Something over twenty years ago, I picked up a pair of 4X Zeiss scopes that someone traded in as not enough scope. One of them went on a .308 and it is still there. I have been perfectly happy with it and I have witnesses to verify a bit over 500 yard kill with it. Agree, too far, and I will not do it again, but it does work. jack

"Do not blame Caesar, blame the people...who have...rejoiced in their loss of freedom....Blame the people who hail him when he speaks of the 'new, wonderful, good, society'...to mean ,..living fatly at the expense of the industrious." Cicero