The Pennsylvania Game Commission has voted 5-3 to open the statewide firearms deer season on a Saturday. The change is effective this year.

Oh man, this thread will be good for at least 30 pages.

When they first started talking about this, there were some people on here that thought the world was coming to an end. They might get an extra day to hunt, but it made opening day on a Saturday instead of Monday. Personally, I always thought the Monday thing was a little off. We open on Saturday here.

Everyone I know up there loves the idea.

Intended to get more college students out to hunt, since the poor dears will be home that Saturday, but can't be around the following Monday. Maybe help a few more adults that can't get Monday off and kids whose schools no longer close on the first Monday. They are desperate to stem the loss of hunters and think this will help? Despite the fact that more than one poll indicated a clear majority of deer hunters didn't want the change.

Our current board of commissioners have decided old goats that still drive hours to hunting camps are dinosaurs of the past and no longer matter.

Even though we probably still make up a third or more of current deer hunters. One stat I read during the controversy leading up to this decision, is that only about 25 to 30 percent of deer hunters still travel to a hunting camp for rifle deer So this will benefit those who hunt close to home and the afore mentioned groups.

For decades we got camp open on the Friday after Thanksgiving, visited a bit with camp neighbors, went small game or turkey hunting on that Saturday and got prepped for the Monday opener. Out the window now.

Gah

You can still hunt, visit on Monday.

Heard about it right away this morning. Nothing but bitching back and forth since. Small business going to take a hit same as when they changed the bear opener. Guys no longer had to take off on Mon-Wed. Schools and employers no longer need to offer Monday off.

All a push for Sundays. Nothing to do with people and time. Dept of Labor statistics dont lie. Majority of people dont use all their vacation, and the few without vacation is just that, minute compared to the majority.

Personally, I hate it and how itll affect not only tradition, but small business. Not too happy that there will be potentially hung over hunters just over the ridge from partying the night before. With Monday starter they could sleep off Fridays/Saturdays escapades on Sunday. Now theyll be out in full force. Yay.

Ill still do my thing, get my deer after the majority will go home. Am afraid ill lose Monday holiday off and have to burn another vacation day, but oh well.......anything to keep the greedy no priority bastards happy.

Is Sunday hunting still prohibited?

Is Sunday hunting still prohibited?

Machs nichs to me. I don't bother hunting PA until end of first week or the second week anyway. Most of the PA guys I talked to were for it. They screwed up in not including Sundays in the new regulations, IMO.

One thing it will do for us in MD is yank the PA guys out of our woods that first Saturday, hopefully. Historically there's been a large crew of PA guys that swoop down to the Game Lands I hunt to score an extra day of hunting, and all the while blasting anything that moved and actually put on drives right through where others were hunting. (I mean, c'mon. Drives on opening day morning for pete's sake, on public not private land where it's acceptable?!)

I'm disappointed. I've previously stated my position ad nauseam.

It is what it is.

added
It's a bummer, that's what it is.

It's change, for change's sake.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/13511279/12

Pretty much it in a nutshell.

This drives me nuts I’m fairly young and disappointed with the way things are going hate to hear arguments that I love to hunt just don’t want to use my vacation to do it. I believe all this is going to back fire on PGC with not getting them any more license sales because that’s what they are digging for I hope that Sunday hunting doesn’t pass when this gives them no change in license numbers

How many College students will head home after classes Fri, to hunt Saturday,then head back Sunday for class Monday? Not many. When my daughter was at university, if she could hunt she did. If it wasn't prudent she didnt. Believe it or not,college came first. Still will I bet. It's 2 to 6 years of your life on average. No body will die missing a deer season of two. Megan usually hunted the first Saturday and a couple days within the two week season. Probably as much as most of the folks that voted to change the opener do.

If this is really about students and folks without vacation,why no Sunday hunting?

We've got to appease the "get to do everything" generation....


This is just the rifle season opener. They should have left well enough alone.

During the "debates" on Sunday Hunting what was one of the biggest arguments? "I dont have vacation and work Saturdays" So the GC gives them Saturdays....the more I think about this schit the more pissed I get. If they wanted another Saturday give us a 3rd week. Reduce the doe allocation to reflect the extra week and BOOM everyones happy again. Again, this has not a damn thing to do with time, and everything with setting up Sundays.

Said it a million times, quit phuggin around with Sundays and put it on the ballot!! Along with disbanding the GC and combining agencies. Its time!

This whole argument never ceases to amuse! same with the sunday hunting arguments. the thought of lobbying to not hunt more is astounding to me.

Denny, im sure as President of PFSC you sat in many meetings. Your opinion, honest question, no BS.....did we, the average hunter ever have a say? Our emails mean nothing?

I'm delighted. If only obviously.

Im sure you rubbed one out as soon as you heard.

There's already a gazillion days to hunt deer in Pa. Plus you could hunt small game and turkeys on that Saturday. Now you can't. Adding one more Saturday for deer ain't gonna do jack chit to increase hunter numbers.

All it does for me is cut family time over the Thanksgiving holiday, I'll have to travel on Friday instead of Saturday or Sunday to get from my daughters house in Berks county to my hunting grounds in Clearfield county. Sucks a big one.

Dale

No Sunday hunting without approval from the legislature. Just how it is here. If they'd give that over to the game commission, then maybe a Saturday deer opener makes a bit more sense? I don't give a damn about Sunday hunting for deer anyway, but that's just my view, lots do want it.

The Monday opener was more to my liking for several reasons.

Sundays for pretty much everything else is fine with me, especially woodchucks and turkeys.

Old traditions die hard and painfully. We always enjoyed the Friday ride to camp and taking our time getting ready for Monday. Saturday was a good day to go try for a turkey or some squirrels and grouse. 'Guess that's done. 'Can't believe they didn't get Sundays included in this. Kinda makes that first Saturday look like the ugly stepchild. Like I said, hard to see the old traditions die off, along with the old hunters.

Now wait a second....YOUR name was signed on the HUSH lawsuit! You dont give a damn about Sunday hunting? Pfft!!! Tell me thats not your name and signature Denny!

Please explain that better with actual dates as an example. did they shorten your season by a week by opening it the saturday before? I will be honest, I never understood how hunting was done on the east coast, even when I lived there. it was so screwed up as a whole I didn't even hunt. To me is seems like a soup sandwich that ya'll are trying to organize and rationalize. Where I live our season(s) run about the same every year. a few are the whole month of november (or october) regardless of when the 1st starts, and the regular rifle for west river runs so the last of the 3 weekends it's open is thanksgiving weekend. Now I get that people bank on these dates and expect them, but to whine about it opening the saturday before, or complaining that it's not closed on sundays seems absolutely retarded to me. I don't know the whole story, nor do I care except for what I see here when I scroll and it intrigues me enough to click. but as an outsider, it looks to me like the overall season hasn't changed aside from the saturday before the "normal" opener is the new one, so in effect you gained A day of hunting, on a weekend... and many are pissed about it. forget the whole "sunday hunting" which you still fight for keeping. I wonder what kind of stupid they put in the water there. You do realize the deer have no idea what day it is right? now if someone can explain it in a rational matter, I'm all ears, but this really seems like you all have been eating [bleep] for so long, that now when they offer you piss, you complain that it isn't more [bleep]. I honestly feel very sorry for you all to not know what it's like to live free, at least to the degree we are allowed out here. You have my prayers

You’ve obviously never been in the PA deer woods at dawn on the Monday after Thanksgiving.

The "got to have it now" generation has no time for foreplay. This decision devastates a lifetime of tradition. This is only one season of many.

Nothing says you HAVE to hunt that opening Saturday. Guys I've talked to plan to continue their driving/kibitzing/drinking on Saturday and Sunday and heading into the woods on Monday. Big deal. It just adds a little more flexibility to some people's seasons, that's all.

PA gets dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st century. Hell, we just recently were granted the privelage to buy a six pack between noon and 5 on Sundays ...

It's the no Sunday hunting that makes this a dumb move,I'll likely skip driving 5 hours each way to hunt Saturday and not be able to hunt Sunday
NY did this a few years back but it wasn't as big a deal since you could hunt Sunday
IF PA was really interested in getting more people/youths involved they would allow Sunday hunting

Exactly.

