I'm pretty certain they haven't accepted Christ as their savior, but if they ain't gonna be there than I have no reason to be either.

The look in that dog's eyes reads "If he doesn't take this schit off me I'm gonna eat his eyes when he falls asleep."

George

You got your facts a little off but I agree with your feelings.

that dog's got some bat ears..

Personally I believe and I think you know that. I also believe the pets will be there too. At least in my own beliefs. So in the end if I'm wrong, well I guess I'll never know it so no loss there either...

you called my son?

But she's an armadillo chasing/tackling SOB. Killed two in the past couple of days.

I don't care if it rains or freezes,,,

Heres a buddy of mine singin a song he wrote about the dogs in his life and the hope that dogs will be in heaven too....
Sorry if I side tracked the thread. It just seemed to fit here...

The dog may get to heaven, but that Halloween costume stays behind.

Ever read a dogs thoughts?
It;s just got to be "Sweet Geezzzus, bad enough they put this damn thing on me, but now he's gonna take my picture, and show the world flippin world".

We have some volunteer time at a local shelter coming up soon. I'm on the lookout for a pooch about the same size; maybe 25-35 lbs. Looks like a great friend you have there.

Supplement Bible study with Snausages and maybe there is hope.

Steelie: you've heard me say this before no doubt..

but the ONLY thing better than a dog...is two dogs.

The Bible was written for and about people. There's no mention of any kind about animals in heaven. Any discussion about it is pure speculation with basis. I would like to think that there will be but it would be pure guesswork.

I read the title and figured that we were going to be talking about the third Alou brother.

It's all guesswork, unless you've been there?

And the lions will lay down with the lambs.

All dogs go to Heaven...not sure about cats tho....

Can't have heaven without puzzy.

I would happen to disagree with Rock Chuck. The Bible is God's revelation to humanity about who God is and what God has done. And God's act of salvation in Jesus Christ is not limited to humanity - in Christ ALL things are made new. Even in the visions of hope and the new kingdom in Revelation the visions are not limited to humanity, but expanded to include ALL of God's creation. I don't believe God has the same relationship with animals as God has with humans, but I believe God seeks to make creation as he created it - good and very good. The Psalms testify to all of creation praising God most high and the inclusive nature of God's salvation for creation through Jesus Christ leads me to have no theological issues with saying that our beloved pets will be included in the the coming of God's kingdom to this earth. But then again, I would guess we might have some differences in eschatological theology as well... . I love ALL of God's creatures - some at my side, others on my plate!

cats are by invitation only.

nice thing about Heaven is that it's so far, it keeps the rif-raf and the lazy out. Kind of like public land; more than a 1/2 mile from the road.

We've discussed a few pit bulls that would be most unwelcome.

You may have me with that one.

When I pass, I want to go over the Rainbow Bridge. I have a couple of good friends there I want to pick up and take with me to my final destination. kwg

Why? You can't die again can you? Or is it like being born again?

You lost me on that one my friend. My reply was to Rock Chuck about pits.

Quick reply. He stated that there would be some unwelcome pitbulls.

That comes out of Isaiah 65 and I think its written about the millenium. In it's full context, it talks about births and deaths which won't happen in heaven.

OK

What fun is it staying in context?

Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and one of them shall not fall on the ground without your Father.

Pit bulls are perfectly welcome.

Pit bull OWNERS......case by case basis.

or shiite in his shoes.

There's a few I'd like at my side too.

Scotts' feeble attempt at making conversation about which he likes to denigrate.

He's a POS and the DFTFT should apply here.....regardless of his post count.

Accept him for who he is. He's a complicated guy. He never said he was anyones friend. kwg

Classic...

What the Hell did you do to that cat, he looks mightily pizzed about somethingorother?

God will prepare everything for our perfect happiness in heaven, and if it takes my dog being there, I believe he'll be there.

