No, they are halting construction to look at alternative routes. Just kicking the can down the road so they can get the people to leave and the new administration to deal with the problem. Trump will handle it with kid glove's....
Music washes away the dust of everyday life Some people wait a lifetime to meet their favorite hunting and shooting buddy. Mine calls me dad
If the Army Corps of Engineers refuses to Grant an easement, at this point in time..... why on Earth was a project like this started Construction without all the appropriate easements and paperwork finished first? Why are they even attempting to get an easement ....now?
An unemployed Jester, is nobody's Fool.
the only real difference between a good tracker and a bad tracker, is observation. all the same data is present for both. The rest, is understanding what you're seeing.
If the Army Corps of Engineers refuses to Grant an easement, at this point in time..... why on Earth was a project like this started Construction without all the appropriate easements and paperwork finished first? Why are they even attempting to get an easement ....now?
All the easements were in place. The AC of E's turned tail - and let mob rule. Trump will get it all sorted out in about 42 days.
My home is the "sanctuary residence" for my firearms.
What's just as crazy is that about 100 US military arrived today by bus to back the protesters. What the hell is that? A Soros Xmas bonus? Arctic air by Tuesday - and local LEO's are backing off the trespassing threat on federal land. Sounds like a huge FUBAR pending..............
Last edited by bigwhoop; 12/04/16.
My home is the "sanctuary residence" for my firearms.
What's just as crazy is that about 100 US military arrived today by bus to back the protesters. What the hell is that? A Soros Xmas bonus? Arctic air by Tuesday - and local LEO's are backing off the trespassing threat on federal land. Sounds like a huge FUBAR pending..............
Say what? Which branch? Active? Sorry, I just got back from a weekend of drill and have been out of the news. I'll tell you a busload of soldiers from any or our units would be in a boatload of trouble if they showed up out there...at least with any affiliation to the Guard.
Liberalism; The impossible yet accepted notion that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.
Just pissin off more of us that live here in ND. They were supposed to get thousands of vets. I'm guessing they got mostly native americans. 20 million dollars pissed away on this crap. ED K
Bunch of veterans been out for awhile some retired etc. Believe it or not we have or share of liberal turds in the service.. I still remember Ntc 2008 we were going into the box the next day, night of the election Obama won some guy out of the artillery bn running around yelling Obama won we aren't going to Afghanistan the war is over blah blah guess what feb 2009 we were on our way to Afghanistan and guess what ol boy was on a plane to Afghanistan as well..
Last edited by 79S; 12/04/16.
Originally Posted by Bricktop
Then STFU. The rest of your statement is superflous bullshit with no real bearing on this discussion other than to massage your own ego.
Trump's going to be really busy that first couple months. Actually this is good; now the Tontos, squaws and deranged veterans will leave and when Mattis has the ACE reverse the decision there will be no one in the way.
I think the gov just wants the protesters to go home before they start freezing to death.
The cold weather is about to get real.
Many of these protesters probably have no appreciation for the cold that is comimg.
I don't know...I kind of like the idea of them freezing to death.
It would be a hoot.
I wouldn't wish it on anyone, but a lot of them don't know about real cold weather. Some likely running cars on near bald tires, weak batteries and weak antifreeze.
A week or so back, the news was that no resupply would be allowed in. Now they are erecting yurts, GP tents, heaters, stockpiling firewood.....supplies ARE still coming in.
My niece and her husband participated for a couple days, and had the sense to go home to WA. I think they just wanted to say they were there.
Some people have dull lives and need a 'cause' at some point to validate their existence.
If the indians really cared about clean water they would let them cross the REZ without extorting millions of dollars. Oh wait its EBT cards and free housing they really care about. ED K
If the indians really cared about clean water they would let them cross the REZ without extorting millions of dollars. Oh wait its EBT cards and free housing they really care about. ED K
The pipeline was never going to cross their land anyway. The Corps of Engineers statement said they would look at "different routes to cross the lake", which will have the same end result as the current route.
One shot, one kill........ It saves a lot of ammo!
A bunch of veterans are backing the protesters, because their rights are beeing violated.
The Indians, has said NO, to the pipeline, and nobody is giving a f.
They ( the veterans ) are protecting them, from the police, and their rights to protest.
None of their rights have been violated. They've had 5 years to fight this and they have lost.
They also have no right to protest where they are now, and they will soon be evicted, by force if necessary. The veterans are dumbasses to get involved unless they all rode horses out there.
If they drove cars they are hypocrites with nothing better to do than make asses of themselves.
The only part you got right is nobody give a "f" anymore.
One shot, one kill........ It saves a lot of ammo!
I wonder who is more concerned about your constitutional rights, those that have risked their lives to uphold the constitution.. or some arm chair blow hards.
