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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
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You don't suppose that many of those bosses started out on roofs or running saws do ya?
Further, it validates the point he was making: the higher the risk for employees, the higher the costs of having those employees[in many ways]. Some did, some didn't. The mill right up the road here is run by the grandson of the man who started it. He was never out there running the mill saws. Dang there is a lot of misery and envy in your blackheart. Ever think of taking that energy and starting your own sawmill or roofing company. Sounds like you have it all figured out. Should be a breeze for someone so savvy such as yourself. Not interested in saw mills or roofing..
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Joined: Dec 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,311 Likes: 23 |
You don't suppose that many of those bosses started out on roofs or running saws do ya?
Further, it validates the point he was making: the higher the risk for employees, the higher the costs of having those employees[in many ways]. Some did, some didn't. The mill right up the road here is run by the grandson of the man who started it. He was never out there running the mill saws. Maybe he was getting an education sufficient to run a business and provide jobs. I spent a good part of my working life in fairly high risk employment, my choice. I got paid well and enjoyed the work, Sometimes other people get paid more because they contribute more value. It is called capitalism. mike r I doubt like hell you were ever of much value to anybody.
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Joined: Feb 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
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Physical risk is not the same thing as business risk. But take your saw mill owner. He’s the one that has to take the risk of bodily harm to a worker in addition to the worker themselves.
They lose an arm, he loses his shirt. The employee is responsible for himself, but so is the owner. And all the other people he employs as well. And their families. And his own.
That's a big load of bull right there. The owner has insurance to cover accidents. The insurance is a business cost like any other. So is labor. It seems that most folks way overestimate their own importance. Money, success, etc. is there for anyone who wants to go out and get it. Most folks would rather bitch and whine.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
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A guy I went to high school with got a job at a local roofing company right after we graduated. He fell off a roof just a few weeks later. I still see him buzzing around town in his motorizef wheel chair regularly. He never got married and still lives with his parents. His risk was pretty big and he's paid for it plenty. The owner of the roofing company is retired now and his son runs it. His whole damn crew is Mexicans now. So what percentage of the American work force works as roofers or in sawmills? Maybe 0.01%. The reason most people get stuck in low paying jobs is because the WANT to be in them instead of doing what needs to be done to advance themselves. For decades our company (and many others) offered tuitiion reimbursement. We would pay for an employee to get a 2-year or 4-year degree in any field remotely related to our business. Very few took us up on it. Most of them were engineers who already had 4-year degrees and used our program to get master's degrees. Why didn't they take advantage of our program? My theory was that lower class people do not have the mental discipline to sacrifice something now in order to get something better LATER. When push came to shove, they would rather go drinking or watch TV than study for a few years and double or quadruple their income after that time. They do not understand delayed gratification. I've known alot of guys that worked in the saw mills and roofing companies over the years. Most do those jobs because they don't have the mental capacity for college. There are alot of folks like that out there. That is why their employers have to spend extra money to hire safety people to remind the slow to use the provided PPE. Another business expense that reduces $$$ available to pay more to those employees. mike r There sure weren't any "safety people" when I worked for the roofing company idiot. Doubt like hell they've got one now either. If they do the fugger better speak Spanish or nobody on the crew will know what he;'s saying.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
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Physical risk is not the same thing as business risk. But take your saw mill owner. He’s the one that has to take the risk of bodily harm to a worker in addition to the worker themselves.
They lose an arm, he loses his shirt. The employee is responsible for himself, but so is the owner. And all the other people he employs as well. And their families. And his own.
That's a big load of bull right there. The owner has insurance to cover accidents. The insurance is a business cost like any other. It seems that most folks way overestimate their own importance. I'm sure you do.
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Joined: May 2016
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 60,854 Likes: 57 |
Ahem....its been amended to Chrony Capitalism.....
I am MAGA.