- Billy Graham

The great Rev. Billy Graham has probably lead more souls to Salvation through Christ than any other person on this planet. So I'll take his word of Faith to heart & agree that our beloved pets will be there with us in Heaven.

You and me both Kris, you and me both!

But, but, what about the Indians?

Amen brother...

If our spirit is there as it was here, how could our spirit be happy without our dog.

They have indians in heaven? Are they 'native american' type indians, or can I expect to order a variety of curries?

Figured you wouldn't find any humor in it. You are another perfect example of the west coast piece of [bleep] club.

I have heard of some churches allowing you to bring your dogs to Heaven if you become a member.

vel, if we're going to stretch the envelope and let in the dogs, and maybe a few of the cats, let's go further.

let's let in a few big spreading oak trees to sit under when the sun is at it's zenith. that way, we can stay cool and enjoy the breeze while the dogs play and romp.

one thing for sure, there won't be any need for Preachers or Lawyers in heaven. they will have to be retrained for other duties.

What happened to that lil' Chihuahua?

You should have named him Jesus.

"Jesus, come to me".

"Jesus, where are you?"

That one found a new home with 2 kids. Loved the dog's attitude but I couldn't warm up to a dog that can't jump into the truck.

Good on ya. (and I "get" it).

Isaiah 11:6-10

6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.

7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.

8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.

9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea.

10 And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.
KJV



Because the God of all creation will supply all our needs according to His riches in Glory, he will certainly provide us with the companionship of the animals of that creation if that remains a need. God created on earth what He saw as good. I would believe if it was good for earth, it is good for heaven also.

RickyD, it zounds like everything will become vegetarian. i wonder if the wolves and lions know that yet?

Would be nice if old motorcycles were there too.

Compare with Isaiah 65. Here it talks about young children. In 65 it talks about birth and death. That won't be happening in heaven. I think these verses are talking about the millenium, not heaven.

There you go taking scripture in context again. What fun is that.


BTW. I think you are right.

So in the millennium there will be births and deaths but all living creatures will only eat veggies?

Do Animals or Pets Go To Heaven? A Biblical Analysis

That appears to be the case. The Bible really doesn't say much about life during the millennium other than there will be a perfect government with Jesus as it's head. Satan won't be there to screw it up until a short time before it's end when he's turned loose for a while. It's hard to visualize a world without Satan.

from all this discussion, it sounds like the Great Predators, that is meat-eaters are going to be redesigned.

i'm thinking it's going from a two-stranded DNA model to a four or even twelve stranded model.

Kind of like Heaven, huh, where He rules totally, but no pets or animals? Maybe the millennium would be a more perfect place?

Rock Chuck, you do realize that the book of Revelation, where I assume you're pulling your millenialist eschatology from, was written for a persecuted church about 1900 years ago, right? It was written as a book of hope to persecuted Christians. The original writer almost certainly didn't record the vision as a way to predict or dictate what will or will not be in the future, but as a promise of God's kingdom as more powerful than the kingdoms of this earth. Like I said earlier, pretty sure we may differ more than a bit in our theological views, but I am thankful that the body of Christ is big enough and God's love is deep enough for all of us to discuss this in a civil manner. Peace be with you.

Well, it does say that Jesus will return and that he will reign for 1000 years here on Earth and that at the end will come the final judgement. That part is in black and white and it hasn't happened yet. It says that Satan will be chained during that time except for a short time at the end when he will be turned loose again. It's for sure that there's never been a time on Earth when Satan hasn't had free reign to work his evil.

God said it and I believe it. The sequence of events before Jesus returns is definitely open to interpretation although only 1 view will prove to be true. The main thing is to be ready if it happens in our lifetimes.

Of course it is, and the millennial reign is a type of heaven on earth.

I also mentioned that when God created the animals of the earth He saw it was good, so what was good for earth may be also be good in heaven.

