|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453 |
I suppose you can get anything frozen enough that it doesn't work.
What kind of rifle was it? it was an old Finnbear with that long guide on the right side of the bolt body. No sure what the purpose of that was, but that was what cause it to freeze shut.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9,472
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9,472 |
I think in general people over lube their guns. I use a small dab of grease on the locking lugs and on the cooking piece and that's it. I will blow off with compressed air and and wipe down with Rem oil if it gets soaking wet. Never had a gun not function doing it this way.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9,472
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9,472 |
RD, that is not a CRF action on that rifle.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,125
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,125 |
If I was unwilling to hunt in -20 and colder, there are years I would hardly get out at all... Exactly. I work outside year round. A couple years ago we decided 'it's too cold to work', so I pulled my kid out of school and we filled a mule deer tag that day. Took all day, but we got it done. -46C. Good memories for the both of us. I prefer M70s that have been worked over, but in my experience most well cared for rifles will work fine, in most conditions. We've had rifles freeze solid over the years, but in all cases the user was carrying chambered... One shot and the action functions fine. Obviously a trigger freezing is a whole other matter...
I've seen more well-shot game lost with TSXs than any other premium bullet.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 20,379
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 20,379 |
Now that we know what works, and what doesn't, has the OP?
If you're subsistence hunting on your SHTF property, you'd better be laid in before it gets -40..
I replace valve cover gaskets every 50K, if they don't need them sooner...
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,666 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,666 Likes: 6 |
I had degreased the rifle, wiped down the firing pin assembly and ran it dry.
Any rifle I take to Canada gets this same treatment.
WWP53D
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
RD, that is not a CRF action on that rifle. Yes Bwalker is right.
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453 |
I stand corrected. However don't most/all CRF's have that full length guide/extractor ? That is what froze shut. It wasn't the "sako type" hook extractor that froze. IMO, it is that long guide that was the magnet for ice/moisture that rendered the action inoperable. Actually you could see the ice in there. The only CRF actions that I know of that don't have that are the Ed Brown 704 and the McMillan CRF. Maybe they were onto something.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 46,748
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 46,748 |
None will show up with mine. At 40 below, they'll be in the house with me.
Camp is where you make it.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
RD: I think we got off topic as I don't recall mentioning CRF vs PF as an issue. I was talking about the trigger on a Rem 700;actually what I saw with the two rifles was a trigger that would not work on one ( frozen), and a safety mortise that clogged with snow on the other.
Once the guy cleared the clog in the mortice as best he could by flashlight in the woods;he finally got the safety to move forward, but the trigger was also frozen up and would not work.
I don't think this is a CRF vs PF issue so much as it is that certain parts of a rifle, or action style, may be somewhat more vulnerable to gathering debris, moisture,snow, ice accumulation, etc and not operating, than another.
At some point I guess anything can get so bound up it won't work(I know how to do it with a pre 64 M70, or what will make it "not work");and I have hunted little Remington carbines up north in lots of snow without incident...but it was after I saw the snafu cited above, and was careful to keep crap out of the action area best I could.
All mine went "bang!" when I wanted them to.
What happened with that Sako I don't know but I think you are onto the reason.
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 14,006 Likes: 6
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 14,006 Likes: 6 |
Coldest I ever hunted was -20 and I shot a doe and my firing pin on my Marlin 336 broke! Luckily I didn't need a second shot.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453 |
If a rifle freezes, does it matter what type of extractor or trigger or firing pin assembly or 600 trick moves it had / That's the point I was trying to make, but I understand why you would think that's where I was heading. In actuality, in this case, my point was that any rifle can freeze rendering inoperable and the topic here is how to prepare a rifle for extreme conditions. You and I could walk hand and hand in utopia if a 700 had the old style mod 70 trigger............... (and a timed safety and a repined, reground trigger and new mag box and a new follower and a rebuilt bolt release and a new polished Williams extractor........... )
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
If a rifle freezes, does it matter what type of extractor or trigger or firing pin assembly or 600 trick moves it had / That's the point I was trying to make, but I understand why you would think that's where I was heading. In actuality, in this case, my point was that any rifle can freeze rendering inoperable and the topic here is how to prepare a rifle for extreme conditions. You and I could walk hand and hand in utopia if a 700 had the old style mod 70 trigger............... (and a timed safety and a repined, reground trigger and new mag box and a new follower and a rebuilt bolt release and a new polished Williams extractor........... ) I was the "third man" that evening. The only rifle that would go bang was my pre war M70 with that simple old trigger.The rifle was just as snow clogged and frozen as the others but it still worked. That said I think the bottom line with all this is if hunting extreme cold, make sure the rifle is "clean" inside and out,free of old oil and debris,try to keep it that way (not always possible),and run it dry except for a very thin application of lube that you trust to provide protection and not congeal at low temps. Try to keep the thing free of snow and moisture that might turn to ice at the wrong time. This just might avoid little snafus.
