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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 7,578
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 7,578 |
If I was going to do anything other than the .270, I would jump up to the 30-06. It is very tractable with reduced loads--you can take it all the way down to 30-30 equivalents, if you want. It can give you any performance characteristics you want, from .270 to 7-08 to 7x57 to .308 to 30-06 all through your choice of bullet and velocity.
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,944
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,944 |
C Roy, confidence is a powerful thing. Keep what you have in the .270, if she has confidence in her ability w/ it.
If you must do something different, and I take it from your notes here that you want something else, definitely make it the 7x57. The gods will smile, stars align, and luck will be upon her.
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 409
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 409 |
+1 with Dober...the 270 will handle anything in North America with the exception of the big bears...
"To pick a rifle and bullet for use on game by muzzle energy alone is, at best, foolish...and can be dangerous to your own health..." Bill Steigers, April 23, 1980
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,041
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,041 |
C Roy: If you need a little more convincing that the 270 is all she will ever need for elk or African plains game, read this from Ross Seyfried: "The most successful African Safari I ever guided was shot with a .270 Winchester loaded with 150 grain Nosler Partition bullets. The rifle was ancient and worn, a pre-war Model 70. The �driver� was past 70 years old and this was his only rifle; a rifle that he has used for many decades in most of the hunting grounds of the world. He shot two extremely tough animals, a zebra and a wildebeest, first. Each fell to a single shot, as did a huge lion. He broke a sitatunga�s neck (that was the only target) offhand, in the wind, at 300 yards. An elk-sized kudu bull tumbled when the bullet hit the point of his shoulders. There was no real magic; just a great rifle, fine bullet and unimaginable skill on the part of the rifleman." "Over the last dozen years my son and I have guided for more than 100 elk here at Elk Song. They have been taken with a remarkable spectrum of rifles ranging from 4-bore to 6.5 mm, with a good selection of .577s, .416s, .375s, 338s and .300s in the middle. Many of them have been taken with .270s and I can tell you that no cartridge puts an elk on the ground more quickly than the .270 Winchester loaded with the magnificent (and now non-existent) 140 grain Winchester Failsafe bullet. (Some of the Barnes X designs are producing similar results.) The reason for the grand success is twofold, and returns us to the beginning: first the hunters hit very precisely with the gentle rifle and second, the bullet performance is off the scale." You can see the entire article at www.gunsamerica.com/blog/ross-seyfried-busting-the-magnum-myth/
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing -- Edmund Burke
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 23,660 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 23,660 Likes: 1 |
7-08 with 120 gr TSX or if you're (she's) more comfortable with a heavier bullet, then the 140 Partition.
No recoil, lots of good packages, the Rem 700 Mountain LSS being at the top of the currently available list.
MM
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 28,277
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 28,277 |
This is just me..but if I had a Roberts I was liking I'd use a 115 Nozler in it b4 I bought a 7/08 and ran a 120 in it, Course me being kind of odd I see having the .270 in the same manner. Point being, if I had one already I wouldn't be for buying a 7/08 and running a 140 in it..grin
Guess I'm just trying to say they already have a Roberts and a .270 so why purchase a 7/08?
Just my way I guess.
Dober
"True respect starts with the way you treat others, and it is earned over a lifetime of demonstrating kindness, honor and dignity"....Tony Dungy
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Joined: Oct 2000
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,294 Likes: 2 |
This is just me..but if I had a Roberts I was liking I'd use a 115 Nozler in it b4 I bought a 7/08 and ran a 120 in it, Course me being kind of odd I see having the .270 in the same manner. Point being, if I had one already I wouldn't be for buying a 7/08 and running a 140 in it..grin
Guess I'm just trying to say they already have a Roberts and a .270 so why purchase a 7/08?
Just my way I guess.
Dober Agree 100%... if you have a 257 Rob, the 115 Partition is potent. If you want more... Get a 270... uses the same powders as the 257 but with a heavier payload.