But most importantly, we can trust Him to provide for our needs, so if we might have the same need for animal companions in heaven as we do on the earth, that need will be provided for. If we don't, from being otherwise fulfilled, it won't matter and we will not miss or be aware of the absence. When we come to that point of trust in Him, nothing else matters.

I find it even more hard to understand a time when we will be changed to incorruptible. A change I will welcome.

Amen.

+1

Amen.

Amen, and thank you.

Ingwe (Sir),
I follow your reasoning and therefor 3 is better than 2. I'm going to be sure and let Val, Jasmine, and Katie know that. Now, if only I could convince my wife that I truly need the 27 I told her I require to make me happy.

Bruno, Lefty, Lizzie et al. better be in heaven if/when I get there. They did nothing wrong to deserve "the other place".

Geno

PS combo gun section please? Travis/dave/David really wants/needs one. It would give me another way to waste my time enjoy myself. Thank you in advance for your consideration.

We just had a 100 pound Lab arrive at the back porch this morning. He was collared and had a good time playing with our Feist after the initial barking and crotch licking.

If he comes back and hangs around I think the cats will kill us in our sleep.

Now to possibly confuse things, to the Lord, a day is as a thousand years (as we know), so if He will rule here a thousand years, that could be almost an eternity? 1000x365x1000 days of Satan in chains? I know that is not what we are taught. HE did say He didn't make our earthly home in vain.

Animals have a sixth sense about the spiritual/supernatural...

Dog say's... Jesus told me steelie is safe... but Ingwe's [bleep]...

The millenium might be a type of heaven, but it won't be heaven itself. Men will still be born and will die. They will still have failing bodies, although they will be much healthier than now. Isaiah says that if a man dies younger than 100, it will be a calamity.
I'm not saying that there won't be animals in heaven. I'm saying that the Bible doesn't say there will be so it's all conjecture.
It's true that God created animals and then said that it was good. However, he also found it necessary to destroy most of them, along with everything else, in the flood.

The massive size of Naoh's ark was to preserve animal life. Afterall, the animals were relatively innocent and it was His human creation he sought to destroy with the exception of Noah and his family. And He didn't destroy everything. Plants regenerated and marine life was not destroyed.

I know the Bible doesn't tell us animal life will exist in heaven or that it won't, and though it may seem I am leaning toward it will, that's not really the case. If I was to guess, I'd guess not, as the Glory of God will be quite sufficient to captivate our attention, although His Mercy and Grace may allow it.

So Ricky and RC, when the Lord returns next, are the Christians then caught up in the rapture, or does that happen after the millennium?

No worries, Ingwe has a protector now...though his pseudonym is 'Satan'...

Nice!!! redemption is at your doorstep...

Kent

Sounds like me, I have three now, and 27 would be just about right, so it wouldnt hurt so much when one passes...

And he said I wouldnt go to hell unless I put one of those halloween costumes on him.

In the New Jerusalem.

Wonder if you can bring your humidor... 'smoke a turd in heaven' doesn't have the same ring... well, they can use that Bin Laden fella to pass out turds, screw'm...

Kent

Maybe I could get his 72 virgins to mind the Humidor.....

You know 72 virgins is hell.

Hummer'dor... you're a genius...

Kent

I'm goin' there anyway...might as well have the company...

Not if I can help it.

Since I seriously doubt that the Lord will allow us to hunt.... But what about Fly Fishing? Jesus fished with the Apostles... Will I need my 3wt or 5wt...

Ingwe ain't gonna get ta go fishin if he gets all them virgins. He'll be takin out the trash for eternity. ;-{>8

The rapture will happen before the Lord returns. The question then is will the rapture occur before the tribulation of the anti-christ or not.

That depends if you are pre-trib, post-trib or pan-trib. Pre-tribulation folks believe Christians will be taken out of the earth before it gets really nasty. So they could be here for the first 3.5 years or so after the anti-christ appears and then get taken out, under that scenario. Post-trib folks believe He will not come back until the full tribulation has passed, the anti-christ has been defeated, and right before the Lord returns. I'm of the pan-trib persuasion believing that God is in control and if it happens and when it happens, it will all pan out fine. And by if it happens, I don't doubt it will, but it may not in the way we might now be thinking. God is a bit mysterious in how He handles some of his grander miracles.