Nope, I sure haven't, nor would I want to from how it sounds.

It must be more magical than opening day in other places..... you know, with it being monday and all....

Like I said earlier, the deer don't know what day of the week it is.

Exactly.

When someone says they get less time with family because they have to leave for camp on Friday, I say BS. Do it as you always had.

Some seriously stuck individuals here. I bet the switch from paper to plastic gave a few wives black eyes.

Paper or plastic? Now there's an issue worth pulling out the pistol over.

Maybe it's an apple and oranges kinda thing, comparing deer hunting traditions from one state to another? PA manages to sell roughly 900,000 licenses per year, despite a national trend of declining sales and the number of hunters, but that's down from what it was a few decades ago.

PA measures a tad over 46,000 square miles and still has lots of rural land, not to mention millions of acres of forested, mountainous land, primarily in the northern parts of the state. Within that acreage is over 2.5 million acres of public access land to hunt on, plus lots more private land open to public access with permission. We probably have roughly 700,000 people that hunt deer. Estimates put the majority of those out on opening day of firearms deer season.

Deer numbers are not spread evenly across the state, but there are areas with huge deer numbers, most areas have adequate numbers and still some areas that hold few deer. People argue endlessly about how many deer we have, but we seem to always rank high in deer/vehicle accident rates, so I'd say we have plenty of deer? Annual deer kill numbers from the various seasons, have stayed in the 300,000+ range for years.

Hunting camps were the thing here, going back to the 1920s, because the deer were primarily in the northern areas. Hundreds of thousands of hunters went to those camps to hunt each year. Not the big deal it once was, partly because deer are now more common in other parts of PA, but that camp thing is still an important part of our deer hunting traditions. May not be the same in other states, can't say?

I couldn't agree more pa game commission just sees $$$$$

The average hunter is a whiny bitch and this thread proves it. LMAO. Some of you guys would squawk about getting hung with a new rope.

I assume you mean turning everything over to the polititions would be preferable?
In my 72 seasons of hunting in PA ive witnessed quite a few changes, and not all I agreed with including this one.
But this just might be one whose time has come. That said I don't think it will change much, especially in license sales numbers.
I don't think Sunday hunting will either other than for maybe a year, but it will no doubt shift the days some choose to hunt.
So we could look for the big exodus on Sunday afternoon instead of Tuesday afternoon?
That might not be all bad.
Bars at least initially will probably see more business with a weekend opener, especially those that offer freebees.
I mean where else is there to go to complain about seein no deer? lol

ARs and brown goes down weekends cant be very far off.

Holy schit...why would you want to with this many screaming children in the woods?

HAHAHAHA, that's my thought. then with the apparent lack of deer for many, oh man. sign me up!

"Holy schit...why would you want to with this many screaming children in the woods"?

Aw, go out in the shop and lean on a Furd or something? We don't pick on yinz like that. ;O)

The amount of b!tching over this law change is upsetting.

This is the start, Sunday hunting legal by 2020 season. Great job PGC!

I don't understand why everyone there isn't thinking like that. But damnit!!! They don't want to hunt on Sunday. lol

Bout F'N time the PA Game Commission got in the 21 century

I'll hunt every chance I get, hell told the wife I may hunt NY pn Thanksgiving. She told me to be home in time for dinner

Here's another good one. Lots of non res campers have been b!tching about not being able to get doe tags. Allocations are up all over this year 8000 in my wmu. Now you will hear them cry about killing all the deer!

I don't hunt on public land if I can help it, but I'm with you gnoahhh, this might keep all of those "Penntuckians" from comin down here a scarin all of our deer. Man, you drive past the parking areas for the public land on Saturday, and 3/4 of the vehicles are from PA. They can get here and be in the woods in about an hour or so. Them guys up there in Southern PA ain't goin to no deer camps because they know that they can come down here and shoot more in one day than they can in a whole season in PA.

I can see where this might upset the traditions of those guys that go to "Deer Camp" to hunt. But I bet the majority of the hunters in PA don't. I've talked to a handful of guys that I deal with from up around the Scranton area, and none of them go to a hunting camp. They all sleep in their beds at home, get up bright and early on opening day and drive down the road a few miles to where they hunt on private land and go wait for a buck to show himself. ALL of those guys are delighted with this news.

We've always had opening day on Saturday. I always thought that no hunting on Sunday gave the deer a "cool down day" so that we could catch them off guard on Monday. Now that we can hunt on Sunday, it hasn't made a hill of beans difference. We can still shoot the hell out of them for the next 2 weeks just like we used to.

If it's the tradition you guys are worried about, or the logistics of getting to where you need to be on a certain day, keep doing what you do. I'm sure you'll still kill just as many deer as you used to. For those of you that don't have any traditions of going somewhere special, go shoot a deer on Saturday and have fun doing it. All of the rest of those guys will be sitting around their deer camp getting drunk and waiting for Monday to roll around. If I was from there, I'd be having a celebration for the extra day of deer season. It's hard for me to comprehend people complaining about more hunting time, but I'm not from there.

They are thinking like that. I think there's probably more people in PA that want this, than don't. If they ever open on Sundays, I guarantee you that they'll change their ways. It's probably only the Amish and Mennonites that won't be out there on Sunday if they do change it.

Slowly, bit by bit, this all changes...

Youre a phuggin idiot. 3 local townships around my camp are dominated by southern PA folks and their camps. Fulton, Franklin, Adams, York, Lancaster, Cumberland, Dauphin, Lebanon, Chester.......generations of families from southern PA, where I live, made the drive north. And though members have passed on, those camps are still in use today. A few are just summer camps, but the majority still see at least a few for a day or 2. Usually after Tuesday theyre heading home.

Cross over 6, and the majority of non local owned farms in potato country are owned by southern PA folks, Jersey and New York. I lived there for 4 years. I worked and socialized with these folks. Maybe you outta get out of your small world and actually learn a little about a place you know not a damn thing about.

That's a strange way of saying "rolled a number".

PA is "bitch baby central" as far as the Sportsman here go.

i think is long overdue. i love tradition but this makes the most sense. hunt saturday, celebrate saturday night and butcher on sunday or pack up and go home without blowing half a day of hunting or driving twisty mountain roads in pitch black winter conditions.

The Saturday opener hasn't helped in NY. No more visiting with neighboring camps back and forth. No more saloon hopping to buy gun raffles. Breakfasts and dinners at the fire halls is a thing of the past, as is the traditional game feast at camp and late hours card games. Local businesses are suffering, from sporting goods stores to restaurants to grocery stores.There used to be a pretty substantial amount of money pumped into these economies. Not anymore. And all in the name of getting more people involved in the sport. Guess what - I haven't seen a single new hunter in our camp or any of the many camps around us. And it's the same everywhere when I talk to guys in restaurants, bars and around town.
Guys used to take a week vacation. They'd come up Friday night and stay till Wed. before Thanksgiving or the whole week. Now, they come up, hunt Saturday and Sunday morn then split for home. All the tradition and comradery is gone. I, for one, don't like it. Even guys that initially thought it was a good idea, have changed their minds.

I don't care what day they open it. Lord willing I'll hunt it.

Now with regards Sunday hunting, here is the reason why it hasn't happened. Hunters want it, but the Farm Bureau, which has more than a little clout didn't....

Pennsylvania Farm Bureau Testifies in Opposition to Expanding Sunday Hunting
CONTACT:
Mark O’Neill, Media and Strategic Communications Director
510 S. 31st Street , Camp Hill, PA 17001 • 717.761.2740 • Email • @pfbmediaone

For Immediate Release: May 18, 2016
(Harrisburg) – Pennsylvania Farm Bureau (PFB) restated its overwhelming opposition to any legislative effort that would directly or indirectly lead to the expansion of existing Sunday hunting laws in the Commonwealth, during testimony before the Senate Game & Fisheries Committee.

