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Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by CCCC
Originally Posted by DBT
It's a ruthless Boss who throws people into Hell for their beliefs or their lack of conviction. Reason would say: convince the person, not torture them.

Yes, among other important qualities - ruthless - you got it. Whose reason? Human reason, or the reason of the Almighty?


Reason is determined by information. If the 'Almighty' is said to have given a set of values, and is said to embody this set of values, yet is described acting contrary to the very same set of values....we have a problem, we are presented with a contradiction.

Information seems to be only one of the determinants in human reasoning. You say "We have a problem, we are presented with a contradiction". Who is "we"? For whom is a contradiction a problem, and why?


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The OP asked, "Why are you a Christian," DBT. Do you not have the IQ to deduce you werent spoken to?
Oh, I know, you have your freedom, and like a punk with your rights in an inner city school, you gets ta talk all you wants to.

One of the reasons I'm a Christian is because I prefer civilization as opposed to your uncivilized Babylonian babble.

You, by your very nature prove the existence of Lucifer. You're one of the broken spokes in the wheel of civil society.

You butt in where and when you wish, uninvited, as did your hero in the Garden of Eden, seeking to upset the apple cart, probably unaware of yourself being used as a tool, much like stupid, lieberal fools.

Last edited by jaguartx; 02/17/20.

Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.

A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.

"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".

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It could mean everybody is going to hell - I'll already be up the back laughing at all the christians coming in...


Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by Raspy
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk.

That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied.

Well?
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Originally Posted by jaguartx
The OP asked, "Why are you a Christian," DBT. Do you not have the IQ to deduce you werent spoken to?


If you had actually noticed, I had made no reply until the thread took the turn it did, after which it makes no difference, the course of the thread was set..

The question is, why are you so sad about it?

Quote

Oh, I know, you have your freedom, and like a punk with your rights in an inner city school, you gets ta talk all you wants to.


Your the one with the punk like bad attitude, trying to make it personal whenever placed under question, whining and moaning at how unfair it all is.

Can't you tolerate questioning of beliefs?

You should welcome it in the spirit of discovery and learning. It should be standard practice.

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Originally Posted by CCCC
Originally Posted by Starman
What are my 'usual tactics'..?
go ahead expose me!..

No need - it's already hanging out fully exposed all to see. And, who is laughing?


Hmmm dont know, who's laughing?
Is it one of your favorite story book characters...?

seen lots of empty word blowhard Catholics in my time
- you catholic by any chance?


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Originally Posted by CCCC
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by CCCC
Originally Posted by DBT
It's a ruthless Boss who throws people into Hell for their beliefs or their lack of conviction. Reason would say: convince the person, not torture them.

Yes, among other important qualities - ruthless - you got it. Whose reason? Human reason, or the reason of the Almighty?


Reason is determined by information. If the 'Almighty' is said to have given a set of values, and is said to embody this set of values, yet is described acting contrary to the very same set of values....we have a problem, we are presented with a contradiction.

Information seems to be only one of the determinants in human reasoning. You say "We have a problem, we are presented with a contradiction". Who is "we"? For whom is a contradiction a problem, and why?


'We' means us the readers. The text doesn't change. It remains the same for all readers/observers. The problems begin with interpretation. Some try to convert what the text clearly says and clearly means into something it clearly does not say or mean. Why? Because the actual meaning does not suit the needs of the faith of the believer. The believer is not looking at it objectively. The filter of faith screens whatever does not suit.

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Originally Posted by jaguartx


your hero in the Garden of Eden, seeking to upset the apple cart,.


God put the serpent in the garden for His purpose and made it the wisest most crafty
of beasts to ensure it gets the appointed task done.

Why you constantly complain about all the evil your
God procured is beyond me.


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A right royal set up to fail in the full knowledge of what would happen....then blame and punish the two naive innocents for their inevitable failure, a failure planned from the beginning.

Last edited by DBT; 02/18/20.
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Originally Posted by DBT

Can't you tolerate questioning of beliefs?

You should welcome it in the spirit of discovery and learning..

Discovery?. Learning?...
But that means giving up primitive superstitions
and the victim status mindset they proudly carry.

Take that away and what are they left with?

Basically we are dealing with Dark Ages tribal
mentalities, who miss the pitchforks & torches
and village mob comradery in going after
witches and heretics.


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This applies today as well as it applied 2000 years ago.

Mt 16:4 An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign, but no sign will be given to it except the sign of Jonah." So he left them and departed.


“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.”
― George Orwell

It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
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Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by jaguartx
The OP asked, "Why are you a Christian," DBT. Do you not have the IQ to deduce you werent spoken to?


If you had actually noticed, I had made no reply until the thread took the turn it did, after which it makes no difference, the course of the thread was set..

The question is, why are you so sad about it?

Quote

Oh, I know, you have your freedom, and like a punk with your rights in an inner city school, you gets ta talk all you wants to.


Your the one with the punk like bad attitude, trying to make it personal whenever placed under question, whining and moaning at how unfair it all is.

Can't you tolerate questioning of beliefs?

You should welcome it in the spirit of discovery and learning. It should be standard practice.


I discovered what you are long ago. The snake holds no attraction to me.

Last edited by jaguartx; 02/18/20.

Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.

A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.

"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".

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Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
Originally Posted by DBT
The book of Job does not paint a nice picture of God or the company He keeps.

Job is a wonderful account of God's grace and mercy..

Job was refined by fire and purified. Job at the end of the book is a better man than when it started. Job was initially said to be a righteous man, but somewhat self righteous. Job thought God was his ace card. When it's over, Job is God's ace card, not the other way around.