Agreed

I think my dog just thanked Christ for not being able to read....

Smart dog!

Think I'd rather go Fly Fishing. Can't imagine listing to 72 women bitch all at once!

Same here, butt, to each his own. Course the Poohbah is special and likely can handle it. He is a whiz dog trainer, ya know. OK, this is lookin better.

I would prefer a pre-trib rapture but I can't see it in the Bible. I'm more of a post-trib'er. However, none of us can affect what will happen in any way so there's no point in arguing about it. All we can do is be ready for whatever happens.

Hope this doesn't last two thousand years.

I agree all the way around.

I got a good laugh out of that.

And agree!

Now that is funny [bleep] if you follow the game like I have! Matty and Felipe had to have thought Jesus had a Devine edge playing the game!!

INGWE.....damn that is a beautiful dog. Any details you can share about him?

I've always wondered if Jesus wanted to tell humanity about revelations, why he didn't do it while he was here... not put it in someone's mind nearly 100 years later... if there were to be prophets later, who can say Joseph Smith is wrong about Mormonism and Jesus didn't whisper in his ear... or mine now.

I've decided I'm not a Christian, or a religious Christian... I believe in Christ's life example and what he represents... which isn't the same as man's rendition or religion.

Kent

And what does HE say about that? If HE has been building a place for those who believe in Him, who is building a place for those who believe in themselves?

Jesus smiled...

Kent

And others gnashed their teeth.

Lucky I'm in then...

Kent

Kent's got more "Christianity" in his hangnails than most of the preachy bastids that can't STFU about their personal fears, angst, and paranoia.........UNCEASINGLY trying to "Convert" the "Fallen"

Me ? I see those as the ones that have never really STARTED living.

Anyhoo, he sure says one very RIVETING grace over a meal,before a shooting match.....just ask around .

GTC

One lesson and only one... Jesus was never exclusionary, even on the cross to criminals who really did bad things... Christianity is exclusionary arguing down to the last revelations period and exclamation point.

I'll follow Christ.

Kent

Amen.

Eschewing endless and obsessive inventories of "....angels on the head of a pin." is probably better for one's spirit, and stamina, in the long run, Old Timer.

You've SEEN my "Chapel",.......and know perzacktly what I'm saying.

GTC

Sorry I didn't see the add on...

John 14 �Do not let your hearts be troubled. You believe in God[a]; believe also in me. 2 My Father�s house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you? 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. 4 You know the way to the place where I am going.�

There is no exclusion, no or else...

Kent

I have seen the faith at your chapel and welcome another visit.

Kent

Amen.

Don't kid yourself, pal.

He did. Matthew 24.

You'll have to ask Him that one yourself.

krp says,



But William F. Albright Ph.D. archiologist says the entire New Testament was written prior to the year 70AD.

That's Matthew, not revelations and talks about the end of the world, which doesn't mirror revelations.

I did ask him and he told me.

Forward prophets after Christ... what's the point? Paul contradicts Jesus, he fell in the dirt and saw a light... Smith fell over a fence and saw a light. Religions are born.

It's funny, baptism, argued to the the inth degree... and yet Jesus told the criminal on the cross next to him, he would be with him, no strings attached.

Kent

Bullchit

Kent

my mtn feist Emmy Lou, aka *EL* for short, can do the darndest things.

she can walk forward like any ordinary dog. Yes! and she can walk backwards too. not every dog can do that.

a backward walking dog, what a thrill. i won't get into the dry humour of dog spelt backwards.

There was a string, the only string, Faith, and the thief had that.