“Farm Bureau members have considered the issue of Sunday hunting on multiple occasions over the past two decades. Each time, farmers expressed their unequivocal opposition to any expansion efforts,” said Joel Rotz, PFB State Government Affairs Senior Director.

Although it opposes additional hunting on Sunday, PFB supports hunting and the role hunters play in managing wildlife in the state. In fact, Farm Bureau has worked for decades to build constructive relationships with the Pennsylvania Game Commission (PGC) and its staff to help keep privately-owned lands open and accessible to hunters.
“Farmers and other private landowners, who account for about 80% of all land used for hunting in the state, voluntarily allow hunters on their property to pursue game. It would be unfortunate if efforts to force more hunting on Sundays damaged positive relationships developed between hunters and landowners,” added Rotz.

Farm Bureau notes that most Pennsylvanians support keeping the status quo on Sunday hunting, including many licensed hunters in the state. In addition, outdoor enthusiasts of all kinds support PFB’s position.

“Several years ago, hikers, bikers, horseback riders, naturalists, bird watchers, fall foliage fans and others joined Pennsylvania Farm Bureau in opposing legislation that would have opened the door to expanded Sunday hunting,”### continued Rotz.

Farm Bureau has a history of actively embracing efforts to increase opportunities for youth hunters in Pennsylvania and has worked in conjunction with the PGC, sportsmen’s groups and others to provide youngsters more chances to hunt.

“Farmers have suggested that the state Game Commission allow youth hunting during the rifled deer season on the Friday and Saturday following Thanksgiving, when schools are closed. It is a rule change that the Commission can implement without action from the state General Assembly,” concluded Rotz.

Pennsylvania Farm Bureau is the state’s largest farm organization with a volunteer membership of nearly 61,400 farm and rural families, representing farms of every size and commodity across Pennsylvania.
###
Category: News Releases


Now the last sentence tells a little hidden secret. Farms of all sizes, and you can have a little farmette and be a member. And many of them are against hunting, so when the farm bureau takes a vote on Sunday hunting, there are enough of the little anti-hunting farmeette owners to sway the vote to against. Then there is this: “Several years ago, hikers, bikers, horseback riders, naturalists, bird watchers, fall foliage fans and others joined Pennsylvania Farm Bureau in opposing legislation that would have opened the door to expanded Sunday hunting,” continued Rotz. Between the farm bureau and the leaf peepers they backed the legislature into a corner. The leaf peepers are for the most part anti-hunting and will side with anything that limits days afield.

I say forget about Sunday hunting on the farms, but there is no reason not to Sunday hunt on the 1,000,000 plus acres of Game Lands bought and paid for by hunters. Most farmers today don't let the majority hunt when asked anyway. Deer especially. "No we like to keep the Deer hunting for family and friends." Forget them, with the exception of a few farmers, and most of them want Does wiped out on their grounds, it has been a long time since the Pa hunters and farmers have been a coalition working together for the benefit of each other.



The GC wants Sunday hunting along with the hunters, but they don't always get to make the rules.... But those who know little about the reason, jump all over the GC. Nor can you just blame the out of staters. Most of the in staters are just as clueless. Sunday hunting in 2020. Wave the flag, but don’t hold your breath and at least know the why not you are up against.

The people that weren’t born and raised on this tradition won’t understand why no one likes it and apparently never heard the jerry reed song about the preacher and the bear. That said if you think we are whinny bitches you can swing by my place and let me know personally what a whinny bitch looks like
Pat Mcpeak
121 Borden road
Towanda Pa 18848
Sunday’s are for drinking and cutting up the deer you killed that week

Dam...where else can you get all this entertainment! We even got wrastlin’

I hear you guys on the tradition, but I’ll take the additional day.

Oh boy, now the BAMF are coming out against Sunday hunting. Now we are not only up against the Farm bureau and leaf peepers, but ourselves. Nobody said you can’t drink and cut up Deer on Sunday. You want to do that instead of hunt fine with us. Some would like to hunt. Why the problem?

BTW, I was born to the tradition and most likely before you.

PFB has welcomed the support of those "hikers, bikers, equestrians and others", because those groups also oppose more SH. That's because they want to continue to have use of State Game Lands on Sundays, as they have for decades and no hunters around. While the hunters that helped pay for those SGLs, can't hunt on them. Unless they're hunting foxes and crows in season, or coyotes?

While PFB likes to boast about those membership numbers, only those actively farming on a commercial basis, are entitled to a vote..

Over the years, PGC, often with urging from Legislators, has given PFB just about everything they've asked for, when it comes to dealing with crop damages from wildlife. DMAPs, Red Tags, higher doe tag allocations, longer deer and bear seasons and so on. Ask them for one more day of hunting on a weekend, when most have time to hunt and it's 'Oh, hell no".

I don't favor more SH only on SGLs and other public lands. I would favor being able to hunt on my own land, too. From conversations with my kin and camp neighbors that are farmers, so would they.

Agree completely Dube. In addition farmers get to hunt 365 if they desire. GC asks what is going on and all he has to say is crop damage take it. Or hassle me and I will let none hunt here. I’ve seen it.

On my little 56 acres the rules are much different.

Let’s not leave out various farm subsidies, a portion of which comes out of hunters taxes.

I read most of the posts on this and find it a bit incredible.

I understand sentiment on tradition - been doing it since 1973 or so, '75 as a 12 year old with a license. I shot my first deer just outside of Marienville in Elk County. My moms famy is all from Clearfield. We hunted Turkey, deer, bears up there for years. I get it.

I also recall the days of the pumpkin army invading the woods, 100 shots in the first hour, deer running everywhere, and any buck larger than a 3" spike getting shot. 80% of the buck kill in those days were 18 month old deer.

I recall the 'horror' over antler restrictions. Woods be littered with dead bucks too small to tag, never shoot another buck again, etc. Last year I saw 5 bucks on the first day, including a legal nice 8 pt that didn't present a shot right after daylight. Shot an 18" 8 pt on Weds of the second week. My dad shot its twin the same evening.

I am now an out of stater. I drive 600 miles to hunt their because of the tradition involved. Wouldn't miss the first day for anything. This year I'll do something really crazy. Drive up Thursday, hang stands on Friday, hunt Saturday, drive 600 miles home on Sunday. I'll repeat the following Friday to hunt Saturday and stay the following week when does are legal and guys are home bitching about the lack of deer, crappy weather or some other complaint. I'd be willing to bet I hang a decent buck and a doe or two by the end of the season.

Suffice to say, I'm ok with a Saturday opener, antler restrictions, and hopefully Sunday hunting next year. We only have so many seasons on this earth. Let's savor what we have. Carry on.

There is NOTHING like opening day in PA. I am sure the guys in Michigan, Maine, Wisconsin etc. have the same sentiment As has been said before it's about tradition. I have lived opening day in PA and CO, no comparison, just sayin. Do I love Colorado absolutely but it doesn't have the mystique for me Pennsylvania did. I think it has a lot to do with the lead up to opening day the weekend before afforded it. I will probably never hunt opening day in PA ever again, but I will never forget the wonderful times and experiences I had when I was there.

This thread is pure gold!

And like Yogi would say. "It is deja vu over again" Come Deer season it will repeat. Waa, I like Monday, waa I'm happy with Saturday, waa I want to cut up Deer on Sunday, waa I want to hunt on Sunday, waa Grandpa is really pisssed about this Saturday thing and I have to drive to camp with him, waaa Grandma is pisssed that the GC upset Grandpa and she is going to post the farm.

And to top it off, Christmas is on Wednesday this year.

I'm retired, and a long time PA resident, so it doesn't matter much to me, but if they do this without allowing Sunday hunting, I feel it will have a negative effect. As an old fart who has hunted every PA opener for 57 years, I think the northern tier hunting camps and small retailers will suffer, again.
donsm70

They don care about the northern tier. 36% increase in doe kill last year in 2G. Stabilization my ass. 13% reduction in tags this year.....wont even make a dent in last years loss. Its about the trees man, the trees. Failed experiemnt. Oh, cant forget gas, need that revenue. Drill drill drill. Maybe Wolfs gas tax will put a stop to the drillin.

