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Joined: Jan 2003
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I picked up an old 77 ultralight in .257 Roberts last week. Anyone know where I can get some brass? Everywhere I have looked has been out of stock.
dd Buffalo Arms shows it in stock Buffalo Arms
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2005
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Wings, arms, what other body parts to Buffalo have that you wouldn't expect? 
Not a real member - just an ordinary guy who appreciates being able to hang around and say something once in awhile.
Happily Trapped In the Past (Thanks, Joe)
Not only a less than minimally educated person, but stupid and out of touch as well.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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here`s my thought i wish Ruger still made both cartridges 250 Savage and 257 Roberts ? in 77`s and # 1`s wood stocks -blued barrels. >yes the Creedmoor inventors should pay royalties to Savage for using really their 250 Savage case design.
LIFE NRA , we vote Red up here, Norseman
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Joined: Dec 2002
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2002
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rosco1,
Like 260Rem, I would also like to know where those hardware stores full of 93 Mausers rebarreled to .257 Roberts appeared. I have an extensive collection of shooting literature, and can find no reference to such--and never heard of it from any of my older hunting friends either, many of whom would have been around if it occurred. Please explain where this occurred. I have seen barrels full of "war surplus" Lee-Enfield .303's in my day, and one barrel full of a cheaper version of the Remington 700, all in .308 Winchester, in a sporting goods store in Norway.
A more obvious fact is that since the .257 appeared as a factory round in 1934, there's no way a bunch of 93's were rebarreled to the factory round BEFORE it was introduced. They would have been rebarreled to Ned Roberts wildcat round--which had slightly different dimensions, so would have been a handloading-only round. I sincerely doubt a hardware store owner would stock a barrel full of wildcat rifles for which nobody could buy factory ammo.
The major point, however, is that if somebody did rebarrel a bunch of 93's for the factory .257, it would have had to happen AFTER the .257 Roberts became a SAAMI-approved factory round--which means the low pressure limit was NOT due to rebarreled 93 Mausers,
Have a nice day. you can still find the business’s they were sold in but you missed it by 20-30 years, so you won’t find them anymore. Coast to coast hardware, Smith & Edwards and Bobs marina. Local stores. All those stores had a sporterized barrel of 91,93,95,96 and 98’s and a separate barrel for non Sporters . The sporter barrels were mostly full of Carl Gustav 6.5x55’s. But also had several 257’s, 308 and 243’s, among others but thought the 243 and 308 were worth mentioning, At least one of the 243’s was a 93 .must have been a local that thing? If so some of them traveled .. my 257 is stamped “made by A.D Forkey, Texas” it is a nicely executed rifle with a surprisingly nice wood stock. While every gun in the barrels were not 257’s, there were several 257’s to pick from. I got mine at Bobs, don’t want to leave anything out. You could find them by the crates of SKS and 30M1’s. I assumed that happened other places as well but maybe not.. I’m sure l’ll be set straight if not. It does seem that weak actions wouldn’t be the reason for the low pressure factory ammo,but this is the first I’ve read that it’s absolutely not the reason, which makes sense given the timeline. However it seems most loading manuals back then, when it came to the reason why stated “possibly because of weak actions “ I should have used “possibly” as a caveat to avoid chastising. or “I don’t know why Remington did that, maybe they just knew it would happen ”which is what Ken Waters says in pet loads.. Regardless I won’t repeat that old wives tale anymore I was unaware this was solved. I guess the pressure limit makes as much sense as the throat on them, which is said to be stubby because of short varmint bullets and blunt RN Roberts used. For Remington to follow suit makes about as much sense as a soup sandwich. In short it sounds like a bunch of I don’t knows and maybes. Didn’t know the definitive was out there. I am having a nice day thank you. Got a mixed bag of forest grouse this morning , gearing up for waterfowl this evening. You have a nice day too. Remember that the 257 Roberts was introduced during the depths of The Great Depression, when most people didn't have discretionary income to spend on rebarreling surplus military rifles or, it seems, to buy many commercial rifles either. The most common pre-WW2 commercial rifle chambered in 257 Roberts is probably the Winchester 70 and there aren't many of them out there. Whoever made the decisions about what bullet styles and pressure levels to standardize is probably long dead and since Remington has a well documented history of screwing up cartridges that they introduce, it seems unlikely that they had a clue that what they were doing would result in a sub-optimal outcome and criticism from those able to exercise 20/20 hindsight. Or so it seems to me.
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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
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Yep--especially 85 years later.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 338
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
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Sportsman’s warehouse online had some brass in stock last week.
Last edited by hotweatherhunter; 11/12/19.
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Joined: Feb 2010
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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You can neck down 7x57 brass. I have done it.
NRA Endowment Life Member, G.O.A supporter
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Oct 2000
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you can still find the business’s they were sold in but you missed it by 20-30 years, so you won’t find them anymore.
Coast to coast hardware, Smith & Edwards and Bobs marina. Local stores. All those stores had a sporterized barrel of 91,93,95,96 and 98’s and a separate barrel for non Sporters .
The sporter barrels were mostly full of Carl Gustav 6.5x55’s. But also had several 257’s, 308 and 243’s, among others but thought the 243 and 308 were worth mentioning, At least one of the 243’s was a 93 .must have been a local that thing? If so some of them traveled .. my 257 is stamped “made by A.D Forkey, Texas” it is a nicely executed rifle with a surprisingly nice wood stock. While every gun in the barrels were not 257’s, there were several 257’s to pick from.
I got mine at Bobs, don’t want to leave anything out.
