Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only 400 Whelen in progress

mart,

How's the Whelen going?

FYI,

Both articles are now online

http://www.finegunmaking.com/page33/page51/page51.html
http://www.finegunmaking.com/page33/page52/page52.html

www.finegunmaking.com

It's coming along pretty well. I got to the range Thursday to finish the barrel break in and shoot a few groups. I shot some Hornady 300 grain flat points and 300 grain Spitzers. I got some good groups with 3031 and H4895. I got there with half my chronograph. I had the brain box but no sky screens . So I need to shoot some over the chronograph to report velocities. I have several more brands and weights of bullets to try yet.

I did form another 65 cases with cream of wheat. I am still waiting on the dies so up till now have been fireforming with COW and neck sizing with 41 mag dies. I use a 458 Win mag bullet seater to seat the bullets. I am anxious to try the Qual Cart 400 brass and I just picked up some Norma unformed cylindrical 30-06 cases.

I ordered a bullet mold from Accurate molds. I had them do a 320 grain and a 400 grain in on set of blocks. It's a brass mold and wow! It is a thing of beauty.



I should have blown the dust out before I took this picture. I was doing some sanding in the shop yesterday.



I don't know how much more testing I'll get done for a while. Hunting seasons start my next week off (caribou August 10 and moose August 25) and runs until the end of September. I won't be getting much range time unless I fill my moose tag early. I have a late season muzzleloader tag for November so I have second chance if the moose don't cooperate during the regular season.

I still have the 300 grain Barnes TSX, Woodleigh 400's, and Hawks in 300, 350 and 400 grains. I want to do some more work with both the Hornady's. A couple of break in loads showed some real promise.

I also have to get the front sight and barrel band swivel on and get it blued.

Man I got kind of long winded there. I will update more soon I hope.

Mart

Snuck away for another trip to the range today. Probably my last one till after the hunting seasons are over. I remembered both halves of the chronograph today. I tried a few loads for velocity that had shot well the other day. For the most part the loads all ran pretty close to the data I was working from.

I shot some Hornady 300 grain flat points with 61 grains of 3031. That load had shot well during break in. Good group and 2310 for velocity. The data I loaded from shows 2312. I ran the same load with the Hornady SP's and came up with 2364. I tried a load of 57 grains of H4895 and came up with 2321. The load data I have shows 2543 with 60 grain of of H4895 so 57 is right in the ball park of where it should be. I checked a load of 50 grains of 4198 behind both bullets and came up with 2230 for the SP's and 2203 for the FP's. The data indicates 2198.

The Barnes 300 grain TSX looked good at 60 grains of 3031 but only came up to 2190. With 58 grains it ran 2121 and 59 was 2151.

Working off some data for the Swift 350 grain A frame with 58, 59 and 60 grains of 4064 I tried the same charge with the Hawk 350 grain. Velocities ran 2033, 2078, and 2084 respectively and accuracy was nothing to write home about.

The 400 grain Woodleighs were a surprise. The data I had showed loads of 62-64 grains of H4895 and velocities from 2567 to 2690. I really have no desire to stand behind this eight and a half pound gun with 400 grainers running 2690. I did try 56, 57 and 58 grains and while the 56 and 58 grain loads ran 2301 and 2353 the 57 grain load ran 2154. Hmmm. The 56 grain load shot very well. The 57 grain load showed 204 fps of extreme spread with two shots ~100fps slower than average and two shots ~100fps faster. The others were very consistent. The brass is LC Match of different years but all are within 2-3 grains of each other in weight.

As for accuracy I turned in some good groups but overall I believe the full length bedding I did is not helping. I think I will free float the barrel and try again with some of the loads.

When it comes to recoil I could shoot the 300 grain bullets pretty much all day. While their recoil is noticeable, it is not at all bad. The 350's weren't bad but then velocities were fairly low. I expect with other powders and higher velocities it will be more pronounced. Now the 400 grain bullet at 2350 fps is substantial. It is very noticeably more than the 300 grainers. Let's put it this way. When you drop the hammer on a 400 grainer it leaves very little doubt in your mind that the rifle went off.