Ok, so did anybody think to ask the deer for their opinion? Easiest way would be to set up a polling station outside The Deer Cave* at 8AM opening day.


* The Deer Cave- that secret hidey hole all the bucks disappear to when the first shots are heard. They contain bunks, lavatories, corn stockpiles, and hooker does. Choice bunks and hookers are on a first-come-first-serve basis, usually claimed by the 10-pointers who are smart enough to arrive the night before.

It must be. Folks wanted to start shooting bigger bucks. So, PA changed the rules so a bunch of does can be shot and let the little guys grow. Then, they started whining about not being able to shoot spikes and forks. Now I've seen some damn fine bucks coming out of PA for the guys that put their time in. Hell, I know a few guys that hunt PA, and their camp butts up against public land. One guy that's never been there, went into those big scary woods with the other hunters and shot a 9pt on his first day. Huh? Who'd a thunk it?

Oh I've been part of hunting traditions my entire life. Camps, opening day's.... You'd have a hard time convincing me that WI's opening day/deer camp tradition isn't as strong as any state in the country. And... hold the phone, it opens on a Saturday!!! It's the week of Thanksgiving. Schools are closed, bars and restaurants get a good portion of their yearly revenue in those 9 days.

Some people even hunt on Sunday. But we all have fun.

Haven't done so lately, but when deer hunters here in PA were on our boards moaning about this and that, I looked at similar boards from MI, WI and OH. Seemed like some of the same "end of the world" crap was going on there, as well, if there were changes coming? Perhaps not as much, but seems like as a group, hunters who like to fuss, ain't in short supply.

Maybe we just look worse, because there are 700,000 of us, instead of smaller numbers in many other states? ;O)

That's BS. Last two years I was able to get two doe tags each year (as a non resident). Should be able to get my two this year.

Keep voting Communist. They appreciate it.

pahick, did you ever pick up your venison from the butcher?

Not in 2f you didnt. They were sold out first week. Like I said 8000 in my wmu.

I like the communist comment it's very true in pa as well as the deer cave

Anyone hunt on gl 66 ??

Interesting debate.. I hunted Pa. until I moved in 1972... Later when I retired in 99 I hunted it every fall until 2015 when the camp was sold.. There is an excitement about Pa.s deer season that is lacking other places.. Here I have units that I can hunt from Sept. til Dec.. Great, but it is not as exciting as that Pa. opener.. I guess if I were still able to hunt there, it would not make much difference to me either way.. Still an exciting time.. Enjoy!!

Lifelong Republican here, sorry

You know I did...

You did more than look Denny. You and old Chuck made sure to ban anyone that raised a stink over the Commission, or anyone who brought data from other states that refuted your agenda. If it wasnt for Mack protecting your identities youd have all been flogged in public.

Look what the Saturday opener for bear did to bear hunting in state before the Saturday opener and all of the first week of deer to sit on your lazy but and wait for first thing to run by and start shooting you couldn’t find a spot to park around any mountain by my house now there’s no one. I’m not against more hunting time just rather see it later in the season when the good weather is starting to take over you wouldn’t hear a complaint about longer season if you didn’t ruin first day

The PGC themselves polled hunters about changing opening days twice and both times results came back hunters did not want to fug with the switch. Yet they voted in favor of it anyway going against their own cash base.
Truth be told it was because one Commissioner wanted his and his brother's college kids to be able to hunt over Thanksgiving weekend. He went on record saying as much at a public board meeting. Just like the Commissioner who wanted baited dove hunting legal in Pa like he pays to do down south.
It is POLITICS PLAIN AND SIMPLE. The day will come when one of those azzholes wants baited deer and bear hunting statewide and will push that thru, too.

Yep!

Youre right, politics. Ask dubePa...Denny Fillmore, president of PFSC. Him and his buddies pushed for it.

And the HuntingPA.com hate has even shown up here!

No it's common sense plain and simple. All our other seasons open on Saturdays but the world is ending because they moved this one to Saturday?

Why do a couple polls if you are not going to listen to the very people you are polling. Little wonder hunters have no respect for an agency that once was revered!

The PGC was once thought one of the best game orgs if not the best and today they have lost the confidence of the back tag buyers. Why because of failed programs, out right lies, getting caught giving sweetheart retirement buy outs to each other,. Still hunters overlooked all of that until they feared getting sued over PaWilds and ordered the drop in deer numbers DCNR wanted.
Those are facts not anecdotes! Many long time sportsman gave up the sport over them and would not give the PGC the spit it takes to wank off with.

What is a "back tag buyers" ?

Its shown up everywhere due to a$$holes like him and Chuck banning everyone. I have a folder I kept of all the screenshots I took right before many were banned.

But thats neither here nor there. What really matters is the lying [bleep] actions. Legislators dont like that very much. When Dennys crew, especially Melody, got up in front of the legislators they made an ass of themselves. I saved that video too. Total disgrace. GC biologists and PFSC got knocked down a few pegs that day.

What makes you think they stopped their deceiving ways?

Back Tag is what Pa call a general licence then you buy additional licences such as archery, mz, bear, pheasant,etc.

I got a permanent ban from HPA myself but it wasn't because of Denny. It was because Roosterbooster had a hard on for me.

We used to have to wear our hunting licenses on our backs. They became known as "backtags"

It was hard to piss John off. Dont mess with the owner...lol

A clown named "TaterDavid" issued the ban on me.

LMAO..thats funny. I wont go into why. Casey, Chuck Lombaerde, Dennys buddy and PFSC VP banned me the last time. With a smart ass comment added to it. Neither would talk like they did in the comment to my face and walk away. Why John befriended these phuggs ill never know.

"TaterDavid"..........Amish? 😀

You know who this bitch is? You should.

I probably know her name but not her face?

IDK. He was just some joke of a Moderator.

Why thats Melody Schell herself. PFSC Consultant.

I took a minute to upload a nice video for you...from '14, but you can see our pros in action with special guest from PFSC. It is long, 2 hrs. Just FF to the good parts...theres many....lol

Yup. I know the name!

You should know other popular names also. Remember GalThatFishes? Kathy Davis...Miss QDMA.....(or did she and Brad Gehman"Dutch" get married?)

She liked the spotlight also...



How about JohnS, remember him? ID is now WoodsWalker.

Any other names ring a bell...
Steve Smith
Joe Neville
Gene Schang(huge jerkoff!)
Lowell Graybill..........

Just a wee bit out of all the knob slobbers.

I know Kathy and Brad personally. Brad is a friend of mine. As for John S. I've been dealing with him online for years. Some good, some bad.

That explains much.

That the same Brad "Dutch"Gehman from Pa.Bowsite.com , QDMA idiot self appointed spokesperson for every hunter in the state of Pa. ?

Yep that is him! Your description is spot on. Whom is he or QDMA or PFSC to speak for me or anyone else, I am perfectly capable of having my own opinions about the deer herd in Pa. ...and it sucks in 85% of the state. The Game department made up of people whom rarely step out from behind a computer and into the woods ruined it all for the sake of their health and retirment plans.

The same. Isnt it a coincidence Brad, with his 420 acres, was a "major" stakeholder for one of the CACs. Kathy was what? Director of a PA branch of QDMA. She ends up on Outdoor Life IIRC bear hunting, rounds up backing from agencies to push for Sundays. Gets HUSH started, with backing from PFSC, lawsuit with PFSC(see earlier post with Dennys(dubePa) signature.......spent a lot of time commuting from Charleroi to Harrisburg. Maybe thats why she hooked up with Brad, save gas money

I could post a lot, along with names, money, lobbyists, etc etc etc.....but it would go over most folks heads, here. Most dont have a peersonal interest in PA, or the politics surrounding game management. But ill say this, the deceving thieving sobs would make for one helluva made for tv movie.

Oh really? Just what does it explain? Are you getting kghunty again?

Not at all. Just sayin, a friend of theirs...really isnt worth much.

Yup. You went back to being kghunty.

This thread is almost as much fun as bum fights.