The US in the last 40 years:
Socialism for big corporations and military industrial complex
BE STRONG IN THE LORD, AND IN HIS MIGHTY POWER. ~ Ephesians 6:10
Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. --Winston Churchill
I wonder who is more concerned about your constitutional rights, those that have risked their lives to uphold the constitution.. or some arm chair blow hards.
the only real difference between a good tracker and a bad tracker, is observation. all the same data is present for both. The rest, is understanding what you're seeing.
then perhaps you could Supply the correct one? I Google it by name to see for myself where it goes. the article seems pretty factual. I would like to see the lay of the land myself.
An unemployed Jester, is nobody's Fool.
the only real difference between a good tracker and a bad tracker, is observation. all the same data is present for both. The rest, is understanding what you're seeing.
The last time that I was down that way, they had a new bridge with a pipeline crossing attached, under construction, on I-30 across the Red River At Fulton, Arkansas. Might be finished by now. miles
I don't know who is right and who is wrong on this. Big Oil certainly has enough money to buy all the propaganda they want. So does Soros, et al commies. The government will serve whoever pays the most. Lots of those Injuns are no more native than Pocahontas. There are a lot of Native American Al Sharpton types too. I tend to think that the Injuns are just holding out for more dough. OTOH the big boys will run their eminent domain crap right over you.
No, they are halting construction to look at alternative routes. Just kicking the can down the road so they can get the people to leave and the new administration to deal with the problem. Trump will handle it with kid glove's....
The pipeline has already been laid all across Iowa and is in the ground waiting roughly from the NW to SC or SE; I would think that minimizes looking at many other alternate routes.
Again, nothing in this country gets done due to politics, special interests, incompetence and dithering.
President Obama, breaking his silence on the controversial Dakota Access Pipeline, said Tuesday that the federal government is looking for ways to "reroute" parts of the $3.8 billion project to address concerns raised by Native American tribes in North Dakota.
“My view is that there is a way for us to accommodate sacred lands of Native Americans,” Obama told online news site “NowThis.” “I think that right now the Army Corps is examining whether there are ways to reroute this pipeline.”
The president weighed in following high-profile clashes last week between protesters and law enforcement.
Obama said government agencies will let the situation “play out for several more weeks and determine whether or not this can be resolved in a way that I think is properly attentive to the traditions of the First Americans.”
I would like to see the tribes charged for the cleanup and restoration of the federal land they were illegally trespassing on. Oh, and for all the extra law enforcement that has been needed down in that area for the last 4+ months.
The Corps is simply "flipping the bird" to America, courtesy of Zero's bidding. They won't be re-routing anything, since the permitting process was already granted over a year ago.
They will "look at" ways to re-route, Zero/Soros can keep fomenting riots, it will get too cold for anyone to be out there on Groundhog Day, and Trump will tell the Corps to get busy and let the pipeline through.
This is simply Zero and his cronies messing with everyone. He has no consideration for his own sorry legacy.
They did not get thousands of vets to help protest. A few hundred and most claimed to be partial Native American. They are not there to protect the free speech of protestors. Thats what the police are for. Burning cars and tires and wood on a state highway is not covered under free speech. Blocking traffic is not covered under free speech. ED K
Trump's most recent federal disclosure forms, filed in May, show he owned between $15,000 and $50,000 in stock in Texas-based Energy Transfer Partners. That's down from between $500,000 and $1 million a year earlier.
Trump also owns between $100,000 and $250,000 in Phillips 66, which has a one-quarter share of Dakota Access.
While Trump's stake in the pipeline company is modest compared with his other assets, ethics experts say it's among dozens of potential conflicts that could be resolved by placing his investments in a blind trust, a step Trump has resisted.
"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence". John Adams
"A dishonest man can always be trusted to be dishonest". Captain Jack Sparrow
I would like to see the tribes charged for the cleanup and restoration of the federal land they were illegally trespassing on. Oh, and for all the extra law enforcement that has been needed down in that area for the last 4+ months.
^^^^ This ^^^^ ... And I have no issue with cutting off their supply chain. When they cold enough and hungry enough, they will leave on their own.
I don't know. That is why i wanted a map, showing the indian lands by treaty, those allowed as traditional hunting lands (things we are bound to by the written word), and the intersection of the pipeline, as well as the Aquaphor. From what i have read (above) it looks like a careful job by pros, but quite a few Aquaphors are in trouble, and drying up. There ARE issues with fracking for oil in one place, and the water HAS shown contamination nearby where it should have been safe. Even the EPA recently screwed the pooch when they flushed out a mine by mistake. Made a great big stain going down river, (and if anyone else had done it, it would have meant prison). I'd like to see how these things coincide.
An unemployed Jester, is nobody's Fool.
the only real difference between a good tracker and a bad tracker, is observation. all the same data is present for both. The rest, is understanding what you're seeing.
Federal Gov blocks oil pipe line. Title of article on Breitbart web site. Veterans Stand for Standing Rock’s GoFundMe.com page had raised more than $1 million of its $1.2 million goal by Sunday — With what soros has given, to the protestors, they should make out pretty good.
