Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Cap and Ball revolvers ?

I've got that 36 caliber---sheriffs model. It's fun to shoot but I really don't like the cleanup after a short shooting session at the range. It mostly sits in the gun cabinet.

Bass Pro showed up as having #10 Caps if you are located close to one.

I am with you that as long as you have a nice solid ring all the way around on all the holes that should keep a chain fire from Starting at the front of the cylinder,and a nice fitting cap Should keep it from starting at the rear.
I say SHOULD because I sure don't know for sure as I have no experience just been reading on youtube and different forums for the better part of 10 hours

SOUNDED like it made sense !!
But Maybe the old hands with a lot of actual hands on experience will chime in concerning chainfires.

Are you using .451 balls or .454 balls ?

Sweet,I bet that the 36 has almost no recoil at all.
What kind of accuracy do you get out of it ?

It will shoot better than what I can. I wanted a 36 because everything else was a 44. Besides Wild Bill used a 36.

Some of the other guys were recommending Uberti. I can't argue with that I have a Uberti and it is a great pistol.
However this little Pietta is really made well, I will be interested to see what you think about the quality.
With the short 5 1/2 inch barrel it handles nicely, and I even left the loading lever on it.

I bought one of these Sheriff's two years ago and I liked it so much, I bought another one a week later.

I haven't loaded mine in a year, but I used at least 30 grains fffg. I say pack that cylinder full, you can't blow the gun up with black powder. If you load a chamber with 30 grains, and load it and see there is more room there, try 35 grains in the next chamber.
I use Remington #10 caps. I use .454 balls I want a tight fit.
I buy Wonder Wads, and I make my own lube, which is what the calvary troops used in the Civil War. I take equal parts of bees wax and mutton tallow, and melt that. Then I dump all 100 Wonder Wads in the melted lube, pull them out and put them on a paper towel to dry.

I put in the powder, then the wad and then the ball. The wad keeps the barrel lubed up and you can shoot a while without needing to clean it.

Those wads ought to help prevent chain fires. Chain fires are a mystery to me. With the .454 ball you shave a lead ring when you load it.
So that is a very tight seal. And the cap seals the chamber at the other end. I don't understand how they can happen I never have had one.

Years ago, I mean like 50 years ago, it was common for people to say you had to grease the front of the chambers with lard or Crisco to prevent chain fires. I remember reading back then it being suggested that using a cake decorating device loaded with Crisco was the ideal tool for this. So, I did so and very soon learned that after firing two or three chambers, all of the Crisco melted and I had a mess of melted Crisco mixed with charcoal-like black powder residue all over the front of my pistol. Black powder sparks melt Crisco pretty easily. I figured out real quick that this was not right. I noticed, as others have pointed out here, that when loading a ball there was a fair sized ring of lead shaved off that was indicating a very good tight seal of the chamber. I could not see how any sparks could possibly get around the ball if it was the correct size. I abandoned the greasing the front of the chambers and have never had an issue with a chain fire when loaded with lead. Now, firing blanks at a WBTS reenactment when there is not any lead seal on the front is a different situation and other steps need to be taken. Also, I have done rather extensive research over the last 50 some odd years and I have never seen any indication or even suggestion that in the 1850s, 60s, or 70s that anyone ever greased the chambers nor have I found that any of the surviving paper cartridges issued by either Federal or Confederate arsenals nor private companies issued or provided for chamber grease or wads. In practice some individuals may have added a wad of some sort between the powder and ball, but there was no such item as an ordnance issue, nor any reference to such in contemporary ordnance manuals. I have reprints of the original manuals from that time period. Having said that, I do think that is a good idea to include a wad, but not necessary.