If you don't have a dog in the fight why comment at all?
I make my stance perfectly clear for everyone to see...THE PGC CAN NOT MANAGE A GOOD CRAP LET ALONE THE DEER HERD... I do not hide behind goup names or private adgendas, etc. can you say as much?

The Dutchess really did have a high opinion of herself, I thought her and her multiple personalities was banned from most "hunting" sites. Wasn't she a maid or house cleaner of some sort ?
Along with being a doe slaying b*tich?

Any luck up there

If he didn't, I did !!!

I am jumpin up and down happy to see a Saturday opener !!!!!!!!

Hear, hear. I left Pa 45 years ago, recently moved back. They have royally fugged up ALL Pa hunting, not just deer. I'm in Erie. A buck has to have 3 up, so essentially an 8 point. There flat out are not a lot of those on public land. I counted 2 on my game cameras, on the 1700 acres I hunt.

Sorry to hear that, travel east to the ANF and you will find plenty

Might have to do that. It's frustrating.

Geez, another HPA knob gobbler...

PAhick, I've heard all about you from my sources. I had forgotten how big a douche you actually were.

LOL....I bet you did. Glad I made your day

This has really been a let down the last few days. Then I saw a news story that they were opening up PA to sunday hunting, and going to a preference point system and only allowing 1 tag a year maximum. something about the doe population needing rescued and providing more opportunity for nonresidents.


you guys hear anything about that???

The "Redflag" laws are going to the real game changers for the Dutchess and a few others with known mental illness issues that scream the loudest and most often about things that they know so little about.

Absolutely. The catch is,the non residents have to buy a general license,a bear tag,and a Sasquatch license just to buy a preference point. With a 3% charge for credit card purchases. Don't forget. The cost of said licenses will increase yearly as demand escalates. But only for non residents. Bout time PA starts cash cropping our nation's wildlife. Like the big western states have.

Who is this "Dutchess" you keep whining about?

Pretty brassy statement from a fellow who, not only, knows not chit from Shinola, but doesn't know me, either.

With all respect due you, sir.........eat a dikk.

You guys get riled up way too fast...funny as phug! Youre right, I dont know you Don. Relax....

I see reading comprehension is not one of your strong points.

Are ya relaxed now Don, oops I mean Strut, er uh ...Yoder? Can we talk this Saturday thing over now? Im not brassy anymore

Well I can't see that you're speaking about Dutch. All he ever did was fight for Sunday hunting. If that's what has you and Hick bent out of shape then you have problems.

Thats not what has many of us, not just me and jimy, pissed off about. The Commission never listens to hunters. 2/3 opposed this move. A majority was against Sunday hunting, and your buddy Brad, his skank, PFSC and many many more pushed passed anyone that got in their way. Took money from foolhearted naive individuals for a lawsuit that was hell bent to fail. Put themselves in positions(CAC) to skew data. Your friends, Denny, Chuck, etc etc, filled message boards pushing QDMA, Sunday hunting, and more under hidden identities.....some still on THIS board. Acting as an average Joe, spewing BS to mold minds to their liking. Banning anyone that dared question their agenda or motives. Lobby the capital, lying, deceiving, bribing and harassing legislators.

If the common man, hunter or non hunter, knew of their doings they'd be hung in public. The reason why they hide behind IDs, many times multiple. They will use anyone and anything to get what they want. Fortunately, some know who they are and what they do. And some folks have been lucky enough to be informed, through friends and politicians, of their actions. Most dont want to believe theyve been deceived by people who are supposed to be conservationists, true stewards of the land.

The deceivers wish you to believe theyve moved on, no longer involved in their mischievous endeavors. Some never forget.

I thought the dutchess was most convincing when he went to bat for the 2&3 year olds that had no voice of their own in allowing them to hunt spring gobblers with the rest of the big girls.

A lot of phaggotry going on around here.

Are you bringing the voice of authority to the discussion or speaking only from your own personal experiences ?

Not that there's anything wrong with that...

I was shocked to learn of the mancrush you have on Dutch.

I see you're a Justin Beiber fan.

Better change your blade. It's not cutting.

You ladies are a HOOT!!

LMMFAO!! I have never went rounds with you dooshmike on HPA, lying sack of schit!!!.....You gals are a special sort. Denny, now we have had a few. And by all means, let us have it "bushmaster"

I never got the boot, and im still there. And HPA, I still have privileges. Brad, its no secret I dont like you or your hunny. I know youll see this, so I want you to know that you have no worries me having you clean my carpet...lol..nah seriously. I could post a lot of schit it would make your head spin. Bank on it bud! The piddly schit I posted earlier is nothing. Believe that.

Now, I didnt go there because of you, but Denny playing behind his screen name here again. I dont play. Hes phuggin scum and if him or anyone else thinks the same "Pretty sure you'd have a great time in the woods hunting with him? But I doubt he'd come back out again in the same shape he went in." theyre welcome to try. I can guarantee it wont go as planned for them.

As far as your past dealings, and those you associate(d) with, thats in the past and this is a new day. I am still very close with whats at hand. Kathy got it wrong years ago with Alloway and Moul, thats all ill say. I still know whats up and its all you personally need to know.

?

most of em I reckon by how passionate they are. just my .02

A little too much steel city for the Pa girls tonight. PAchick is in rare form.

Hardly...I didnt get to the point I wanted to head to Lititz to kick anyones ass

OK dooshmike, err uhh, triggercreep, turning off your sig line isnt going to hide your identity...lol. You a sly one though, not

I'm not sure what Brad Gehman,Kathy Davis,Denny Filmore or even the PFSC has to do with a saturday opener.I'm almost 100% sure that the PFSC or whatever their name is,was against a saturday opener.I personally don't give a royal flying crap whether the season starts on a saturday or a monday as far as my selfish,self centered interests go.My house is my camp so an earlier start will give me an extra day but unless if benefits more people than it hurts,I would be against it.The PGC did a small survey,showing 65% against and I personally feel it was kick right in the nads to most hunters,if in fact the survey was a reasonable cross section of what most hunters wanted.As far as sunday hunting goes,I've yet to see a rational argument as to why we can't hunt on sunday.Those taking the initiative to move that forward deserve credit my my opinion.I'm personally not motivated enough to really care much about that either,even though I feel it's a baseless law,

Bottom line;
The Saturday opener was the backdoor to Sunday hunting in PA. The Commissioners know it, the PGC knows it, the DCNR knows it...Hunters didn't have a say but it's part of "the agenda". Gotta love the politics of PA hunting. Sunday hunting will be added in 2020 and the squeaky wheels will be greased. All will be happy, as the numbers of PA hunters continues to plummet.

I've 'heard' that Sunday hunting might lead to dancing.

So... "dancing's" a good thing Steel?

No Sunday hunting, whether only on public land or not, would be an absolute deal breaker for me.

I'd be moving ASA Modda Fück'n P.

That's just me though. Folks can have their "traditions".

Well... there you are... we have that.

Apparently not, ask the people of Bomont, Utah.

So... "dancing's" a good thing Steel?



Well fill me in on Bomont, Utah Steel....

Google is your friend.

But if Sunday hunting happens in PA, the next thing you know there will be dancing. Before long that damned Rock n Roll music will take root.

It's a slippery slop.

Shalom.

Ahhh. Steel; Yep, got it... Lord knows where this will all end; We be "dancing"...Right? Wouldn't want to "change" anything.... But they did, and in a way that will alter the course of hunting in PA forever... But then, you don't really care about "tradition" ...Am I right?

I love tradition, but not for tradition's sake. Sheit's always changing, it's the way of the world.

Shouldn't matter what day deer season opens. Old guys can still get together on the Saturday after Thanksgiving, eat fish, drink whiskey and complain about arthritis and taxes.

Shouldn't... but it does for some. Those "some" just happen to be a majority of PA hunters... You don't give a rat's ass... but some do...So there you have it; a difference of opinion.

Good to know you know what the majority want. Of course our country was not built on mob rules.

Enjoy your extra day of hunting, even if it is apparently one of the Seven Seals

The "majority" spoke, it's documented in the PGC poll... and were ignored Steel. "They" didn't want a Saturday opener nor Sunday huntin.... Not "mob rule". Yep I like your "twist"....And what... You be get'n religious on me. lol

EVERY hunter was polled? The poll don't mean much, if you want it to mean something have it go to a public vote.