The Mayans had it right. If you�re going to predict the future, it�s best to aim far beyond your life expectancy, lest you wind up red-faced in a bunker overstocked with Spam and ammo.
Just a shot over the bow of those greedy types that thought they were going to hold out for a $billion per acre. Happens every time. They'll end up broker than before and surrounded by people they don't like.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
Just a shot over the bow of those greedy types that thought they were going to hold out for a $billion per acre. Happens every time. They'll end up broker than before and surrounded by people they don't like.
Sure seen that happen down here.
They thought there was NO WAY we'd reroute a pipeline, and would rather pay their ransom.
They were surprised, and their neighbors were very happy!
US Army denies Dakota Access crude oil pipeline’s Lake Oahe easement
WASHINGTON, DC, Dec. 5 12/05/2016 By Nick Snow OGJ Washington Editor
The US Department of the Army will not approve an easement that would allow the proposed Dakota Access crude oil pipeline to cross under Lake Oahe in North Dakota, Army Asst. Sec. for Civil Works Jo-Ellen Darcy announced on Dec. 4. American Petroleum Institute Pres. Jack N. Gerard immediately called on President-elect Donald J. Trump to approve the project when he takes office in January. Darcy said she based her decision on a need to explore alternate routes for the 1,172-mile project’s crossing beneath the reservoir, which is managed by the Army Corps of Engineers, in North Dakota. Her office previously announced that it would delay the easement decision to allow for discussions with the Standing Rock Sioux Tribe, whose reservation lies ½ mile south of the proposed crossing (OGJ Online, Nov. 15, 2016).
Tribal officials have expressed repeated concerns over the risk that a pipeline rupture or spill could damage its water supply and treaty rights, Darcy said. Energy Transfer Partners, the project’s sponsor, sued in federal court to complete the project on Nov. 15 (OGJ Online, Nov. 16, 2016). “Although we have had continuing discussion and exchanges of new information with the Standing Rock Sioux and Dakota Access, it’s clear that there’s more work to do,” Darcy said. “The best way to complete that work responsibly and expeditiously is to explore alternate routes for the pipeline crossing.” Consideration of alternatives would best be accomplished through an Environmental Impact Statement with full public input and analysis, she said. Gerard said, “I am troubled, though not surprised, that the Obama administration is again putting politics over sound public policy and ignoring the rule of law. The Dakota Access pipeline went through an open, transparent, and established permitting process that was upheld twice by the courts, making this decision even more baffling. In just over one month, a new president and new administration can stand up for American consumers and American workers by approving this critical project. Following the rule of law in the regulatory process is critical for this and other infrastructure projects including roads, bridges, and electricity transmission lines.”
‘Played by the rules’
The project’s sponsors—Energy Transfer Partners in Dallas and Sunoco Logistics Partners in Newtown Square, Pa.—said in a jointly issued statement Dec. 4 that the decision was purely political.
“For more than 3 years now, Dakota Access Pipeline has done nothing but play by the rules,” they said. “[ACE] agrees, and has said so publicly and in federal court filings. [Its] review process and its decisions have been ratified by two federal courts. [It] confirmed this again today when it stated its ‘policy decision’ does ‘not alter the Army’s position that the Corps’ prior reviews and actions have comported with legal requirements.’” EDP and SLP said that despite consistently stating that the permit for crossing the Missouri River at Lake Oahe, which was granted in July, comported with all legal requirements, including the use of an environmental assessment rather than an environmental impact statement, ACE now seeks to engage in additional review and analysis of alternative locations for the pipeline.
“The White House’s directive today to the Corps for further delay is just the latest in a series of overt and transparent political actions by an administration which has abandoned the rule of law in favor of currying favor with a narrow and extreme political constituency,” the sponsors said.
US Sen. Heidi Heitkamp (D-ND) also condemned the move. “This administration’s delay in taking action—after I’ve pushed the White House, Army Corps, and other federal agencies for months to make a decision—means that today’s move doesn’t actually bring finality to the project. The pipeline still remains in limbo,” she said on Dec. 4.
Heitkamp said the incoming administration already has stated its support for the project, and the courts have already stated twice that it appeared the Corps followed the required process in considering the permit. “For the next month and a half, nothing about this project will change,” she stated.
“For the immediate future, the safety of residents, protesters, law enforcement, and workers remains my top priority as it should for everyone involved,” Heitkamp said. “As some of the protesters have become increasingly violent and unlawful, and as North Dakota’s winter has already arrived—with a blizzard raging last week through the area where protesters are located—I’m hoping now that protesters will act responsibly to avoid endangering their health and safety, and move off of the Corps land north of the Cannonball River.”
Most people don't understand that they don't just weld a few pipes together and throw them across the rivers...
In actuality, huge horizontal drills are brought in, and they bore a hole deep under the riverbed.
Pipelines don't really cross rivers any longer. They go far underneath them. Then the entire pipeline is hydro-tested and passes inspection before any hydrocarbons ever go online.