“Perfection is Achieved Not When There Is Nothing More to Add, But When There Is Nothing Left to Take Away” Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 28,277
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 28,277 |
You're gonna get me to build that dang Roberts yet aint ya.. Thinking it'd be about perfect for old Longball (can u belive he'll be 12 this Aug)for this fall eh?? Dober
Last edited by Mark R Dobrenski; 12/29/10.
"True respect starts with the way you treat others, and it is earned over a lifetime of demonstrating kindness, honor and dignity"....Tony Dungy
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
I'd sell them both, buy a 7mm08, which will easily do what either of the aforementioned cartridges can do and take the extra loot left over and spend it on hunting.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
C Roy: If you need a little more convincing that the 270 is all she will ever need for elk or African plains game, read this from Ross Seyfried: "The most successful African Safari I ever guided was shot with a .270 Winchester loaded with 150 grain Nosler Partition bullets. The rifle was ancient and worn, a pre-war Model 70. The �driver� was past 70 years old and this was his only rifle; a rifle that he has used for many decades in most of the hunting grounds of the world. He shot two extremely tough animals, a zebra and a wildebeest, first. Each fell to a single shot, as did a huge lion. He broke a sitatunga�s neck (that was the only target) offhand, in the wind, at 300 yards. An elk-sized kudu bull tumbled when the bullet hit the point of his shoulders. There was no real magic; just a great rifle, fine bullet and unimaginable skill on the part of the rifleman." "Over the last dozen years my son and I have guided for more than 100 elk here at Elk Song. They have been taken with a remarkable spectrum of rifles ranging from 4-bore to 6.5 mm, with a good selection of .577s, .416s, .375s, 338s and .300s in the middle. Many of them have been taken with .270s and I can tell you that no cartridge puts an elk on the ground more quickly than the .270 Winchester loaded with the magnificent (and now non-existent) 140 grain Winchester Failsafe bullet. (Some of the Barnes X designs are producing similar results.) The reason for the grand success is twofold, and returns us to the beginning: first the hunters hit very precisely with the gentle rifle and second, the bullet performance is off the scale." You can see the entire article at www.gunsamerica.com/blog/ross-seyfried-busting-the-magnum-myth/ That pretty much sums it up....
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 7,295
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 7,295 |
I'm a .270 junkie and always have been owning two and the one time I strayed from the 130 Nosler it was to use the brand new at that time,140 grain Fail Safe.The absolute worst bullet I have ever used in the .270..Penciling through game without opening up evidently by the holes I saw and no recovered bullet.
The first opening morning a fine bull hit solidly behind the shoulder area with little showing of being hit and he was gone with the rest.I new I hit him and gave him sometime then went after him with little blood to see.Found him later quite aways from where I hit him down hill as usual with a very small entry and same sized exit.
The second the very next day was a nice 4X4 Whitetail and I wanted this baby.Took my time at 200 yards and saw hair fly.I new bu the time I got around and over to him,I had my Deer..NOT..Same thing...Small hole in and small hole out with little apparent expansion and another blood hound search and rescue operation to find it also at the bottom of the steep canyon... .
I have the other 15 Winchester loaded 140 grain Fail Safes somewhere around here I will never shoot again.That batch sucked big time.I remember reading in Petersons Hunting Boddington had the same problem in Africa with the "new" Fail Safe...
Noslers or Trophy Bonded for me..Period.
Jayco
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 3,324
Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 3,324 |
Also those suggesting a 22 or some of some sort share my thoughts.
Get a 223 and load it to the same trajectory as the 257 & 270 and then try to wear the barrel out. This will do a lot more to insure confidence on a longer shot than some hard kicking medium bore would. This is the route I have went. I have bought a 700 sps in .223 for all of us to shoot more. This will scratch my itch for a new rifle and she can keep shooting her .257 and the .270 for hunting. OK this .223 has a 24" barrel on it. One thing I have noticed that turns off my girls on a particular rifle from the first time the pick it up is if it feels heavy and awkard to them. I think the 24" barrel is too long. Her .257 and the .270 both have 22" barrels. This rifle will be used exclusivey at the range maybe some varmint hunting but not likely as it is hard to get in big game hunting time with their school & athletic schedules. So what should a cut the barrel back to 21" or 22" probably either one would work. Thanks for all the input guys.