Besides, the deer belong to the state, seems the king should decide what is best for his herd.

LOL. You are special Steel... Does it take "every hunter" (100%) to make a poll valid? Does every US citizen take a political poll? Do your statistics Steel... And "the king"? Who is the King? lol. Oh, and this is Good Friday don't 'cha know... You still be get'n religious on me here... lol

Bout tired of this no Sunday hunting crap. I can go to the gas station fill my truck and buy a 6 pack, or go to the state store and buy a 5th of whiskey but I cant legally hunt with my kids. Wtf???

Bunch of fuggin puzzies anyways. Oh they gave us another day to hunt deer!! Good lord..

STAY THE HELL AT YOUR CAMP AND DO WHAT THE FUG YOU WANT!!

OR ARE YOU JUST AFRAID SOMEONE WILL SHOOT "YOUR" DEER ??

IF YOU DONT WANT THE SATURDAY OPENER DONT PHUGGING HUNT IT!! SIMPLE!!

Too simple. They're not going to be happy until everyone is as miserable and bitter about it as they are.

Seriously? You're the jackwagon that stated the MAJORITY of PA Hunters. If there are 900,000 deer hunters and you poll 5000, is that the majority of PA hunters?

Once again, you can't stay on a single train of thought, perhaps you shouldn't own a gun, considering your dementia.

Well... You Steel don't know a damn thing about statistics... Again, do some homework. A mind is a terrible thing to waste. And yes, I am a bit crazy Steel; but do your homework and check the poll that the PGC/Com did... the majority didn't want a Saturday opener... And no, I shouldn't own a firearm... I'm a bit crazy... And you? Yep... lol

Who is they? The 65% who didn't want the Saturday opener?

For the hearing impaired?

I have no beef with anyone who didn't want the Saturday opener. I only take issue with the adult babies who are still crying about it.

So... we have no voice? You wanted it. You got it. Those of us who didn't... Just shut up? Hardly. Take issue with the opposition maybe but they're not "cry babies", they're the majority voice of PA hunters.

Should Hillary be President then? After all, the majority of people voted for her.

Point is, sometimes you do the right thing regardless of what the majority want.

Do you understand How a president is actually elected? Electoral... What?

So... You just do what you want to do regardless because you can... for the "peoples sake"... Those in power know best... Sounds like... ?

Way better than you understood my point.

They say a large percentage of PA hunters are baby boomers. And they were mostly opposed to the Saturday opener. That means the hunting landscape will be changing drastically here within 15 years. So we're going to need some new blood in the ranks. This was an effort to achieve that.

Originally Posted by Barnstorm
Do you understand the How a president is actually elected? Electoral... What?


Way better than you understood my point.


So.... What's your point. Enlighten me...

"They say".... Well, then let's just kick these "Boomers" out the door.. Yep... let's just do that.

It was about the majority not always getting their way. In this case a large percentage of those who oppose this are baby boomers. Should they be deciding the future of hunting when in 15 years it will be hard finding a boomer afield?

I’m not a baby boomer.

If only the right thing was a certainty.

Nobody needs kicked out of anything. But if folks over 55 years old are heavily against changes that might bode well for the future of hunting, how much consideration do we give that? They aren't the future of hunting.

The right thing is not a certainty. This is an attempt but it might not work.

I can’t imagine this is representative of the commissioners’ actual position.

I have no way of knowing whether it is or isn't.

To some extent, the Commission is inherently prescriptive.

Determining the preferences of today’s hunters proves challenge enough, let alone speculating what and how future generations are going to think and feel. To then justify policy based on said speculation is insane.

Yep

I just read that for next year the PA Game Commision is proposing to move Good Friday to Monday.

Obviously the GC worded the poll question wrong. Should have been: "Are you in favor of an extra Saturday to hunt Deer?"

It probably would have passed 99%+

just checking. we still bitching over here? ok carry on.

Or maybe it should have read... "Are you willing to give up a day of small game/turkey after Thanksgiving" ... Deer hunters gained a day, small game hunters lost a day... Was a good day for family and sons and daughters to be together and just simply hunt small game after a day of Thanksgiving; no more... It's all about kill'n deer... have at me...

Yep still "bitch'n"... gonna be that way for a while... Some just don't like the way we been screwed... go figure? ... And yes... we'll carry on ...

Shyt, Pa. must be alot different than NY if anybody is worried about losing a day of small game hunting. I know tons of hunters here in NY and all anybody hunts anymore is Turkey and deer. I still do a fair bit of squrrel and rabbit hunting myself but I haven't run into another small game hunter afield in like 25 years. No antlers, no beards, no glory, ain't worth it, seems to be the attitude.

Yep. That’s why there is exactly one thread in the small game forum. Pretty representative of the level of interest.

Small game is the gateway for young'ns to deer...

Used to be, not so sure anymore.

Brainstormer,

Does the PA deer season open on Monday?

Nope.. not anymore; And we be happy.... No?..

I just wanted a longer Rifle season. I would've preferred an extra week tacked on to the end but I'll gladly take a Saturday up front. Yeah it screws with my tradition too. They did the same thing to Bear season a few years ago and I adapted to the Saturday opener and I figure this will be no different.

Habitat being what it is, subdivisions have made for a thriving Hunter’s Campfire forum.

Can't you hunt squirrel after deer season? How about the day after Christmas? Damn, millions of kids will never get to hunt now.

You're so funny.

Winter Rabbit and Squirrel season:

Dec 26 till Feb 28

All those great days to be together with family, sons and daughters. All ruined because of losing a Saturday to Deer. 😢😢😢😢 Damn that GC, they have no sympathy for family and friends.

Am I missing something here? If the extra Saturday for deer is to be the Saturday after Thanksgiving, how is that going to make small game hunters loose a day if the small game season is Dec 26 to Feb 28.....or is the sarcasm emoji still not present?

Hell, I can't count the number of rabbits, grouse and other small game I have killed while out deer hunting. Is multi-tasking that lost of an art?

Small game and deer (rifle) season are separate out here. It’s not like out west.

Mentioned previously a friends brother has top shelf Beagles and they kill at least 100 a year. Of course he works at keeping 4-5 Dogs all year.

Another guy has a Squirrel Dog that finds Squirrels you had no clue were there. Again, some effort involved.

Buds and I with Bird Dogs shoot bunches of GC Pheasants. Enough that it amount to 3-4K at a preserve. All for the cost of a $26.90 Pheasant stamp. I think I get my monies worth, but perhaps if I advocated tearing the GC apart I could do better.

Past year was perhaps the 3rd or 4th out of 20 or so i didn’t kill a nice Buck. And I could have shot a legal Buck, but passed. Could have shot Does also, but didn’t. Of course I hunted more than a little. I think every day but one. I sucked this year. I don’t think I can blame the GC.

If they don’t get their act together soon, I may have to start a protest.

I figured that was the case, but the dates we making me scratch my head....so I think battue had a sarcastic streak going on there....correct?

Correct.
That is an additional season that starts after Deer.

Some think that hunting then with family has less significance than the day after Thanksgiving. They must feel more like Pilgrims around Thanksgiving. As you know we are a traditional State to the extreme.

For clarity

Early small game used to end the Saturday after Thanksgiving. Now it will end on Black Friday.

Rifle season was traditionally separate from everything else. It was explained to me as a kid that this was to prevent deer poaching.. The logic being that if you were in the woods with a gun during deer season, you had to have a deer tag. It’s difficult to fathom, but PA’s deer herd (and many other species) was nearly wiped out in the last quarter of the nineteenth century. It’s always been my understanding that the architecture and culture of game regulation in PA was shaped by recovering from this period.

Oh, I see now. There's actual "early" and "late" small game seasons....not just "early in" or "late in" THE small game season.

That makes sense.


Well that doesn't really make sense, but I see where my confusion was now.

End on Black Friday? The State is going to lose millions on sales tax from families out hunting. I bet the GC fools never gave it a thought. Break them up!!!!