Got any numbers on how much leakes each year from the pipelines. Its not a small number.
I'm sure there aren't any data bases kept on the subject.
But with modern pipeline monitoring systems in use, leaks are shut down almost instantly, repair crews are sent in with environmental cleanup crews, and usually the damage is kept to a minimum.
Sorry guys, misspelled This site is so slow, I've resorted to voice texting. And i can see words spelled slowly, letter by letter, across the screen. It took so long to finish, i didn't double check it.
An unemployed Jester, is nobody's Fool.
the only real difference between a good tracker and a bad tracker, is observation. all the same data is present for both. The rest, is understanding what you're seeing.
Oh, did you figure out which pipeline we were discussing?
What's an Aquapfor?
Aquaphor® Healing Ointment for Dry Cracked Skin Link: https://www.aquaphorus.com/ Aquaphor Healing Ointment is the #1 dermatologist recommended ointment for dry, cracked skin, uniquely formulated to soothe a variety of skin woes. Products · Body Care · Money Back Guarantee · How Does Aquaphor® Work
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
It would be interesting to see a comparison between the pipeline protesters and the Oregon ones. As well as a comparison between what the Feds have done in both cases. I suspect there are some differences.
When you google up, the Keystone XL Pipeline you see different stories about really how much good it does for the US??
That pipeline is highly symbolic....just a drop in the barrel (no pun intended). There are people at the 'Fire(on this thread as a matter of fact) that know pretty much everything there is to know about it. I won't rat 'em out, because when somebody tries to give real facts around here, the nuts come out like roaches.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
When you google up, the Keystone XL Pipeline you see different stories about really how much good it does for the US??
That pipeline is highly symbolic....just a drop in the barrel (no pun intended). There are people at the 'Fire(on this thread as a matter of fact) that know pretty much everything there is to know about it. I won't rat 'em out, because when somebody tries to give real facts around here, the nuts come out like roaches.
this country runs on oil. both sides of the issue know that.
I think you might be making an "assumption, large" in this regard. I have bantered in a few places about this issue, and most people don't seem to have a clue that the roads they drive on, the vehicles they drive, the fuel that moves them all come from fossil sources; that the homes they live in are coated, vapor-sealed, sided, decorated, floored, wired, plumbed, and roofed with fossil-sourced materials. They don't consider the fact that their food is grown and delivered via fossil fuels, that even medicine and accompanying facilities and accoutrements are fossil dependent.
Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
When you google up, the Keystone XL Pipeline you see different stories about really how much good it does for the US??
That pipeline is highly symbolic....just a drop in the barrel (no pun intended). There are people at the 'Fire(on this thread as a matter of fact) that know pretty much everything there is to know about it. I won't rat 'em out, because when somebody tries to give real facts around here, the nuts come out like roaches.
ROACH!
Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
this country runs on oil. both sides of the issue know that.
I think you might be making an "assumption, large" in this regard. I have bantered in a few places about this issue, and most people don't seem to have a clue that the roads they drive on, the vehicles they drive, the fuel that moves them all come from fossil sources; that the homes they live in are coated, vapor-sealed, sided, decorated, floored, wired, plumbed, and roofed with fossil-sourced materials. They don't consider the fact that their food is grown and delivered via fossil fuels, that even medicine and accompanying facilities and accoutrements are fossil dependent.
I wonder how much college level chemistry ø has taken. ø.
Got any numbers on how much leakes each year from the pipelines. Its not a small number.
Seeing that you are to lazy to do your own research I thought I would do it for you. It only took me about a hour to find these FACTS, PHMSA - the Pipeline & Hazardous Materials Safety Administration - Office of Pipeline Safety ... data shows in 2015 there were 16.2 billion barrels - nearly 2/3rds trillion gallons - transported thru more than 200,000 miles of pipelines - 72,000 miles transporting crude oil, in the US.
There were 454 total incident involving spills or leaks. Of those 71% occurred ON the oil companies site, were captured by the onsite safety systems and posed no risk to the public.
That leaves a total of just 130 incidents that posed a potential risk to the public. 130 incidents over 16.2 billion barrels shipped. 130 incident over 200,000+ miles of pipeline. So let's go further and look at the DETAILS OF THOSE 130 incidents ... First, there were a total of 20,021 barrels spilled ...an avg overall of 154 barrels per spill. But let's look even closer .... 83% of those spills - 108 - were less than 50 barrels But lets look even closer ... 44%, or 57 of 130, were less than 1 barrel - a max total spill of 57 barrels 21%, or 27 of 130, were 1 to 5 barrels - a max total spill of 135 barrels 18%, or 24 of 130, were 5 to 50 barrels - a max total spill of 1,200 barrels Add that up - 83%, 108 out of 130 spills totaled 1,392 barrels spilled - an avg of 12 barrels per spill 12%, or 16 spills out of 130 total, were 50 to 500 barrels - a max total spill of 8,000 barrels Add that to the smaller spills and we get 95%, 124 out of 130 spills - which totaled 9,392 barrels spilled - in 95% - 124 out of 130 spills - the total spilled was an avg of 76 barrels per spill or less ... That leaves 5%, or 6 spills out of 130 total, that were more than 500 barrels - a total of 10,629 barrels - an avg of 1,771 barrels per spill
THAT is the TRUTH ... and the data.
