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Joined: Dec 2009
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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An outdoors laboratory with a multitude of variables is not the best place to come to an absolute conclusion. The only exception is if you convinced a .gov to give you grant money to study the impossible.
You're Welcome At My Fire Anytime
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Joined: Jun 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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An outdoors laboratory with a multitude of variables is not the best place to come to an absolute conclusion. My new best friend...
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
deflave: "Faster death" is an elusive standard, and hard to prove... Death of game animals is sometimes an elusive thing and hard to replicate precisely one shot to the next...we don't get to "kill" the same animal several times to prove a point since no two shots are ever precisely the same.What we can hope for is to see a general trend....unless of course you are a cull hunter in Oz or Africa but few of us get to do that sort of thing. JWP called me this morning to remind me of this,and said maybe a better way of looking at this is as creating more cavitation,more extensive wounding....which sometimes leads to faster death...at least as far as BG is concerned. It may be helpful to look at the whole twist and terminal performance thing as a "contributing factor" rather than "sole cause"....but lots of people have noticed it over the years,as far back as John Jobson, who observed it and wrote about it 3-4 decades ago. This my way of saying I agree with you BTW. Speaking of Oz, don't listen to the man behind the curtain... Schrapnel, I never have...
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2003
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John Jobson- He is an old one but a good one!
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 24,660 Likes: 39 |
From another post on the Campfire... I just finished W.D.M. Bell's "The Wanderings of an Elephant Hunter" and in the chapter on "Rifles", he writes...
�The thing that did the most for my rifle shooting was, I believe, the fact that I always carried my own rifle. Constant handling, constant aiming, constant Swedish drill with it, and then when it was required there it was ready and pointing true. Never once did I think I needed a rifle with fast twist�
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Joined: Apr 2005
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,971 Likes: 6 |
From another post on the Campfire... I just finished W.D.M. Bell's "The Wanderings of an Elephant Hunter" and in the chapter on "Rifles", he writes...
�The thing that did the most for my rifle shooting was, I believe, the fact that I always carried my own rifle. Constant handling, constant aiming, constant Swedish drill with it, and then when it was required there it was ready and pointing true. Never once did I think I needed a rifle with fast twist�
I believe this is the acctual quote I just finished W.D.M. Bell's "The Wanderings of an Elephant Hunter" and in the chapter on "Rifles", he writes...
�The thing that did the most for my rifle shooting was, I believe, the fact that I always carried my own rifle. Constant handling, constant aiming, constant Swedish drill with it, and then when it was required there it was ready and pointing true.�
Does anyone know what the "Swedish Drill" consists of? Is it the transition from a slung rifle into to shooting position or something entirely different. I don't recall Bell ever mentioning slings on his rifles, so I think he may be referring to something else.
Just curious if anyone is familiar with this term.
THANKS,
Stump
PS - The book is excellent! Took me a while to find it, but glad I was able to finally track it down.
[b][/b] Doesn't mention twist.
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,971 Likes: 6 |
I'm sure you wouldn't want inaccurate info to become perception.
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2007
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I can't help if the original post wasn't complete...
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I've never see anything "lift" or "splode" rabbits better than a 308 shooting 150g Core Lokts. All from a 1-12 twist.
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
O.K. But I want my sweater back... I guess that beats multiple legholds and the pellet gun treatment. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
An outdoors laboratory with a multitude of variables is not the best place to come to an absolute conclusion. The only exception is if you convinced a .gov to give you grant money to study the impossible. I'm pretty sure people can observe reality without a laboratory. But there will always be a handful of people that insist there is no difference in 200fps, and there will always be a handful of people that insist plastic tip bullets "don't do anything different" and there will always be a handful of people that need a pack of PhD's and a laboratory to see the advantages of a faster twist. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
I've never see anything "lift" or "splode" rabbits better than a 308 shooting 150g Core Lokts. All from a 1-12 twist. Man that sucks. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Jun 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 24,660 Likes: 39 |
Can you see out that eye yet?
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,705 |
I've never see anything "lift" or "splode" rabbits better than a 308 shooting 150g Core Lokts. All from a 1-12 twist. Man that sucks. Travis Yeah I know. On a Mauser action and all. But I make do.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,467 Likes: 3 |
When I was quite young perhaps 8 years old, I saw a cotton tail hit with a 125 grain bullet out of an 06 at about across the ditch range. Afterwards the rabbit's intestines were hanging from the power line over head and a red cloud where the rabbit used to be. Very impressive for a youngster. Couldn't wait till I got my 06.
Regrading slow twist vs. fast twist: The effect might be that a slow twist with barely stable bullet may tumble when changes of medium and a fast twist might not. But as stated the bullet rotates how many times through an animal??
Or looked at another way, Say the bullet is about to blow up like a sx bullet out of a 22-250. And it hits the target....
Last edited by Bugger; 12/10/14.
I prefer classic. Semper Fi I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
Yeah I know. On a Mauser action and all. But I make do.
I'm sure you'll find a job sooner or later. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
Regrading slow twist vs. fast twist: The effect might be that a slow twist with barely stable bullet may tumble when changes of medium and a fast twist might not. But as stated the bullet rotates how many times through an animal??
That's for nerds to figure out. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 10,653
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 10,653 |
An outdoors laboratory with a multitude of variables is not the best place to come to an absolute conclusion. The only exception is if you convinced a .gov to give you grant money to study the impossible. I'm pretty sure people can observe reality without a laboratory. But there will always be a handful of people that insist there is no difference in 200fps, and there will always be a handful of people that insist plastic tip bullets "don't do anything different" and there will always be a handful of people that need a pack of PhD's and a laboratory to see the advantages of a faster twist. Travis That is not a good way to start out trying to make a point. "pretty sure" - Guessing won't cut it.
You're Welcome At My Fire Anytime
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
That is not a good way to start out trying to make a point. "pretty sure" - Guessing won't cut it.
Cuts it just fine from where I sit. I have all the tools needed to acquire the empirical data. All you've got is jack+schit. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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