The refiner's fire is usually pretty hot. Adversity makes one bitter or better depending on what he brings to the equation.

Some understand it, some don't. Here's why:

1 Corinthians 2:14 (KJV)
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.


DF


You bring up a very good example. Job's battle was not with humans (flesh and blood), but we Christians and believers wrestle with other humans leaving the gate wide open. It is the church organization that teaches us to do so claiming that is God's way. Many of the scriptures teach the very opposite. Division among the ranks is the reason we keep losing the battle. Our lack of knowledge is another reason. It could even be said that our lack of knowledge of God is the biggest reason we stay divided.
Scripture that we should read, research, take to heart, and act upon is: "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."

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Originally Posted by NVhntr
Originally Posted by NVhntr
Do you think you would be a Christian if you were born in Saudi Arabia?
Or India?
Or Japan?
Or Nepal?


And not one direct answer to my questions.

Do Christians believe that the other 3/4 of the world are going to hell?


Someone already did answer gave you a direct answer with a simple, "Yes."

The Scripture is quite clear. Jesus is the only way to the Father.

God sends a deluding influence on those who wish to believe a lie.


"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
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Originally Posted by DBT
The book of Job does not paint a nice picture of God or the company He keeps.


Only from your flawed human perspective.


"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
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Originally Posted by DBT
A right royal set up to fail in the full knowledge of what would happen....then blame and punish the two naive innocents for their inevitable failure, a failure planned from the beginning.


Set the whole thing up so He could send His Son to a time and place where asses were wiped with bare hands, there were no antibiotics or indoor plumbing, so that He could suffer for those who hated Him & die a humiliating and excruciating death for sins He did not commit.

Dang God sure pulled one over on us with this Christianity thing.

You have every right to point out how ridiculous our religious claims are. I have no issue with that I’d sooner die than see it otherwise. But please... do so in the context of the whole story.

I just contextualized it. You don’t have to believe the story, but that is the whole story.

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Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by Ringman
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by CCCC
Originally Posted by NVhntr
And the winner is......because my parents were. - - -

No winner there - you are so very wrong.


People who have had no contact with the bible or Christianity cannot become Christians, that can only happen through conditioning, conversion or people being drawn to the faith once it has been established....missionaries or evangelism at work, etc.


You certainly live in a vacuum. There Muslims who became Christian because Jesus came to them.

Read the book The Case For Miracles.


I didn't expect you to understand what I said, and you have confirmed my expectation.

Just a hint, it has nothing to do with the fact that some do happen to convert....which is what I said.

Did you consider the fact that there are people who convert to Hinduism, Islam, Buddhism, etc? What do you think that means?


God sends a deluding influence one those who wish to believe a lie. Read the book The Case For Miracle.


"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
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Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
Originally Posted by DBT
The book of Job does not paint a nice picture of God or the company He keeps.

Job is a wonderful account of God's grace and mercy..

Job was refined by fire and purified. Job at the end of the book is a better man than when it started. Job was initially said to be a righteous man, but somewhat self righteous.
DF



There is not even a hint of Job being self righteous in the beginning, the middle or the end of the book of Job. God gave him an "A" in both Job 1 and Job 2. You should not add to God's Word.


"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
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Originally Posted by jaguartx
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by jaguartx
The OP asked, "Why are you a Christian," DBT. Do you not have the IQ to deduce you werent spoken to?


If you had actually noticed, I had made no reply until the thread took the turn it did, after which it makes no difference, the course of the thread was set..

The question is, why are you so sad about it?

Quote

Oh, I know, you have your freedom, and like a punk with your rights in an inner city school, you gets ta talk all you wants to.


Your the one with the punk like bad attitude, trying to make it personal whenever placed under question, whining and moaning at how unfair it all is.

Can't you tolerate questioning of beliefs?

You should welcome it in the spirit of discovery and learning. It should be standard practice.


I discovered what you are long ago. The snake holds no attraction to men.


You see the world through the filter of your faith...consequently what you believe you know and what you say follows like night and day. Nothing surprising.

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Originally Posted by DBT
Proof is a body of information that anyone can access and evaluate and draw a similar conclusion. Personal experience is subjective.


Is that why two scientists can look at the exact same evidence and come up with opposing interpretations? Both take this same evidence and use it to "prove" their view.


"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
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Originally Posted by huntinaz
Originally Posted by efw
God “stacked the deck”? Are you suggesting He is a trickster?

If one reads the interaction between the serpent & Eve you can see that human kinds’ tendency to doubt God’s word existed before the serpent even came along. The father of lies coaxed along a tendency already existent.

God, however, has always been about the business of redemption from the beginning. He is, by definition, the One who is in control of the universe and owes man nothing. The post enlightenment worship of individual autonomy is today isogeted into the texts to support our notion that we are in control even of Gods redemptive plan for His people.


Being omniscient He would have known it was happening in real time, would have known it was coming, would have known what would happen...

Not to mention it was all by His Creation. He’s in charge of all of it...

Originally Posted by Rock Chuck
Originally Posted by xxclaro
Originally Posted by Rock Chuck
Rom 10:9 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

There it is in a nutshell. You believe or you don't. You're saved or you're not. There's no other option.


Seems simple enough, but what about God calling only those who he knows will answer, and not bothering with the others?
It's your choice. That fact that God already knows what it will be doesn't affect anything. It's still your choice.


Seems to me there’s not really any choice about it

There were choices to be made, but the humans in the garden failed at them all.


We may know the time Ben Carson lied, but does anyone know the time Hillary Clinton told the truth?

Immersing oneself in progressive lieberalism is no different than bathing in the sewage of Hell.
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