for me.