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Joined: Feb 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Connections are everything. Grandad hires grandson to run company. So what? That’s the beauty of owning a company.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 16,153 Likes: 3 |
Low wage jobs are there as a starting point. If you aren’t worth a chit, you tend to stay there.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2012
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You don't suppose that many of those bosses started out on roofs or running saws do ya?
Further, it validates the point he was making: the higher the risk for employees, the higher the costs of having those employees[in many ways]. Some did, some didn't. The mill right up the road here is run by the grandson of the man who started it. He was never out there running the mill saws. Maybe he was getting an education sufficient to run a business and provide jobs. I spent a good part of my working life in fairly high risk employment, my choice. I got paid well and enjoyed the work, Sometimes other people get paid more because they contribute more value. It is called capitalism. mike r I doubt like hell you were ever of much value to anybody. LOL... tell us again about the pension and benefits your education and skills have earned for you. Are you still assembling guns for that anonymous gun maker? I guess when you were a roofer you had yet to be acquainted w/ gravity and therefore didn't take the obvious safety precautions. mike r
Don't wish it were easier
Wish you were better
Stab them in the taint, you can't put a tourniquet on that.
Craig Douglas ECQC
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 16,153 Likes: 3 |
Physical risk is not the same thing as business risk. But take your saw mill owner. He’s the one that has to take the risk of bodily harm to a worker in addition to the worker themselves.
They lose an arm, he loses his shirt. The employee is responsible for himself, but so is the owner. And all the other people he employs as well. And their families. And his own.
That's a big load of bull right there. The owner has insurance to cover accidents. The insurance is a business cost like any other. It seems that most folks way overestimate their own importance. I'm sure you do. LOL! The whole world is out to get you, huh?
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Joined: Dec 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,311 Likes: 23 |
You don't suppose that many of those bosses started out on roofs or running saws do ya?
Further, it validates the point he was making: the higher the risk for employees, the higher the costs of having those employees[in many ways]. Some did, some didn't. The mill right up the road here is run by the grandson of the man who started it. He was never out there running the mill saws. Maybe he was getting an education sufficient to run a business and provide jobs. I spent a good part of my working life in fairly high risk employment, my choice. I got paid well and enjoyed the work, Sometimes other people get paid more because they contribute more value. It is called capitalism. mike r I doubt like hell you were ever of much value to anybody. LOL... tell us again about the pension and benefits your education and skills have earned for you. Are you still assembling guns for that anonymous gun maker? I guess when you were a roofer you had yet to be acquainted w/ gravity and therefore didn't take the obvious safety precautions. mike r I build custom 1911's yes and I'm very good at it. I did general gunsmithing to include all types of repairs, refinishing/bluing, full restorations and building custom rifles. I apprenticed for 2 years with a well known and respected gunsmith and thereafter worked for 4 other gunsmiths learning more from each along the way. I do have a retirement account although I.m sure it is none of your business. I have chosen to work for small businesses that don't come with the kind of benefits people who work for large corporations or the gov't typically get. I do get paid personal days, paid vacation and paid holidays along with medical, life, dental and vision imsurance. All in all not bad compensation for the area I live/work and I don't have to put up with a bunch of ass holes like I would if I worked for a big corporation. The guys I work for/with are all coservative gun owners, hunters and strong supporters of the 2nd amendment and that is a nice bonus not to be found just anyplace. I expect I'll be staying until I retire.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 16,153 Likes: 3 |
You don't suppose that many of those bosses started out on roofs or running saws do ya?