Music washes away the dust of everyday life Some people wait a lifetime to meet their favorite hunting and shooting buddy. Mine calls me dad
Got any numbers on how much leakes each year from the pipelines. Its not a small number.
Seeing that you are to lazy to do your own research I thought I would do it for you. It only took me about a hour to find these FACTS, PHMSA - the Pipeline & Hazardous Materials Safety Administration - Office of Pipeline Safety ... data shows in 2015 there were 16.2 billion barrels - nearly 2/3rds trillion gallons - transported thru more than 200,000 miles of pipelines - 72,000 miles transporting crude oil, in the US.
There were 454 total incident involving spills or leaks. Of those 71% occurred ON the oil companies site, were captured by the onsite safety systems and posed no risk to the public.
That leaves a total of just 130 incidents that posed a potential risk to the public. 130 incidents over 16.2 billion barrels shipped. 130 incident over 200,000+ miles of pipeline. So let's go further and look at the DETAILS OF THOSE 130 incidents ... First, there were a total of 20,021 barrels spilled ...an avg overall of 154 barrels per spill. But let's look even closer .... 83% of those spills - 108 - were less than 50 barrels But lets look even closer ... 44%, or 57 of 130, were less than 1 barrel - a max total spill of 57 barrels 21%, or 27 of 130, were 1 to 5 barrels - a max total spill of 135 barrels 18%, or 24 of 130, were 5 to 50 barrels - a max total spill of 1,200 barrels Add that up - 83%, 108 out of 130 spills totaled 1,392 barrels spilled - an avg of 12 barrels per spill 12%, or 16 spills out of 130 total, were 50 to 500 barrels - a max total spill of 8,000 barrels Add that to the smaller spills and we get 95%, 124 out of 130 spills - which totaled 9,392 barrels spilled - in 95% - 124 out of 130 spills - the total spilled was an avg of 76 barrels per spill or less ... That leaves 5%, or 6 spills out of 130 total, that were more than 500 barrels - a total of 10,629 barrels - an avg of 1,771 barrels per spill
THAT is the TRUTH ... and the data.
It would be nice if you'd post the links to the sources of that.
One shot, one kill........ It saves a lot of ammo!
Got any numbers on how much leakes each year from the pipelines. Its not a small number.
Seeing that you are to lazy to do your own research I thought I would do it for you. It only took me about a hour to find these FACTS, PHMSA - the Pipeline & Hazardous Materials Safety Administration - Office of Pipeline Safety ... data shows in 2015 there were 16.2 billion barrels - nearly 2/3rds trillion gallons - transported thru more than 200,000 miles of pipelines - 72,000 miles transporting crude oil, in the US.
There were 454 total incident involving spills or leaks. Of those 71% occurred ON the oil companies site, were captured by the onsite safety systems and posed no risk to the public.
That leaves a total of just 130 incidents that posed a potential risk to the public. 130 incidents over 16.2 billion barrels shipped. 130 incident over 200,000+ miles of pipeline. So let's go further and look at the DETAILS OF THOSE 130 incidents ... First, there were a total of 20,021 barrels spilled ...an avg overall of 154 barrels per spill. But let's look even closer .... 83% of those spills - 108 - were less than 50 barrels But lets look even closer ... 44%, or 57 of 130, were less than 1 barrel - a max total spill of 57 barrels 21%, or 27 of 130, were 1 to 5 barrels - a max total spill of 135 barrels 18%, or 24 of 130, were 5 to 50 barrels - a max total spill of 1,200 barrels Add that up - 83%, 108 out of 130 spills totaled 1,392 barrels spilled - an avg of 12 barrels per spill 12%, or 16 spills out of 130 total, were 50 to 500 barrels - a max total spill of 8,000 barrels Add that to the smaller spills and we get 95%, 124 out of 130 spills - which totaled 9,392 barrels spilled - in 95% - 124 out of 130 spills - the total spilled was an avg of 76 barrels per spill or less ... That leaves 5%, or 6 spills out of 130 total, that were more than 500 barrels - a total of 10,629 barrels - an avg of 1,771 barrels per spill
THAT is the TRUTH ... and the data.
It would be nice if you'd post the links to the sources of that.
Did you read it? PHMSA - the Pipeline & Hazardous Materials Safety Administration - Office of Pipeline Safety Look it up I broke their numbers down so it would be easier to understand.
