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And there is only one way to be just?

Remember the Genesis Flood? Save for the few lives on Noah's Ark, all terrestrial life was killed to sate God's blood thirsty wrath. Was that just? Among the billion humans alive then, I would suspect there was at least one innocent unborn.

Neither can He lie. His Grace has no limit but is sufficient, full, abundant, and offers salvation for all.

Schneiderman ... that's an Italian name, isn't it?

Well put.

I'm a little disappointed in you. You're using the same tactic as Antelope Sniper........... you shackle your opponent to the bible, no matter what he posts. Here is Ricky's post you replied to and you'll find no reference to the bible in it:

"Maybe not in your eyes, but then you don't know the God many of us do. Man always has to comply with the laws of the law givers, in all areas of his existence. That includes political law by other men, laws of nature, laws of longevity, and spiritual law. Know God and you will know His law is not only just but also abundantly Gracious.[b]"

It just could be that Ricky WAS thinking of some scripture when he wrote his post. Something like : "I will write my Law on their hearts... ."

[ but He equipped us with an eraser ]

curdog4570



Very good post.

IF I thought you were an honest seeker - and I was shackled to the Bible - I'd ask you to consider a Creator God who runs the Universe on two basic principles :

Absolute Justice

Absolute Mercy

In the unavoidable collision of these incompatible principles, He satisfies His Justice AND His Mercy by standing in the Dock for Humanity.

That is of course, if you accept the vicarious sacrifice deal. I personally believe that the vicarious sacrifice angle is but a shadow of what Jesus's death actually accomplished.

Yes,I think there is only one way to be just. Justice must be an absolute,otherwise is is only a compromise. Men deal in compromise,God deals in absolutes.

You look at the flood with your mind already made up about God.Otherwise you wouldn't slander someone you do not know. The problem is that you have been fooled by the real enemy to think that God is the enemy. Satan laughs at you as you slander and rave against your only hope for help.


I also have my mind made up about God,but in contrast to you,I see God as just and good. What I see in the flood is the salvation of man. I see God making a way for men to be saved and pleading with them for around a 100 years before judgement came. Then ,just as now, men ignored the pleadings and scoffed at the messenger.

Curdog, Your perceptions of God, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit seem to be way above what a casual believer and Bible reader, such as I, would percieve.

May I ask if your precepts originate from the Bible or possibly from your own feelings, observations, contemplations, or revelations?

I mean, am I missing things in scripture due to a normal IQ?

First off, anything I've posted which interested you was certainly not due to a high I Q. I'm pretty sure a couple[at least a couple] of our Atheist members are far above me in that respect.

I've discovered that if I bring any honest question to God, He either answers it, or removes the question from my mind so that I'm not troubled by it anymore. In cases where He satisfied my question with an "answer", I share those on the off chance it might help someone else. Of course I'm aware that the "answer" was directed to me and may not fit everyone.

But, and I emphasize this, my initial questioning has to be for my own edification, not just curiosity or a desire to impress someone.

There was a period when I did quite a lot of bible study. I can see now that it was mainly just mental masturbation, but it was helpful in that I sometimes get my "answer" in a suddenly remembered passage of scripture. Most often, it's just an idea that floats up from somewhere or maybe while visiting with someone on a totally unrelated topic, they will make a comment.

If we take the O.T. literally, we wind up with a god much smaller than the Entity that created all there is. Our mind is not capable of comprehending a self-existent Entity not bound by time or space. I think we are better off just recognizing that fact rather than to assign to Him human emotions and personality.

Beyond offering that, I can only say that in examining the one set of data available to me in its entirety - myself - God is gradually being revealed and all I can say is that the bible makes Him out to be much too small.

curdog4570,



The Bible makes God out to be Infinite. How can a God be more than Infinite?

The book of Genesis was not conceived by an infinite mind, but a small, finite, bronze age mind.

That about that for a minute, and about just how twisted your morality has become.

You consider the deliberate murder of every person on the face of the earth, except 8, to be a good and just thing.

In the Bible, how many people did Satan actually kill?

How many did your god kill?

Using religious text to show an idea to an atheist, is like trying to strain spaghetti with a base ball bat. It is the atheists free will to not seek god. It is your free will that allows you to seek god. Bickering about each others free will is a waste of both of your time. If a person is unwilling to seek, that person will never find.

You start with the idea you know all about this subject. You start with the idea the Bible is not Truth but written by a bronze age mind and then conclude it was written by a bronze age mind. And yet you missed the part where the bronze age mind states God starts with nothing and calls everything that is into being; including time, space and matter. That is an Infinite Intelligent Energy Source we call God.

I sought, and there was no evidence.

You are completely wrong about my starting point, and how I studied this subject. But you know that, because we've discussed this before.

You constantly anthropomorphise God. You forget or are willfully ignorant that we are created clay pots and God is the Creator Potter Who can play with His toys in any way He desires without answering to His toys. God constantly teaches, "Do what I say not what I do. My ways are higher than yours."

I do agree with you about Who does the killing and who does the begging of position. There is no record of Satan killing anyone and lots of information about God killing; including His Only Begotten Son. Even the Pass Over was instituted by God when He killed those who did not obey and wipe blood on the door. He said, "When I see the blood I will pass." It makes no sense to me, but at least I realize I am the toy.

Did not God grant his believers free will? If a Christian is shackled to the Bible, it is because they willingly put the shackles on themselves.

Your disappointment is misplaced.

It has not gone unnoticed that you have chosen to cavort in life shackle free.

That's really interesting. First you state that God doesn't exist,while at the same time accusing him of murder. Your position is that the flood never happened,yet God is guilty of killing innocents because of it. If you want to argue your position from a fairy tale,you must at least not edit the fairy tail to fit your position.

You need to remember that the Bible,says that man had become evil to the extreme.Even in that God saved the just,and had the just man preach righteousness for 100 years to the scoffers.