From what I am seeing I will probably spent more time working with H4895 as it seems to be showing some of the best accuracy along with some decent velocity. None of the cases have indicated any undue signs of pressure nor have I had any sticky extraction.

I have had no issues with headspace, at all. Cases go in and stop on the shoulder and when I have tried it the extractor will pop over the case head without pushing the case further into the chamber or pushing the shoulder back on the case.

I do have some feed work to do. The Hornady flat points and spitzers both want to snag a little. The TSX feeds like greased lightning. The Hawk and the Woodleighs both fed with out problems.

I am anxious to get it finished and get it hunting. Doesn't look like it will make it afield this year but it will be ready for spring bear.

Mart

Don't mess with the feeding, just run the TSX's and be happy!

Also, I like f ull length bedded gun for serious or bad weather hunting, evenif the accuracy is not up to what it might be if floated. How accurate do you need it to be to flatten a MOOSE, anyway?

Run it like it is and kill some stuff is my suggestion.

thanks for the updates, keep us all in the loop!

Mark,

It is showing some inconsistencies that I think are either a bedding issue or a scope problem. The scope is a Leupold 3x that has been back to the factory recently for a check up but I may change out the scopes just to check before I mess with the bedding.

I would like to see better than the 3-4 MOA I am getting. It may be that it's a new barrel and needs to settle in but I suspect the bedding is the culprit. I get the occasional group that is 1.5" but most run 3+ inches. You never know, I might want to come down and shoot ground squirrels with you and it needs to be shooting better for that mission.

As for the TSX bullets, well without starting another X bullet war, I will concede that they are a good bullet. I am just not one of their biggest fans. I was probably one of the earliest users of the Barnes X bullets when they first came out and my first 300 H&H shot them well. Every rifle since then has been extremely finicky about shooting them and I have sent many $$$ worth of them down range trying to get them to shoot. I gave up on them years ago, not because they are a bad performer on game but because I had so much more success getting cup and core bullet to shoot well. I am testing them in the 400 because they are available and there really are not a lot of .411 bullets out there. If they shoot well in my 400 I will use them but I prefer a good round nose cup and core.

I still have more work to do on the 400. I have no doubt I will find the right combination.

Mart

If you find the scope to be part of the problem, I MIGHT part with an extra Burris Sigature POSI LOCK 2x-8x30 I just obtained. Field of view that is amazing, and once set up and sighted in, you cannot knock it out of zero without destroying it in total.

Good luck with getting the rifle to shoot. I agree, it sounds like a bedding issue.

Mark,

I have several more scopes to choose from but thanks for the offer. In all the Leupolds I have had, I've only had one fail. It was a 2-8 VariXIII. They actually sent me a new one after damaging the original taking it apart. I really doubt the scope is the problem. It is one I picked up last year and sent back for a check up. It has been on a couple other rifles and done fine. I really think the bedding is the culprit. After hunting season is over I will get crazy with the scrapers, clean out some bedding material and see how it shoots.

I have to go back to work tomorrow for my week on then it's off to a caribou hunt, followed by a possible sheep/caribou hunt, then moose, then some birds, maybe a goat hunt and possibly a bear hunt just before denning. Basically work a week, hunt a week and repeat till snow flies.

Mart

I envy your hunting opportunities up there. If only wine grapes could be grown in AK. By the way I am a fan of the TSX bullets too. They shoot really well in my 7mm Rem Mag and my 300 Win Mag. Seem to be much less finicky than the old ungrooved X bullets. Best of luck with the hunting and shooting, Brian.

We earn our 40 day hunting opportunities up here in southcentral AK. 7 months of winter 5 months of tourists pretty much summs it up.

Limited access and lots of pressure where there is game, would not trade it for somwhere else but trying to be realistic. Lots
of other western states have more game and less pressure but a good day up here makes it all worthwhile.

You got that right. The sun just broke through after many days of rain and it is beautiful today. Headed out tomorrow to help a young man fill his bou tag. Maybe I will see a black bear to get a shot at. Hoping for a few days of nice weather.

Mart

They measure out at .404. Weird huh?