Music washes away the dust of everyday life Some people wait a lifetime to meet their favorite hunting and shooting buddy. Mine calls me dad
The place my dad used to change the oil in his tractor must be a superfund clean-up site these days. ;-}>
I didn't know what the numbers were before looking it up. After crunching the numbers I was surprised too. I bet we dumped a couple hundred barrels worth on the driveway on the farm growing up.
Music washes away the dust of everyday life Some people wait a lifetime to meet their favorite hunting and shooting buddy. Mine calls me dad
Where I went to high school in Tempe, AZ many moons ago they used to mix motor oil and diesel and spray it around the playing fields to kill weeds and grass.
Here is a little history lesson about the Sioux. The Standing Rock Nation is a creation of the Federal Government/Congress. We recognize their sovereignty simply because we do. They were never a land-based-and-bordered nation in their entire history. That is a "white guy" concept. More specifically, the actual ancestral homeland of the Lakota and Dakota is hundreds of miles to the east in Minnesota, not North or South Dakota.
The "Sioux" were driven west by the Anishinabe/AKA Ojibwe/Chippewa in the mid-late 1700's. They arrived with only dogs for pack animals, and were a woodland hunter-gatherer culture. The voyageurs were exploring the Missouri about the same time the “Sioux” were finding their way into the territory. “White Men” have been in those lands roughly as long as those claiming to be the Standing Rock Nation. By those standards “White Eyes” is as “Native” to the Dakotas as the Lakota and Dakota.
Encounters with the Cheyenne (warring and stealing their way into horsemanship) provided the “Sioux” with horses and they absorbed the Cheyenne lifestyle of plains nomads, perpetually following the bison for food and supplies. The Cheyenne and and Lakota in particular became heated enemies and killed each other with atrocious abandon, and both set upon the actual natives of North Dakota, the Mandan, Hidatsa, Arikara, and other smaller tribes, drove them north to where they now live as a combined tribe, because they began to build villages close together and unite in self-protection from the Lakota who now have their ancestral lands in Standing Rock. As luck would have it, the MHA Nation as they now call themselves, based in the Fort Berthold reservation, right over the fat spot in the Bakken oil reserves, run their own wells, pump and transport, and own their proprietary production company, are halfway done with a refinery, and produce over 11% of the entire production of oil from the Bakken field.
Eventually, the Lakota became the most fierce and therefore greatest of the plains tribes and drove the once-superior Cheyenne west and the formerly magnificent Kiowa south. The so-called "Sioux" lands preserved by either the treaty of 1851, or the treaty of 1868, or the Congressional actions of 1875 that extended the reservation back up to the Cannonball River were all simply cases of the US validating the “Sioux” claims to stolen lands, from tribes conquered by brutal force by the Lakota and Dakota. The Standing Rock Nation took their so-called “sovereign” or “ancestral” lands from it's rightful "owners," the Mandan, Hidatsa, Arikara, Kiowa, Cheyenne, and others. And they did it by criminally degenerate force, rape, pillage and torture.
When the "white man" was making those treaties with the “Sioux” in 1851, declaring the whole region the “Great Sioux Reservation,” the Lakota and Dakota had only been on that land a few generations—perhaps a hundred years or so. The Arikara they drove off had been there since AD 1500, followed by the Cheyenne, Crow, Kiowa and Pawnee—all centuries before the “Sioux.” The Arikara claim to that land simply put, preceeds the treaty of 1851 by 300 years. So, you tell me: how is it I should feel sorry for the Standing Rock “Sioux” because of a pipeline they really have nothing to do with and isn't going to hurt them anyway?
How far back do you want to go in this quest for "sovereignty?"
Plus, none of those treaties give the Standing Rock Nation any rights other than to be consulted. And keep in mind, this "tribe" was only chartered in 1959 as a united "tribe."I mean, literally, the whole tribe and reservation itself is just over a hundred years old, and legally speaking, the tribe itself was only federally incorporated as such, one "sovereign nation" under a constitution written in 1959. Frankly, I'm older than this tribe is, again, legally speaking.
Music washes away the dust of everyday life Some people wait a lifetime to meet their favorite hunting and shooting buddy. Mine calls me dad
Got any numbers on how much leakes each year from the pipelines. Its not a small number.
Seeing that you are to lazy to do your own research I thought I would do it for you. It only took me about a hour to find these FACTS,
It would be nice if you'd post the links to the sources of that.
Did you read it?
PHMSA - the Pipeline & Hazardous Materials Safety Administration - Office of Pipeline Safety
Look it up I broke their numbers down so it would be easier to understand.
Yes, I read it, and I can go to their site and sift through pages and pages of things hoping to find what you posted OR you could simply include a link that goes directly to the page where you found it since you were already there.
It's just one more copy and paste that saves others lots of searching.
One shot, one kill........ It saves a lot of ammo!