Along those lines, Colt produced a five shot revolving rifle of .52 caliber during the war. Yankees at the Battle of Chickamauga armed with these gave the Confederates fits defending Snodgrass Hill against Confederate assaults there. In doing research on a particular Confederate unit engaged there, I found in some memoirs written by a soldier's captain that picked one of these up during the battle as a replacement for his single shot muzzle loader rifle, carrying it through the remainder of the war. Most of their regiment was armed with either .577 caliber British Enfields or .54 caliber Austrian rifles. The soldier was able to use the available .54 caliber minie bullets in this .52 caliber Colt revolving rifle as it loaded the same as a Colt pistol, shaving off the excess lead at the front of the chambers when rammed in.

Also, a tip to those who clean the cylinder of these by dunking well in hot soapy water and spraying with oil when dry: unscrew the nipples (cones) from the cylinder and clean and oil the threads as well. If you don't, they will in time weld themselves to the cylinder and you might get them out maybe after heating them with a propane torch and some serious cussing. It's a hassle, but worth avoiding a bigger hassle later. Burnt black powder is not friendly to iron/steel.

Cool info and of course a good tip about the nipples, one of those things one might assume everybody knows but of course some won’t.

I used to remove them when cleaning, clean them with the rest of the revolver, and then oil the threads before putting them back.

I have tried to find Goex Powder here Locally and cannot find any thing.
So I am either going to have to Make a 5 hour Round trip to Dixie Gunworks Or order online and Pay outlandish Shipping and Haz Mat charges or Just Use Pyrodex P.
From what I remember using in rifles the Pyrodex was actually harder to clean up than real black powder.
What is your take on this ?

Well I got it in along with the extra cylinder and it looks great to me.
The trigger pull varies between 3 -1/2 to 4-1/4 pounds but has some creep so I am going to take it apart and smooth it up and remove any burrs inside

When you say you use the Wonder Wads do you just Lube over the existing lube or do they also make some without the Lube?
How thick are the wads?

I already have some beeswax and am thinking about using 2 parts beeswax and 1 Part either Crisco or Canola oil.
I think that would be stiff enough to use as an under the ball wad without any worry about any worry about powder contamination during hot weather and still enough lube for colder temps to keep the powder fouling soft.

I Just got 300 of the Hornady .454 Balls in from cheaper than dirt,I already had some reward points from prior purchases and they had free shipping so my total cost was only $7.02.
Found some local Remington #10 caps for $6.41 tax and all.

Going to bite the bullet and order some Goex FFFG online and pay the Haz Mat and Shipping.

Trying to make my mind up whether to buy some wads and lube them or buying a punch and just making my own wads then lubing.
Maybe try making some with Toilet paper or Paper towels.

If you use Wonder Wads between powder and ball, you don't need any additional lube or grease to prevent chain fires.

I make my own cast bullet lube using a toilet bowl wax ring (beeswax) and a few tablespoons of general purpose automotive chassis grease (NOT wheel bearing grease) plus enough jelly jar sealing parrafin to get the right stiffness for my Lyman Lubersizer. Just melt all the ingredients in a double boiler, stir well, and pour the liquid lube into the lube chamber of the Lubersizer instead of using an expensive hollow lube stick. I believe some variation of the same formula would be good for making cap and ball lube wads.
Jerry
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I am not so worried about chain fires as I am about getting plenty of lube in the barrel to keep the fouling soft and keeping some lube in the cylinder base pin so there will be plenty of lube there to aid in cylinder rotation for longer strings of shooting before the cylinder starts getting sluggish to turn.
Also thinking about taking a file to the base pin and putting about 4 shallow grooves on top and bottom to aid in keeping lube there..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbrJ95NapjY

Dixie Gum Works is well worth the drive. Be sure to check out their museum while you are there.

Good post, simonkenton. I mostly agree. By way of establishing my bona fides, I competed regularly in SASS matches for about 10 years (and still do, sporadically) in "Frontiersman" Class... which means you have to shoot cap n ball revolvers, and your rifle and shotgun must use cartridges loaded with black powder (BP) or a BP substitute like American Pioneer.