The thief on the cross is an excellent example showing religion replacing relationship in Christian thought. Paul clarified a lot of those difficulties and nuances, too, I believe. I've never noticed where he contradicted Jesus, and would be interested if you cared to point some out.

Really? and I'm not being sarcastic as usual, I know my faults but I'm puzzled knowing you take your scriptures seriously.

Before I'd go back into verse and chapter as it's been years since I have and not interested now let's discuss generalities.

Are Paul's letters and writings, which are about half the New Testament, God's literal word or 'The word of God'... or are they individual inspiration/enlightenment/teachings. When the Thessalonians were concerned about those that died before Christ's return, was Paul's answer God's answer... or Paul's appeasement.

When Paul said this was God talking through him?... Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. 20 To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God�s law but am under Christ�s law), so as to win those not having the law.

There have been other forward prophets, why are they different than Paul?

Kent

[quote=krp There have been other forward prophets, why are they different than Paul? Kent [/quote]

Thanks, for all your posts on this thread so far Kent. I have a friend who is LDS and says the same. Makes sense to me. Pre-Jesus, (if we are to believe the Bible) God sent many prophets. Did we quit needing further guidance and instruction? Or perhaps those who can't "get the message" as it was recorded +/- 2000 years ago don't need to get a more modern version?

I thought this was going to be a thread about dogs going to heaven. Little did I know!

Geno

There are two legged dogs.

I love those ears. On both dogs!

Ingwe, is "Satan" a Malinois, Tervuren, or am I in the wrong country of origin entirely? Whatever kind, one could bet (and win) that I'm not coming around your place without an invite!

Not sure if having 27 would make the passing of any one any easier, it's hard for me even when a friend's or acquaintance's dog passes. However, I'd have 26 left to commiserate with, which I see as a good thing.

"Beloved, while I was making every effort to write to you about our common salvation, I felt the necessity to write to you appealing that you contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all delivered to the saints."

There is nothing to add to the faith. The difference in later prophets and Apostle Paul is he made no mistake, krp's opinion not withstanding, and the later one did.

He makes an assertion that Apostle Paul contradicts Jesus and can't come up with any. That is normal for his kind.

My kind... lol... Jesus thought it was funny too.

You never answered if Paul's word's were the literal word's of God.

Kent

Who cares what Muslims and atheists think about Christianity?

LMAO!

Jesus might... but he's pragmatic...

Kent

Do you think you can do more to hammer (ridicule) Christians and Christianity than Muslims?

Hard to surpass Christians at hammering other Christians and Christianity.

The shallowness of your understanding is what's... LMAO... That the baseline of whether Paul's words are teachings or actual words of God must be at least stated before I will debate anything... I've quit debating fools on fallacy... was Paul a self proclaimed Apostle born after Christ or a church building teacher as in a super Billy Graham. I can accept one and not the other because of my belief of Jesus's life example.

It's simple... the criminal on the cross recognized Jesus, expressed hope not necessarily faith, and asked Jesus a question and got an answer.

Same answer I believe I've gotten from my brother.

Kent

Well said. 'Christians' have done more damage to Christianity than any other group.

Apostle Paul claims what he wrote are God's Word. If they aren't then why should anyone listen to anything he has to say?



This a question is like, did you stop beating your wife. Perhaps Apostle Paul was born after Christ, we don't have that info. So what. Apostle Paul was accepted by the other apostles in Acts 15. And Apostle Paul established lots of churches.



You display so much confidence in something you can not know you appear arrogant. What is your basis for determining the criminal on the cross was not exhibiting faith?

Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. 20 To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God�s law but am under Christ�s law), so as to win those not having the law.

Are those God's words or Paul's, if they are Paul's then some of the new testament isn't God's words.

Paul was a church builder no doubt, you are repeating me. The issue of the rapture (Paul's letter to the Thessalonians) that I reference above is why I referenced it. Are those God's words or Paul's answer of convenience to their fears? I didn't bring up the rapture, tribulations, apocalypses in this thread... but my commentary, even forward prophets, is directly related and if you knew your scripture you would know why.