Thank you for the info. As for treaties, if I gave you my word yesterday, it would still be binding today. Age has no relevance to honoring your word. If my memory is correct, we have broken more treaties with the Indians than we have honered. If it is to our advantage, we take it. It was true when silver was discovered, it was true when gold was found. We signed treaty that no white men would go in these places, and we didn't enforce it, traders, trappers, miners, (and anyone else with enough guns) took up residence in Indian domain. So, I'm wondering where the path of honor lies with this. (I will finish the provided info, as i have time). Thank you for your insights.
An unemployed Jester, is nobody's Fool.
the only real difference between a good tracker and a bad tracker, is observation. all the same data is present for both. The rest, is understanding what you're seeing.
Would it not be great if we could live in a risk free world. Well we don't so we will have to do the best we can. That includes moving oil. We all know we need it but some think others should take all the risk. The refinerys are not always close to the supply. Pipe lines are the best way to move crude and finished products. Hasbeen
hasbeen (Better a has been than a never was!)
NRA Patron member Try to live your life where the preacher doesn't have to lie at your funeral
The link I will post shows there are 2.3 million miles of pipeline moving a variety of liquid and gaseous forms of fossil fuels. Take the link to other data if you wish.
The DAPL is the merger of three flash points: disdain for "big oil", concern for "climate change" and there treatment of the "First Nation". It is ironic when viewing the photos from the protest site to see: portable generators, cook stoves, heaters and gas/diesel burning vehicles. It is also telling to see the protestors routinely burn vehicle tires for whatever reason.
Ultimately the decision will be made to provide for the "public good" in the least intrusive and impactful manner.
That's why the Keystone pipeline is largely symbolic. The answer is obvious if one just looks at that map. Open up all those offshore pipelines in the Gulf and allow drilling in other offshore locations and the problem is solved. No need to pipe crude 2000 miles from a foreign country to facilities capable of processing it.
The problem is obvious too. Obama's administration and liberals don't want oil. Period. They live in an alternate reality where they dream of the day that unicorn turds will power the world.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
Well its not cold here yet but it is storming pretty good. 30 to 40 mph winds and snow. Its still 15 above so anybody still there is lucky. I have a friend who wrote a son in about 1980. 40 below keeps the riff raff out. ED K
Here is a little history lesson about the Sioux. The Standing Rock Nation is a creation of the Federal Government/Congress. We recognize their sovereignty simply because we do. They were never a land-based-and-bordered nation in their entire history. That is a "white guy" concept. More specifically, the actual ancestral homeland of the Lakota and Dakota is hundreds of miles to the east in Minnesota, not North or South Dakota.
The "Sioux" were driven west by the Anishinabe/AKA Ojibwe/Chippewa in the mid-late 1700's. They arrived with only dogs for pack animals, and were a woodland hunter-gatherer culture. The voyageurs were exploring the Missouri about the same time the “Sioux” were finding their way into the territory. “White Men” have been in those lands roughly as long as those claiming to be the Standing Rock Nation. By those standards “White Eyes” is as “Native” to the Dakotas as the Lakota and Dakota.
Encounters with the Cheyenne (warring and stealing their way into horsemanship) provided the “Sioux” with horses and they absorbed the Cheyenne lifestyle of plains nomads, perpetually following the bison for food and supplies. The Cheyenne and and Lakota in particular became heated enemies and killed each other with atrocious abandon, and both set upon the actual natives of North Dakota, the Mandan, Hidatsa, Arikara, and other smaller tribes, drove them north to where they now live as a combined tribe, because they began to build villages close together and unite in self-protection from the Lakota who now have their ancestral lands in Standing Rock. As luck would have it, the MHA Nation as they now call themselves, based in the Fort Berthold reservation, right over the fat spot in the Bakken oil reserves, run their own wells, pump and transport, and own their proprietary production company, are halfway done with a refinery, and produce over 11% of the entire production of oil from the Bakken field.
Eventually, the Lakota became the most fierce and therefore greatest of the plains tribes and drove the once-superior Cheyenne west and the formerly magnificent Kiowa south. The so-called "Sioux" lands preserved by either the treaty of 1851, or the treaty of 1868, or the Congressional actions of 1875 that extended the reservation back up to the Cannonball River were all simply cases of the US validating the “Sioux” claims to stolen lands, from tribes conquered by brutal force by the Lakota and Dakota. The Standing Rock Nation took their so-called “sovereign” or “ancestral” lands from it's rightful "owners," the Mandan, Hidatsa, Arikara, Kiowa, Cheyenne, and others. And they did it by criminally degenerate force, rape, pillage and torture.
When the "white man" was making those treaties with the “Sioux” in 1851, declaring the whole region the “Great Sioux Reservation,” the Lakota and Dakota had only been on that land a few generations—perhaps a hundred years or so. The Arikara they drove off had been there since AD 1500, followed by the Cheyenne, Crow, Kiowa and Pawnee—all centuries before the “Sioux.” The Arikara claim to that land simply put, preceeds the treaty of 1851 by 300 years. So, you tell me: how is it I should feel sorry for the Standing Rock “Sioux” because of a pipeline they really have nothing to do with and isn't going to hurt them anyway?