Only thing I can think of is about 25+ years ago Kimber of Oregon brought out a line of inexpensive rifles on surplus 96 and 98 actions (don't remember 93 actions being used). The actions were matte blued, had fluted stainless barrels, and came in Gentry-designed "Rough Rider" stocks by Butler Creek. They came in a variety of cartridges including 257 Roberts... I had one on a 98 action that didn't shoot worth a crap.
“Perfection is Achieved Not When There Is Nothing More to Add, But When There Is Nothing Left to Take Away” Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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250 savage in roger 77 with 22 inch barrel just shot 35.5 of 4064. 2940 with 100 grain Sierra. No pressure signs. Ed k
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Joined: Apr 2003
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Ed. That’s about the same velocity I get with Several 22” 257s using 120s
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Joined: Dec 2002
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2002
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There is a kinda nice looking sporterized Swedish Mauser in 257AI on the Kittery Trading Post site for $375. It looks like it might have started as one of the Kimber rifles, but the bolt handle appears to have been replaced, not just ground enough to clear a scope, and the barrel looks like an after-market unit, but better than Kimber's C+ grade of work.
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Joined: Oct 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I picked up an old 77 ultralight in .257 Roberts last week. Anyone know where I can get some brass? Everywhere I have looked has been out of stock.
dd My local Sportsman's Warehouse has 50# bags of Winchester 257 Roberts brass. Want me to get some for you?
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Joined: May 2004
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
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50#? That's almost enough.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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Campfire Tracker
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I posted above about my 250. This load is from old Sierra and Lyman books. Is there any leadings with new powders and pressure available for it. Ed k
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Joined: Oct 2010
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I picked up an old 77 ultralight in .257 Roberts last week. Anyone know where I can get some brass? Everywhere I have looked has been out of stock.
dd My local Sportsman's Warehouse has 50# bags of Winchester 257 Roberts brass. Want me to get some for you? I have some on the way. Thanks for the offer. dd
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 446
Campfire Member
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I've had a half-dozen of each. The velocities I've obtained are fairly close, and not enough to make a shooter choose one over the other, frankly.
One peccadillo I HAVE really noticed though, is that every .257 Roberts I've owned (2 Brownings, 2 Rugers, 2 Remingons, 2 Winchesters) were finicky to load for.
Every .250 Savage I've owned (six 99's, a Savage bolt and a Remington bolt) was dead easy to load for.
That said, the fact that I still have two .250-3000's and a .250 Ackley doesn't make me stop wanting another Roberts.
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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
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My experience has been the opposite: Have owned similar numbers of rifles chambered in each cartridge, including a bunch of 99's, and the .257 has been easier to load for.
Which just demonstrates, once again, that rifles differ.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Campfire Tracker
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I’ve had a M70 Fwt, Savage 110, 722, and a Ruger 77 in .257 Roberts and all were easy to load an accurate round for. Still have the Ruger and wish I had the M70 back. Oh well, had to finance an elk hunt somehow....
Life Member NRA, RMEF, American Legion, MAGA. Not necessarily in that order.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I've had a half-dozen of each. The velocities I've obtained are fairly close, and not enough to make a shooter choose one over the other, frankly.
One peccadillo I HAVE really noticed though, is that every .257 Roberts I've owned (2 Brownings, 2 Rugers, 2 Remingons, 2 Winchesters) were finicky to load for.
Every .250 Savage I've owned (six 99's, a Savage bolt and a Remington bolt) was dead easy to load for.
That said, the fact that I still have two .250-3000's and a .250 Ackley doesn't make me stop wanting another Roberts. I've had 5 factory barreled 257 Robs, and all were picky or mediocre accuracy-wise. That's not to say a finely accurate 257 factory rifle isn't out there, I've just not had one. Have only had one 250 Savage, a Ruger 77 RSI, so a sample of one isn't that impressive. BUT, about 20+ years ago I was planning on a custom 250 Savage on an M70 action. I decided on an HS Precision cut-rifle barrel for it. I called HS, and somehow got the shop manager on the phone to discuss my project. He was obviously busy and really didn't want to talk, until he asked what I wanted the rifle chambered for. I told him "250/3000"... then he wouldn't shut up! He waxed absolutely lyrical about the 250 Savage, and told me over the years it was the most consistently accurate round they chambered for. To me, that's saying a lot. Really, the 6.5 Creedmoor is just a blown out, slightly upsized 250 Savage, and I think we all understand there is some "inherent accuracy" in that general design that it shares with the 250 Savage. Really, it's mostly the 1-14 twist that messed up the Savage. I love the little 250 Savage. Maybe Larry Koller's books had something to do with it, but it genuinely "kicks a little and kills a lot."
“Perfection is Achieved Not When There Is Nothing More to Add, But When There Is Nothing Left to Take Away” Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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I have one of each, both in ultra light bolt guns. The Savage is built on a Model Seven, the Roberts on a Ruger 77 Tang. Both have 22" Shilen #1 barrels, 1:10 twist. Both shoot pretty good despite the barrel that could be used as a horse whip. I load for the both of them.
The only difference I noticed, is one, the powders they seem to prefer are vastly different burn rates. I get almost identical velocities, in the 2800 fps range, but with two different bullet weights, both Nosler Ballistic Tips. The Roberts shoots the 115, the Savage the 100 grain.
I suppose if you want to run heavier bullets, the Roberts gets the nod, if you want a lever gun, go with the Savage, otherwise, they are pretty close to identical, ballistically and from a use standpoint.
Just my opinion.
"Ignorance is acceptable, because you can remedy it with knowledge and research. Stupidity is when you guard your ignorance."
Ted Nugent
"Idolizing a politician is like believing the stripper really likes you."
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