Luke 23:39-43

New International Version (NIV)

39 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: �Aren�t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!�

40 But the other criminal rebuked him. �Don�t you fear God,� he said, �since you are under the same sentence? 41 We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.�

42 Then he said, �Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]�

43 Jesus answered him, �Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.�

At least this is topical to Christ, whether the translation is 100% or not, the message is clear and simple... no arrogance on my part, but I am confident in what I understood.

Kent

You are saying, "if". You are, by faith, thinking more highly of yourself than you should. You are not accepting Apostle Paul's writing. He claims:

"And for this reason we also constantly thank God that when you received from us the Word of God's message, you accept not the word often, but what It really is the word of God, which also performs Its work n you who believe."



Whether I know Scripture or not, I am still in the dark as to why you say the criminal didn't exercise faith.

"Now faith is the assurance of things hope for, the conviction of things no seen."

My Dad would get pissed at something or someone and more than once exclaim loudly: "Jesus H. Christ!!!"

He is long since come and gone from this place so I cannot ask him. Does anyone of you knowledgeable Church folk know for sure what the "H." is for?

Thanks!

Howard.

Phiilipians 1:15-18

15 To be sure, some preach Christ out of envy and strife, but others out of good will. 16 These do so out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel; 17 the others proclaim Christ out of rivalry, not sincerely, seeking to cause me anxiety in my imprisonment. 18 What does it matter? Just that in every way, whether out of false motives or true, Christ is proclaimed. And in this I rejoice. Yes, and I will rejoice.

Frankly, the OP and all y'all can keep it up, however you feel comfortable.

Just keep talking about the Lord and someone, somewhere will get it.

I thought maybe
holy or hosanna
But never Howard!

The Cardinals make a miracle comeback and win in overtime to go 4 and 0... that's proof Jesus loves me most...

Kent

I knew it.

I saw your reply this morning after I had finished some loads and fixed breakfast. I didn't have time to respond at that time, as I had to drop my Mom off at the beauty shop on my way to the range.

Had some fun, confirmed some good loads, and doubled my Beowulf . That was exciting.



Fair enough.

Generally, I find Paul's letters, as well as those from James, Peter, and John, to be essential in understanding and giving proper context to the four Gospels.

Peter named Paul as a beloved Brother in his second letter but maybe you would toss out Peter's letters, also.

Paul's letters were not prophetic. He was an apostle whose job was to teach and primarily he expounded on the Gospel not expanded it.

As to whether Paul's letters are God's literal word, I would say not His Word, unless Paul is quoting something told to him by Christ, but given or inspired by God through His Holy Spirit.

Paul's letters are also instrumental in instructing believers about the Holy Spirit, who Jesus spoke about but had not yet arrived to minister to His followers.

But, generally, I can tell from some of your posts later on this thread that you fully believe Paul was inconsequential and possibly even a charlatan. I don't.

It seems you split hairs over hope and faith claiming the thief on the cross had no faith, only hope. Jesus mentioned faith 25 times in the Gospel's and hope once, and then in the context of hoping to be paid back for lending. I think He was pretty set on the importance of faith and saw that in the thief's heart. But believe what you will.

So generally, you won't convince me that Paul's letters have no place in the Gospel's and I won't convince you that they not only do, but are essential which is why they are there.

Fair enough.

Thanks for the reply and have a nice evening.

The their realized (and knew and believed) that Jesus was the Son of God. His faith was that Jesus was the Christ, though that realization was sudden and astounding.

You don't accept Apostle Paul's statement "when you received from us he Word of God's message, you accepted no the word of men, but what It really is, the Word of God"? 1 Thessalonians 2:13

Jake, the heavy set one of the Blues Brothers, taught me that the correct way is "Jesus H. Tap Dancing Christ". Was that what he was doing during the "missing years"?