Further, it validates the point he was making: the higher the risk for employees, the higher the costs of having those employees[in many ways]. Some did, some didn't. The mill right up the road here is run by the grandson of the man who started it. He was never out there running the mill saws. Maybe he was getting an education sufficient to run a business and provide jobs. I spent a good part of my working life in fairly high risk employment, my choice. I got paid well and enjoyed the work, Sometimes other people get paid more because they contribute more value. It is called capitalism. mike r I doubt like hell you were ever of much value to anybody. LOL... tell us again about the pension and benefits your education and skills have earned for you. Are you still assembling guns for that anonymous gun maker? I guess when you were a roofer you had yet to be acquainted w/ gravity and therefore didn't take the obvious safety precautions. mike r I build custom 1911's yes and I'm very good at it. I did general gunsmithing to include all types of repairs, refinishing/bluing, full restorations and building custom rifles. I apprenticed for 2 years with a well known and respected gunsmith and thereafter worked for 4 other gunsmiths learning more from each along the way. I do have a retirement account although I.m sure it is none of your business. I have chosen to work for small businesses that don't come with the kind of benefits people who work for large corporations or the gov't typically get. I do get paid personal days, paid vacation and paid holidays along with medical, life, dental and vision imsurance. All in all not bad compensation for the area I live/work. Sounds great! What makes you so cynical?
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 9,408 Likes: 2 |
Sounds sweet, why are you always so pizzed off?
mike r
Don't wish it were easier
Wish you were better
Stab them in the taint, you can't put a tourniquet on that.
Craig Douglas ECQC
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Joined: Dec 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,311 Likes: 23 |
Sounds sweet, why are you always so pizzed off?
mike r I don't know why you think I'm always pissed off. They do call me the grumpy old man at work though so maybe there's something to it.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 16,153 Likes: 3 |
Sounds sweet, why are you always so pizzed off?
mike r I don't know why you think I'm always pissed off. They do call me the grumpy old man at work though so maybe there's something to it. You're always bitching on here. Sounds like you've done well for yourself.
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Joined: Dec 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,311 Likes: 23 |
Sounds sweet, why are you always so pizzed off?
mike r I don't know why you think I'm always pissed off. They do call me the grumpy old man at work though so maybe there's something to it. You're always bitching on here. Sounds like you've done well for yourself. I'm always bitching about something. Just ask my wife. It's been a long hard road with two divorces, years of child support and a 500 year flood that wiped me out in 2006 but I get along.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 45,437 Likes: 28 |
A guy I went to high school with got a job at a local roofing company right after we graduated. He fell off a roof just a few weeks later. I still see him buzzing around town in his motorizef wheel chair regularly. He never got married and still lives with his parents. His risk was pretty big and he's paid for it plenty. The owner of the roofing company is retired now and his son runs it. His whole damn crew is Mexicans now. So what percentage of the American work force works as roofers or in sawmills? Maybe 0.01%. The reason most people get stuck in low paying jobs is because the WANT to be in them instead of doing what needs to be done to advance themselves. For decades our company (and many others) offered tuitiion reimbursement. We would pay for an employee to get a 2-year or 4-year degree in any field remotely related to our business. Very few took us up on it. Most of them were engineers who already had 4-year degrees and used our program to get master's degrees. Why didn't they take advantage of our program? My theory was that lower class people do not have the mental discipline to sacrifice something now in order to get something better LATER. When push came to shove, they would rather go drinking or watch TV than study for a few years and double or quadruple their income after that time. They do not understand delayed gratification. Indy, I gotta wonder how many of those folks that didn't take advantage of the tuition reimbursement thought it would be too much of a hardship for their families. Not saying they couldn't have figured out a way if the really wanted too, but havin pg known some folks in situations like you describe they made it known it would make life rough. As you say, a bit of a rough life now for a better life down the road is a great ideal. Many can't live up to it. I think a good percentage of the folks "stuck" in low paying jobs are there because they couldn't keep their pecker in their pants when their "girlfriend" couldn't keep her legs crossed. Hard to take time to get an education when one lives in an area that requires two paycheck earners in order to pay to feed the kid, pay the bills, and pay rent. Many times those two earners have to work separate shifts to care for the kid(s), leaving no time for school. Works better if there's family involved, but we all know the state of the family for many in today's world. It can be done sometimes, but I found it difficult even as a single guy in my mid 30's with no child support. And I met some folks doing it while I was in school too. High praise for them. It's a wonder to me, child of the late 60's, free love generation and all that, that kids today are still getting pregnant at 16, 17, 18, 19 years old or so before they've even had a chance to enter the job market or higher education. Birth control had been improved tremendously even just since then. Then again, that sex stuff is instant gratification at its finest, eh? Geno
The desert is a true treasure for him who seeks refuge from men and the evil of men.