Yea, they used to want everything to stop during rifle deer season. One exception was waterfowl (Fedeally Regulated migratory species). In recent years, the GC has deviated from this a bit, particularly with the blending of the late bear season with rifle season (in some units) and the open season on coyotes. When I was a kid, we didn’t have any coyotes, not in the western part of the state anyway. Now they’re abundant everywhere.

Never personally hunted turkey or small game Saturday after Thanksgiving.Squirrel phuggin stinks... grouse are pretty thin. Lost late season after Christmas and didnt bitch this much. Try again. Turkey hunting is for spring

I would have preferred if they kept the opening day for deer on the Monday following Thanksgiving. While I never took part in the events, it was nice to see everyone out on the weekend before, buying new socks, boots, etc. Even hitting the range to get that final sight in on their rifles. I always had my gear and guns ready long before the first day.

I don't really care one way or the other when the opening day is. I take 3 weeks of vacation starting the Friday before gun bear season opener and I'm off until the last day of gun deer season. What it this year's opening day doing to be like?? Well, I guess it will be more crowded in the woods, which I guess is what the PGC wants. More people moving around should mean more game being moved. We'll see.

But, based on the lack of deer I saw last year, I don't know if there are that many to move around!!

I was born and raised in PA and Deer season was the family heading to camp after Thanksgiving and spending 3 days getting ready for the opener. As a kid those 3 days were more exciting than the week before Christmas. It feels like another tradition has been lost.

Old-Willys,

I see you are in California these days. How many years out of the last 10 have you taken the 3 days before Deer season and went to camp? How many days did you stay in camp and hunt Deer?

For years on this forum, posters have been commenting about camps sitting empty on opening Day. Yet, we have more than a few against the Saturday change because of lost tradition.

I’ve been in the North country when the place went vacant of Deer hunters on Tuesday afternoon. The tradition seems to have died long before the GC decided to go with Saturday.

I get what old willys is saying. Understand totally. Like another poster said,I'll take the whole season off work anyway,so the opener isn't that big a deal to me. I do think it's silly without the addition of Sunday hunting. Would have seemed a better fit. At any rate. A mouth piece for the PGC at the Harrisburg show said they caught so much crap over Sunday hunting,and the semi auto debate, both are off the table indefinitely.

I think folks my age are just remembering all the good times they had over the last 40 or 50 years. Traditions. Camps. Ho!idays. All of it. There is a pretty strong "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" sentiment among people my age. I hunt Sat and Sunday in Colorado. Season opens and runs the requisite number of days. I really don't even think about it. It just the way they do it. I'll do what ever the law allows here as well. I do however, think sportsmen should have a vote. No a poll. A vote. Let the majority rule. I'm going to hunt. Here or somewhere else. Ain't America great?

Perfect example of the Pa problem: “I want to do it my way.”

“I don’t hunt small game on Saturday after Thanksgiving”. Some do. “Squirrel phuggin stinks.” “I don’t know what that means. But Pa has Squirrels pretty much everywhere and with a .22LR are great shooting practice for Deer. “Grouse are thin.” Well they are in most places. “Turkey hunting is for spring.” Well, some would just as soon hunt them in the fall.

Campaign enough and the majority may vote for Wednesday next year and a few years later Tuesday. Then what.

I see Old-willies point. Mine is the tradition left the Nothwoods a long time ago. Nor are any saying you can’t go to camp the way you always have. The big unspoken worry is someone may have shot your Deer on Saturday

I much prefer Fall Turkey. Never really got used to the bugs, ticks, and hot weather of the Spring season.

What do your state representatives think? Someone mentioned contacting them in another thread about the mailman temporarily not delivering your mail (nuisance dog?).This situation seems FAR MORE appropriate.

Some of our state Reps are upset enough due to constituent feedback opposed to Saturday, that they're rumored to be thinking about a legislative "fix" to what is a regulatory move by the game commission. Many of us do not favor more legislative interference than already exists, even if we aren't in favor of a Saturday opener.

I see mention of us having a vote. Hope that didn't mean public referendums like CA and some other states have? The mob could just as easily pass a referendum that bans hunting?

There was already an opportunity to voice an opinion on the issue of a Saturday opener and it failed. There was a similar opportunity over a year ago, to voice an opinion on semis for big game. As I recall, most that "voted" in that feedback poll, didn't want semis? Semis would be fine with me. As with more Sunday hunting, such things work well almost everywhere else.

Me too. My first turkey was a fall bird.

I made that point a few pages ago.

To clarify my other post. Dont play cards and drink all night then post!
We quit hunting squirrel because we dont eat them and they smell like hell when you clean them. I agree fun as gell to shoot but if we arent going to eat them, we arent shooting them.
Personally never got into fall Turkey hunting, my first bird was a hen in the fall I happened across 25 years ago. Si cr then all spring gobblers.
We love grouse hunting, it was our favorite late season hunt. Always went to camp after Christmas with the guys. Now we just go to play cards.

I just didnt agree with the arguement that guys had to lose a day of small game to hunt deer on the new opener.

I will say it again. 3 of my family members could not hunt the Monday opener due to college or work issues. Now my dad, my wife and my daughter can get in the woods on opening day. Maybe I'm being selfish but that's good enough for me.

It's hard to believe the camp traditions of past of most died.

I can't imagine what 15-20 year old wouldn't love being around a bunch of 60 year plus old men. Busting the kids nuts, telling them how it use to be, how bad the new generation is, drinking, farting and other fun old man noises.

Bitching about every ache, sitting on a stump for an hour in the morning and telling everyone how bad the PCG has fugged things up.


Sign me up for some of that sheit.

The traditions then surely have passed, because things most certainly were different back then. As kids we couldn’t wait to go to camp and get to hang with those old guys. Looking back they were mostly average men of their time. However, to us kids they were “Giants” and for the most part are bigger today than they were then.

They watched over us when needed and when the time came they cut us loose.

Any who missed out on something similar during their formative years, missed out on some really good sheit.

+1 battue.

You can't you tube this stuff. You have to experience it. Of course. The youth of today couldn't put down the devices long enough to enjoy camp. As for the old farts. Agree with them or not. You still respected them,and fetched fire wood or what ever else you were asked to do. A right of passage. Good character building respect. So what if they told the same old stories year after year. Call it consistency.

Having to feign respect for aggressively ignorant, physically inferior old dudes that lack the self awareness to realize kids learn more about hunting, fishing and fixing their truck from devices than people who proudly stopped learning 25+ years ago.

And none of that has a damn thing to do, with the things battue tried to point out.

I have watched this thread and there are valid points on both sides of the issue. Have not posted till now.

I am not in favor but am not crying about it. It certainly will change tradition in our camp. Have always enjoyed Friday and Saturday after Thanksgiving doing odd chores and playing catch up on last minute projects. We have alwatys hosted a very nice get together on Sunday, then hunted Monday of course. Monday evening we hosted a spaghetti supper exchanged stories, admired any kills etc. That will all change, it will be missed by all.

For what it is worth, one, 1 of my hunting buds like the new law, everyone else opposes it.

I respected the hell out of those old guys and I hung on their every word.

Well, if you are going to troll,I'll bite.

That is about as ignorant a post as I've seen here in a while. Painting with a mighty wide brush too I might add.

Aggressively ignorant. Well you have that dialed in.

Physically inferior. No shortage of arrogance there either. I spent several years training act 120 cadets in our MMA club. A portion of it in my early 50s. There were some physically superior young fellas that didn't want to get on the mat with me. Be careful what old dude you poke at scooter. You may just get the ever !ovin chit kicked out of you.

What you still just can't seem to grasp,is what battue and I have said. You can't you tube memories. Time shared with loved ones. Or simple respect for those that were here before all the go pro heros. Folks that didn't know how to score a rack. Folks that fed their families when meat wasn't on the table every meal. Folks that dug gardens for ten cents a day during the deptession. Then took the money home and gave it to Dad. Families that shared a rifle. And still managed to kill game . Poor ignorant sonsabitches. No tree stands. No trail cameras. Just woodsmanship.