Glad you had a good day and hope for a better evening...

I appreciate Paul's letters and understand the context of them, I doubt he ever believed there would be a new testament and that his letters would be taken by some as gospel. The issue is the Rapture, which Paul introduced because the Thessalonians were concerned about their dead and Jesus's second coming. I have no problem what he wrote, just the interpretation by the church, it has made his words prophetic and I don't believe Jesus needed to talk through Paul about these issues every time the new churches were concerned.

Paul also wrote things that conflicted with Jesus's word, again we are all human and it's not an issue until we are told Paul's words are gospel or Jesus's words.

I believe Jesus came and gave his message, he lived it, didn't write it and he could have, there was a reason and a lesson. I trust the words of his personal disciples first, though much of the gospels were written by assistants/confidants well after.

My overall issue is the exclusionary prophetic mention of the Rapture in this thread... When Jesus spoke of the end times he said something to the effect of gathering his chosen from the 'heavens' and the four winds of the earth... My mention of the criminal also references the criminal as being with Jesus in paradise immediately after death... the faith issue isn't stated and just something I found interesting, but I said it could be in translation, though Jesus didn't reference faith either in that instance, just acceptance, don't try to insinuate I was denying faith overall... So why raise the dead if they are already in heaven?

I don't know why you guys bring this kind of stuff up on the open forum, Jesus isn't offended about talk of dogs in heaven, he may enjoy the levity... but I imagine he is offended every time someone undecided gets turned off by bible thumpers when the message isn't even his.

Kent

I can accept that though it wasn't stated, he still wasn't baptized or obviously following any tenets or commandments.

Kent

One of my all time faves! Have you seen the light?
[video:youtube]http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=z5KGLPs_gls&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Dz5KGLPs_gls[/video]

If you read the Gospels in Their entirety you will discover baptism was not instituted until the day of Jesus' ascension.

What do you call the act that "John the Baptist" was doing if not baptisms?

How about the ritual cleansing baths required under Jewish law to remove uncleanliness?

Ed

When did it become a requirement for salvation?.... Gospely...

Kent

Yep, in 1 Convictions 2:18 it talks about the thief on the cross being taken dawn, baptized than nailed back up. That is the only way he could join Christ in Paradise.

See, if I hadn't slept through that seminary class, I wouldn't have missed that.... thanks.

Kent

APDDSN0864,



I was not clear enough. Sorry. Here's what Apostle Paul thought about John's Baptism:

"It happened that while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul passed through the upper country and came to Ephesus, and found some disciples. He said to them, �Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?� And they said to him, �No, we have not even heard whether there is a Holy Spirit.� And he said, �Into what then were you baptized?� And they said, �Into John�s baptism.� Paul said, �John baptized with the baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in Him who was coming after him, that is, in Jesus.� When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they began speaking with tongues and prophesying. There were in all about twelve men."
Acts 19:1-7

You can see Apostle Paul re-baptized them in the Name of the Lord.

What makes any of you think that WE are good enough to go to doggy heaven?

Glad to help.

Pets will be in heaven but they will hopefully be quite and not crap in other people's yard.

So is Paul the one that came to baptize with the Holy Spirit and the Fire?

Kent

Are you asking because you don't know?

Do you think I don't know?... remember, I'm one of those kind.

Kent

Anyway, one inconsistency between Paul said and what Jesus told his disciples.

Kent

krp,

I have no idea what you know or don't know or think you know. Not only that I have no idea what "one of those kind" is.

Well, there are several dogs there who are expecting me.

Cute pets. Place looks good.

We all go to the same place as our dogs, but it ain't heaven.

Ringman,

Pay attention. You are being schooled.

weird that...

krp,

Thanks for the reminder. "his kind" is refering to those who will die someday thinking they know more than Everlasting God Who gave us his Word.

At least you could have googled 'baptized in the Holy Spirit and the fire' to understand my reference of your Paul quote to Jesus and John the Baptist... or maybe you should reread the gospels.