In it is contentment
In it is death and all you seek
(Quoted from "The Bleeding of the Stone" Ibrahim Al-Koni)
member of the cabal of dysfunctional squirrels?
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 16,153 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 16,153 Likes: 3 |
Sounds sweet, why are you always so pizzed off?
mike r I don't know why you think I'm always pissed off. They do call me the grumpy old man at work though so maybe there's something to it. You're always bitching on here. Sounds like you've done well for yourself. I'm always bitching about something. Just ask my wife. It's been a long hard road with two divorces, years of child support and a 500 year flood that wiped me out in 2006 but I get along. Wow! That's tough, but it sounds like you've done well in spite of it all.
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Joined: Mar 2002
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 11,524 Likes: 4 |
A guy I went to high school with got a job at a local roofing company right after we graduated. He fell off a roof just a few weeks later. I still see him buzzing around town in his motorizef wheel chair regularly. He never got married and still lives with his parents. His risk was pretty big and he's paid for it plenty. The owner of the roofing company is retired now and his son runs it. His whole damn crew is Mexicans now. So what percentage of the American work force works as roofers or in sawmills? Maybe 0.01%. The reason most people get stuck in low paying jobs is because the WANT to be in them instead of doing what needs to be done to advance themselves. For decades our company (and many others) offered tuitiion reimbursement. We would pay for an employee to get a 2-year or 4-year degree in any field remotely related to our business. Very few took us up on it. Most of them were engineers who already had 4-year degrees and used our program to get master's degrees. Why didn't they take advantage of our program? My theory was that lower class people do not have the mental discipline to sacrifice something now in order to get something better LATER. When push came to shove, they would rather go drinking or watch TV than study for a few years and double or quadruple their income after that time. They do not understand delayed gratification. Indy, I gotta wonder how many of those folks that didn't take advantage of the tuition reimbursement thought it would be too much of a hardship for their families. Not saying they couldn't have figured out a way if the really wanted too, but havin pg known some folks in situations like you describe they made it known it would make life rough. As you say, a bit of a rough life now for a better life down the road is a great ideal. Many can't live up to it. I think a good percentage of the folks "stuck" in low paying jobs are there because they couldn't keep their pecker in their pants when their "girlfriend" couldn't keep her legs crossed. Hard to take time to get an education when one lives in an area that requires two paycheck earners in order to pay to feed the kid, pay the bills, and pay rent. Many times those two earners have to work separate shifts to care for the kid(s), leaving no time for school. Works better if there's family involved, but we all know the state of the family for many in today's world. It can be done sometimes, but I found it difficult even as a single guy in my mid 30's with no child support. And I met some folks doing it while I was in school too. High praise for them. It's a wonder to me, child of the late 60's, free love generation and all that, that kids today are still getting pregnant at 16, 17, 18, 19 years old or so before they've even had a chance to enter the job market or higher education. Birth control had been improved tremendously even just since then. Then again, that sex stuff is instant gratification at its finest, eh? Geno There's a lot of truth in what you say, Valsdad. And around here it's even worse. Girls in the ghetto making a conscious decision to have a baby and remain single. Like their girlfriends. I will never understand that kind of thinking.
Don't blame me. I voted for Trump.
Democrats would burn this country to the ground, if they could rule over the ashes.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 45,437 Likes: 28 |
friggen teen female hormones or something.
screws up the decision making process.
not only ghetto girls, I see it all the time in poor rural "white" America.
And teenage male hormones and their carriers are only too happy to assist the girls.
What a waste.
Geno
The desert is a true treasure for him who seeks refuge from men and the evil of men.
In it is contentment
In it is death and all you seek
(Quoted from "The Bleeding of the Stone" Ibrahim Al-Koni)
member of the cabal of dysfunctional squirrels?
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