I started out with Uberti Remington replicas, but quickly learned the cylinders bind on the cylinder pin before I could ever complete a match, so I switched to a pair of Uberti .44 caliber Colt 1860 Army revolvers, and then a pair of Pietta .36 caliber 1862 Police revolvers. I have used both the 1860's and the 1862's in multiple matches. I don't particularly care if I win or lose a match, as any Frontiersman is miles behind the cartridge gun shooters. I try to shoot each match as authentically as I can, and shoot it "clean" (as in no misses, no way a feller can shoot 200+ rounds of black powder and not be filthy!). I use the 44's in shorter/smaller matches, mostly because I love the smoke and roar of the big pistolas, but they are not as quick to fire as the 36 caliber Pietta pistols, and despite the longer barrels I find them no more accurate. My 1862's also have the bonus of being nickel plated, which seems to be less vulnerable to cylinder bind-up on long matches.

But to your point: I don't think there's much to distinguish between Pietta and Uberti in terms of quality. Both require work to bring them up to the reliability and accuracy potential proven by the old Colt's and Remington C&B guns of the 19th century. There are articles online on how any reasonably handy person can do this work to his own guns. They do not need to be sent to a gunsmith unless you want to bore out cylinders, which for purposes of cowboy shoots and plinking isn't strictly necessary. Numrich and Brownells sell almost all the parts you could need.

I also have a Ruger Old Army revolver, which is an entirely different animal: capable of handling loads that rival the old Colt Walker, it's in a class of its own. I would like to take a deer or hog with it, and it's more than capable of that. But it's not a competition or plinking gun, really.



I don't weigh out grains. I have a couple of copper powder flasks from Dixie Gun Works, the ones with the long brass nozzle and the spring-loaded valve. You turn them upside down, hold your finger over the end, open the valve, and the nozzle fills with the correct amount of powder. You cut the length of the nozzle for your particular guns. I have one for the .36 calibers, which holds about 33 gr of FFg, or about 34 gr of FFFg, and another one for the .44's, which holds about 36 gr of FFg. I use round balls, pure lead, that I cast myself, using Lee moulds. They're about .005 caliber overbore. I also use #10 caps, which don't fall off the nipples as much as #11's when you cock the hammer. Also: aftermarket nipples are available from several makers, which improve reliability considerably. I use SlixSprings.



I do the same, but with a 1:1 mixture of beeswax and Crisco. Works well, in all my BP guns. My Sharps bullets are lubed with the same stuff.




Wonder Wads will prevent a chain fire event, I've heard. But I've never met anyone who's had a chain fire, and I've met a LOT of BP revolver shooters over the years, so I have to wonder if this is something real or merely a modern legend.
EDITED TO ADD: I typed that remark last night without really thinking beyond the superficial fact. I did NOT intend for anyone to take it as me saying it's ok to shoot your C&B revolvers without lube or wads. There are some excellent Youtube videos showing chainfires occuring, and one in particular...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ne4VgCdAy7Y

... shows how to make one happen.

Just use Wonder Wads. As previously noted, I've fired thousands of C&B rounds in matches and for plinking without a chainfire, but I've used Wonder Wads or homemade equivalent throughout my BP sixgun shooting.

Sorry for the stupid mistake in last night's post.

Dayom, James, I'm beginning to wonder if there is anything you haven't done.

Never had sex with a man or a four-legged animal. A couple of 2-legged animals, yes. One a blonde and one a redhead. But no quadrupeds.

I have VERY limited experience with cap and ball revolvers. Think I've shot one, once, and watched one shot another time.

When I shot the revolver, the owner explained about greasing the cylinder chambers to prevent a chain fire.

When I watched one shot (later on), I asked about greasing the cylinder chambers to prevent a chain fire. The owner told me "That doesn't happen with this one".

On shot "3 we heard multiple shots. He packed things up and left the range.

Those are things for dimocraps. Yep, I knew you haven't tried being dimocrap.

lolol

I use regular Wonder Wads yes they are lubed, but very lightly. I don't know how thick they are.
Then I get mutton tallow and bees wax and melt it, and lube 'em up.