I'll die just fine thanks... and look you up after to see the expression on your face that I'm included in your exclusionary vision... lol... and my kind...

you're a lightweight theologically.

Kent

Asses and ates.
I don't know you nor Scott F personally, but I figure from your post over time, your not man enough to crawl in his tracks!

John

Thanks for the vote of confidence John but my friend AcesNeights was not referring to me. I recommend you delete your post before it gets ugly. Case of mistaken identity. Aces is really a good guy.

Aces is a piece of [bleep], according to the texts from his wife.


I really wish this thread stayed on point with dogs and not all these silly ghost stories.

It probably could have but when you start the thread the way you did, I suspect we all knew the potential was there.

I hear you, salesmen will take any opportunity.

Steelhead, I don't agree with everything you say (and make it a point to stay away from fire fights), but I have to give credit where credit is due. You are a witty SOB, and possibly king of the one liners.

I can atteat to this 100 %! We have TWO minnie Aussie Bitches, Gunnr and Bandit and when they go, I'd like to wind up wherever they wind up....

I want to go go where they they go:

So the children that are not baptized, die at birth, have not made it to baptism yet etc.... are not going to heaven?

Jeff, 1 'Convictions', convictions isn't a book in the bible... Scott was making a point and a good one.

Kent

Anyway, I apologize to Steelie for adding to his big gob of bait thrown out and leave the dog issue with this... Jesus, the title of this thread always kept it simple and was inclusionary...

And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

I'm headed to California for 5 days... prayers needed... lol

Kent

My comment was 100% sarcasm.

From your question I think we are on the same page.

I too will lave this line of posting and get back to the dog theme Steelhead started.

My dog and I sharing quality time after a hard day's work.

Got it... didnt' read enough of the posts... when it goes stupid number of pages I often don't get or make time but to read now and then...
Jeff

speaking of Jesus, and dogs.. does anyone happen to have a rottweiler or doberman pinscher named Jesus?

as we all attempt to get this thread back on tract, i'm thinking a properly named dog means a lot in the life of that dog. Brutus for example causes me to think of a large, mean-spirited German Shepherd.

now, a dog named Scrapper would have to be a Scottish terrier, wouldn't he??

Guilty of that myself from time to time.

I figure I'll head over to Valhalla when my time is up. They let dogs in at that joint...

R.

Judging from your posts on this thread,I think you and I probably have about the same slant on the whole "Christanity" deal.

If Jesus was gonna die and stay dead,I believe He would have written stuff down Himself.But.....since He knew He would be available for questioning on a personal level,He abstained from that.History has shown the wisdom of His choice in that regard.

I believe He wants us to come to Him for answers.That levels the playing field for everyone,including the illiterate among us.

I think it no coincidence that the two sacraments most christian churches agree on,Baptism and the Lord's Supper,require a third person to administer them.Job security,I reckon!

Finally,Jesus said there is none greater than John the Baptist............ and he wasn't a "christian".

BTW.............. Meet "Tee" :

Tee IS a sweetheart!

I need to bring my pups next time I come out.

I cannot imagine an afterlife without my animal companions. They are a gift, one I believe is forever.

Ed

A poem I wrote many moons ago...... it sorta fits both themes of this thread :

Some evenin' times he makes his way
To a britches-polished log
And sets by a grave on top of a hill
To talk to a long-dead dog

And maybe it's smoke from his cedarwood fire
That fills old eyes with tears
As firelight's glanced off limestone rock
Like thoughts reflected off the years

The dog and him both thought that time
Began with Fall's first freeze
And they roamed the land,it was not yet fenced
And hunted wherever they pleased

And he thinks of Heaven ever now and then
When the bourbon's low in his cup
And hopes he and the dog make it thru the gate
'Fore the "Posted" signs go up

Thats a great poem curdog....You ever think of putting it into a music or a song format?