Disrespect them if you want. I'll listen to their stories. Again. And again. And when they are all gone we will be poorer for it. Sitting in a box blind for a week just doesn't make much of a story. Some even call that hunting. Funny chit.

And that's the ever loving point, shouldn't matter what day it opens for that to occur. Reading some of the posts would lead one to think that being a parent, friend, mentor is entirely based on PCG votes.

Agreed. Things shouldn't have to come to a screeching halt. Adapt and overcome.

Until recently, you had to be twelve to get your own tags. They came with a hunting license. At twelve you’d get to go to camp. It was a right of passage. The camps of my youth were filled with men who came from every walk of life, each one with stories of places and things you’d never heard of. Many were old warriors who’d fought in the World Wars, Korea, and Vietnam Nam. At camp you got your first glimpse of the world without women in the audience. It was just men. We looked forward to turning twelve and getting to go to camp. It was a big deal.

The world’s changed, but this is how it was. Thirty years later, I look forward to camp all year long—still, with all the hope of an eleven year old boy. You’re right to recognize the difference between twelve and fifteen year olds. Anymore, for lots of kids, hunting is not cool. It’s a stigma. This may even be the case for the vast majority of kids. At the same time, the very notion of manhood is under attack and association with it is a stigma.

One thing I’ve seen come out of these threads is people posting what’s been important to them — posting about what they cherish. Seeing these sentiments published, even if in this most informal medium, is pretty cool. Interestingly, before internet forums, these values were memorialized in holidays and traditions, by the sheer act of repeating them over and over for generations. All is not lost.

Amen

Great post

The sentence about manhood rings true. Its wrong to be openly proud of being a man these days. Aint that just a little bit sad.

This is a great post with wonderful insight.




This is what I grew up with as well.

And opening deer season on Saturday changes that how exactly?

Thanksgiving Day: People travel for the family get together. If you've driven hours for that, then have to go back home, load up for the trip to camp, maybe in the opposite direction, that's a factor?

Friday: Hunters travel, some four or five hours, to get to deer hunting spot/camp.But many linger on Friday, to spend more time with gathered family that came for Thanksgiving, before going to hunting spot/camp..

Saturday or Sunday: Travel days for those that didn't leave Friday to head out for camp,and prepare for the Monday opener we've had here for over 55 years

If you're going to travel hours to deer camp for a Saturday opener, you now have to leave early on Friday, in many cases. A change to Saturday opener primarily benefits those that hunt near home, students home for Thanksgiving, etc. It disrupts the normal state of things for those having to spend half a day getting to where they hunt. At least this change takes advantage of most having Friday off?

When they changed bear season to a Saturday opener, many hunters had to take a vacation day Friday to get to camps, when they'd already taken off the old Monday opener and usually Tuesday?. Bottom line, most hunters were happy with the way things were. Some that couldn't get a Monday off, weren't happy. Some that had to go back to college and couldn't hunt Monday, weren't happy. So now we're catering to those that weren't happy.

It doesn't matter if they adopted this change or not, someone's gonna whine about it. Lots of guys don't work on the Friday after Thanksgiving anyway. 'Guess we all have to make a decision to either travel on Friday to hunt on Saturday, or continue to travel over the weekend, knowing full well that someone may have taken a deer that might have come in front of us on Saturday. No matter what, someone's gonna complain.

Nobody has made it clear to me why they have to do anything. I can't recall any bitching with the way its been.

Can't imagine why hunting camp traditions and culture are eroding as participants keep aging and less and less young people want to be part of it. Blame the kids, blame the game commission, blame the technology. Just don't force these old guys to look critically at their attitudes and behavior. Don't make them ask themselves why spending time with them doesn't produce fond memories of 'time shared with loved ones' for the people they need to perpetuate their traditions.

LOL.That sums it up very well.What young kid wouldn't want to be around a bunch of guys bitching about how great it was to see 50 tiny deer by noon and now the car insurance companies paid the PGC off to kill the deer and ruin hunting.

Geezus, how many deer camps are there in Pa. anyway ? What percentage of Pa. hunters hunt out of a camp ? We have lots of deer camps in NY too but BY FAR most folks just hunt from home. Crypes I live at deer camp all year round. I can walk out my back door and hunt the mountain out back or I can walk out the front door, cross the road and hunt the mountain on the other side. It's mostly non residents and city folks that hunt out of camps around here. Can't say as I give a shyt what they think about our Saturday opener. All the locals I know hereabout love it.

I cherished every moment spent in camp with the old timers. It was drilled into me that I'd better respect my elders every chance I got and I still honor that to this day. I was the only "kid" in camp. I enjoyed the opportunity to watch and learn from the older fellows. I know times have changed, but these guys didn't become good deer hunters and good men overnight. The younger generation can learn a lot from these guys, and I hope kids these days still look forward to hanging with the Old Guard like I did.

While that is certainly true,times have changed.Most old hunters that I run into do nothing but bitch and whine about how the PGC ruined huntingI live and hunt in North central Pa and the hunting has never been better on our public lands than it is now.When my son was 9,I dropped him and my one buddy off around noon on the first day of the season at a spot to walk in and I drove around to park and push out a long narrow strip of Laurel that went along a steep ridge.This was a DMAP'd area of public land about 2 miles from my house.It's nothing but large clearcuts and laurel patches with plenty of deer.When I pulled in,there were about 4 trucks parked and about 1/2 dozen guys standing around B.S.ing.I asked them how it was going and they had nothing but doom and gloom.No deer,no shooting and they were calling it a day.Less than 20 minutes later I pushed about 15 deer past my son and buddy and my kid killed a big doe.It wasn't a far drag from where I parked and most of the guys were still there when we loaded the deer in my truck.Not one of them congratulated my son.Most of them stood around but one of them started to run his mouth about me letting my kid shoot a doe.

Doug, old hunters are the biggest PMS bitchbabies we have. They apparently can't adapt to anything and the Blame Commission is always the root cause of their bitterness. It's sad.

I respected the hell out of the old timers that were at camp when I was a kid but they're dead and gone and I wouldn't want to be under the same roof as these old whiners we have today. I pity todays kids.

Amen, there are a few exceptions, but overall you are spot on. Back in the day the old timers were gruff and tough because they had to be to survive. now a days a lot of them are just aszholes to be aszholes. as one of the youngest in the group I often hunt with I can say I am blessed for the guys I get to share a camp with. I wouldn't call them "old timers" but they are older than me by a generation. I've hunted enough states, and guided in a few to see that a lot of what I would call "old timers" are straight up azhats. perhaps it's the type that gravitate to guided or canned hunts (done both) who knows, but I now the type of which you refer.

I just thought about another factor. The Saturday opener may help the overall quality of hunting. Lots of guys wait right after Thanksgiving and go "scout" for 3 days before the old Monday opener, hang stands whatever.

This may keep those guys out of the woods and not educate the deer right befor the gun season starts

Good point!

Same.

When I was 10 I got to miss school for the first time to go to camp on Friday morning. It was still one of the most fun deer hunting trips I've ever had. My dad shot a buck on our way to his stand on opening morning. Right at first light. I was standing next to him. Later that evening he shot a doe... It was the coolest day I'd ever had in my short 10 years. I'll never forget any of it. I remember almost every detail about that day before opener. I could even tell you what magazine my cousin and I were looking at and the beer my dad and uncle were drinking. Hell, I know what we had for dinner after the 2 deer opening day.

The only thing I love more than hunting is God, my wife and kids...So to sit and read you guys bitching about something as sacred as you make it sound makes me shake my head. I don't care if opening day is Wednesday, Saturday, Sunday, or Christmas Eve, I'm going. Traditions are started every day...start a new one on Saturday instead of Monday.

Camp is what you make it. A house, a rented cabin, a tent, a lean-to of pine boughs. Just make it.

Great post T.


Can I make a guess as to what "magazine" you and your cousin were looking at?

Not that one. But, it was available.

We were looking at a North American Whitetail.

+ 1 Tom.

'n with ya Rooster !

Very well said Tom.

Knowing Tom, it wasn't Playgirl!