PASS IT ON!
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,294 Likes: 2
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,294 Likes: 2 |
22, 23, 24... all are good on the 223. If the barrel contours of all these rifles are different (.55 at the muzzle vs. .6) it's going to be hard to get them to feel the same. Assuming they're close to the same, with the same action make, a 23" barrel on a Short Action will feel pretty good compared to a 22" barrel on a Long Action... So I guess the answer is "it depends"...
“Perfection is Achieved Not When There Is Nothing More to Add, But When There Is Nothing Left to Take Away” Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,294 Likes: 2
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,294 Likes: 2 |
I'm a .270 junkie and always have been owning two and the one time I strayed from the 130 Nosler it was to use the brand new at that time,140 grain Fail Safe.The absolute worst bullet I have ever used in the .270..Penciling through game without opening up evidently by the holes I saw and no recovered bullet.
The first opening morning a fine bull hit solidly behind the shoulder area with little showing of being hit and he was gone with the rest.I new I hit him and gave him sometime then went after him with little blood to see.Found him later quite aways from where I hit him down hill as usual with a very small entry and same sized exit.
The second the very next day was a nice 4X4 Whitetail and I wanted this baby.Took my time at 200 yards and saw hair fly.I new bu the time I got around and over to him,I had my Deer..NOT..Same thing...Small hole in and small hole out with little apparent expansion and another blood hound search and rescue operation to find it also at the bottom of the steep canyon... .
I have the other 15 Winchester loaded 140 grain Fail Safes somewhere around here I will never shoot again.That batch sucked big time.I remember reading in Petersons Hunting Boddington had the same problem in Africa with the "new" Fail Safe...
Noslers or Trophy Bonded for me..Period.
Jayco Can't speak to the .277/140 Failsafe, but there was a batch of bad .308/180 FS's I used... never had an issue with the 308/165 FS though. I think all the "expanding monolithic's" have issues from time to time... one thing they generally will do though is penetrate like heck.
“Perfection is Achieved Not When There Is Nothing More to Add, But When There Is Nothing Left to Take Away” Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 87
Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 87 |
I like all the suggestions....but why not fit a rifle first? Daughters...girls...women...come in all different shapes & sizes, why not tune the rifle? Her results will be legendary with the correct fit. As to cartridges, most shorter actions likely will fit & feel better. So for cartrige selection, I'd go with the 308 class...260 my fav, but let the rifle pick her options.
Last edited by shome10x; 12/30/10.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 22,737
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 22,737 |
That Seyfried article is one I have in the file and reminds me again what a great writer he is. Put Ross, Mule Deer, Eileen and few others together in a monthly publication and you'll have a winner!
My home is the "sanctuary residence" for my firearms.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 22,884
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 22,884 |
I would start cutting the 223 back an inch at a time, setup the way you plan to shoot it, to test the balance. When it gets to where they like it, put a crown on it and shoot it.
A 223 does just fine with a 20" barrel.
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,216 Likes: 26
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,216 Likes: 26 |
Yeah, I've owned .223's with everything from 16" to 26" barrels, and they've all killed stuff out to at least 400 yards.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,248
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,248 |
In teaching kids, I feel it's important that the practice gun is set up just like the 'big gun'.
I'd have a gunsmith play with the 223Rem to match weight and feel as much as you can, but most importantly, get the trigger weights set up identically. Cheers... Con
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,965
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,965 |
IMHO have a 7mm-08/7x57mm Mauser with 140 grain bullets, or a 270 Winchester shooting 130 grain bullets.
Have a gunsmith make the buttstock length of pull and the barrel length short enough to fit her. And set the trigger for three pounds. Make sure that the set to where she can easily see the sight picture with.
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