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453 |
Bob, two of my rifles have the Black-T coatings throughout,which I stated requires NO lubricant at all and a third rifle, an all stainless 700 has a 40x trigger Black-T throughout. I bought that rifle from Bobby Hart, a 30 Super (30-8mmMag) and I bought the 40X trigger from Bobby and sent it to Birdsong for disassembly and coating before having it installed by Hart on the finished rifle, To my knowledge, the only part of a SS 700 that isn't SS is the bolt nose which is coated with some sort of black coating on the nose itself. My other hunting rigs are fully Black-T'ed such as my Remington Custom Shop 700 African Plains Rifle in 300 Win Mag and my Husqvarna 1900 action with a Hart barrel bedded McMillan stocked 06. Willams bottom metal that I had MP-3 finished [img] http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r74/RDFinn/Husky06Custom.jpg[/img]
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 1,705
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 1,705 |
If a rifle freezes, does it matter what type of extractor or trigger or firing pin assembly or 600 trick moves it had / That's the point I was trying to make, but I understand why you would think that's where I was heading. In actuality, in this case, my point was that any rifle can freeze rendering inoperable and the topic here is how to prepare a rifle for extreme conditions. You and I could walk hand and hand in utopia if a 700 had the old style mod 70 trigger............... (and a timed safety and a repined, reground trigger and new mag box and a new follower and a rebuilt bolt release and a new polished Williams extractor........... ) I was the "third man" that evening. The only rifle that would go bang was my pre war M70 with that simple old trigger.The rifle was just as snow clogged and frozen as the others but it still worked. That said I think the bottom line with all this is if hunting extreme cold, make sure the rifle is "clean" inside and out,free of old oil and debris,try to keep it that way (not always possible),and run it dry except for a very thin application of lube that you trust to provide protection and not congeal at low temps. Try to keep the thing free of snow and moisture that might turn to ice at the wrong time. This just might avoid little snafus. One thing, I think, yet unmentioned that makes this care easier and, thus, more likely to get done is a bolt that's easy and tool free to remove and disassemble.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453 |
If there is a simpler bolt to disassemble that the Husqvarna 1900, I haven't seen it. Remove bolt from action, turn shroud clockwise with your hand 180 degrees and the bolt shroud/firing pin assembly slides out. To reassemble, insert firing pin/shroud assembly into bolt body and turn shroud 180 degrees clockwise and you're done. To tools what so ever needed.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 1,705
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 1,705 |
If there is a simpler bolt to disassemble that the Husqvarna 1900, I haven't seen it. Remove bolt from action, turn shroud clockwise with your hand 180 degrees and the bolt shroud/firing pin assembly slides out. To reassemble, insert firing pin/shroud assembly into bolt body and turn shroud 180 degrees clockwise and you're done. To tools what so ever needed. I've only played with earlier Husqvarnas, but I'm not surprised that their last action was, too, very well designed and executed.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 32,206 Likes: 5
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 32,206 Likes: 5 |
Lube and condensation are two different things. Wet lube at cold temps, or thru evaporation get thick, hence my dry lube thing. Wet lubes collect crud at all temps above freezing, and maybe somewhat below.
Dry to touch lubes do neither.
Condensation/moisture freezing up in interior parts doesn't care what kind of lube you use.
The only true cost of having a dog is its death.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491 |
In my experience - though the lube or lack of it is a big factor- another big issue is specific design. I've had sticky trigger parts on various brands of bolt rifles in the cold. A couple of designs which haven't given me trouble, even in very deep cold: -30� to -40� F, have been the Ruger #1 and Mini actions.
Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491 |
If there is a simpler bolt to disassemble that the Husqvarna 1900, I haven't seen it. Remove bolt from action, turn shroud clockwise with your hand 180 degrees and the bolt shroud/firing pin assembly slides out. To reassemble, insert firing pin/shroud assembly into bolt body and turn shroud 180 degrees clockwise and you're done. To tools what so ever needed. I had to make a few turns on a M760 Winchester but that simple feature made it possible to dangle the firing pin, by my cold finger tips, in the gas tank of one of our machines in order to free it up so that we could dispatch a big bull.
|
|
|
|
528 members (1OntarioJim, 219 Wasp, 1badf350, 10gaugemag, 160user, 1Longbow, 41 invisible),
2,318
guests, and
1,236
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,194,334
Posts18,526,746
Members74,031
|
Most Online11,491 Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|