How far back do you want to go in this quest for "sovereignty?"
Plus, none of those treaties give the Standing Rock Nation any rights other than to be consulted. And keep in mind, this "tribe" was only chartered in 1959 as a united "tribe."I mean, literally, the whole tribe and reservation itself is just over a hundred years old, and legally speaking, the tribe itself was only federally incorporated as such, one "sovereign nation" under a constitution written in 1959. Frankly, I'm older than this tribe is, again, legally speaking.
Truth. May I add that the, sacred to the Sioux, Black Hills were taken by brutal force from the Arikara since white men started recording history there. People are people. There are Indian folks in the Black Hills who are trying, actively, to erase this history.
the bottom line is that it's an issue of land ownership. once that hurdle is past, the rest is just installing the pipeline.
this country runs on oil. both sides of the issue know that.
BINGO.
The end game by the tribe and by extension the other tribes is the issues of tribal sovereignty and recognition of valid treaties. This will be a court case that will go on for years, and has the potential to have far reaching impact in multiple states amd cost billions of dollars.
There are multiple cases where on treaty was signed with a tribe, then a few years later when the government unilaterally changed the conditions, or took away land. Maybe in 1880 the tribe couldn't do anything about it. But in a society of rules and laws in 2016 the tribes can contest these things and possibly address past grievances in the court system. A right leaning supreme court is an advantage, in most of these situations.
The racist remarks are interesting, hopefully they are kept to these boards.
Grandpa fought Fascists in WWII, Dad fought Communists in Vietnam. - American is meant for the middle.
the bottom line is that it's an issue of land ownership. once that hurdle is past, the rest is just installing the pipeline.
this country runs on oil. both sides of the issue know that.
BINGO.
The end game by the tribe and by extension the other tribes is the issues of tribal sovereignty and recognition of valid treaties. This will be a court case that will go on for years, and has the potential to have far reaching impact in multiple states amd cost billions of dollars.
There are multiple cases where on treaty was signed with a tribe, then a few years later when the government unilaterally changed the conditions, or took away land. Maybe in 1880 the tribe couldn't do anything about it. But in a society of rules and laws in 2016 the tribes can contest these things and possibly address past grievances in the court system. A right leaning supreme court is an advantage, in most of these situations.
The racist remarks are interesting, hopefully they are kept to these boards.
Just great, another poster that should have been swallowed.
Just saw on the news where the( scum sucking cops) have to go tent to tent and try and get these dumn asses to safety. Funny how all these asses hate the cops but its who they call when the schit hits the fan. Hoping for safety for the police. ED K
Just saw on the news where the( scum sucking cops) have to go tent to tent and try and get these dumn asses to safety. Funny how all these asses hate the cops but its who they call when the schit hits the fan. Hoping for safety for the police. ED K
They better be careful that they don't get shot at again.
Just for the purposes of comparison, The Exxon Valdez only spilled about 257,000 gallons (approximately the volume of 7 Olympic sized swimming pools.) Not the largest spill, by a long shot, but the location of the spill is what caused the majority of the resulting problems. Afterwards, no one would let them dock, so it was renamed, and docked with no problem. After changing ownership and names several times, it was finally broken up for scrap in India. (Iirc)
An unemployed Jester, is nobody's Fool.
the only real difference between a good tracker and a bad tracker, is observation. all the same data is present for both. The rest, is understanding what you're seeing.
Just for the purposes of comparison, The Exxon Valdez only spilled about 257,000 gallons (approximately the volume of 7 Olympic sized swimming pools.) Not the largest spill, by a long shot, but the location of the spill is what caused the majority of the resulting problems. Afterwards, no one would let them dock, so it was renamed, and docked with no problem. After changing ownership and names several times, it was finally broken up for scrap in India. (Iirc)
Exxon Valdez was commonly estimated as having spilled 11 million gallons. 251,712 barrels comes out to be 10,571,904 gallons. Some estimates were much higher.
Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
Just for the purposes of comparison, The Exxon Valdez only spilled about 257,000 gallons (approximately the volume of 7 Olympic sized swimming pools.) Not the largest spill, by a long shot, but the location of the spill is what caused the majority of the resulting problems. Afterwards, no one would let them dock, so it was renamed, and docked with no problem. After changing ownership and names several times, it was finally broken up for scrap in India. (Iirc)
Exxon Valdez was commonly estimated as having spilled 11 million gallons. 251,712 barrels comes out to be 10,571,904 gallons. Some estimates were much higher.
you caught one of my typos. ( since it takes so long to post one of these, I sometimes forget to check for errors) that should have read BARRELS not gallons, and 17 swimmingpools, not 7. (Sorry about that)
An unemployed Jester, is nobody's Fool.
the only real difference between a good tracker and a bad tracker, is observation. all the same data is present for both. The rest, is understanding what you're seeing.
![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/ZCL8Ws2r/JohnGult.jpg)
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