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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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How do you explain Muslims, who don't know Jesus, claiming Jesus came to them?
That has happened. I have good friends who are missionaries, have started churches in Israel. The Mesianic Jewish couple who are their associates over there report a real awakening among the Arabs. They've had Arabs come to their home requesting that they tell them about Jesus. Asked how they heard about Jesus, they hear stories of Him showing up and healing people. Now, that's a pretty good segway into sharing the Gospel. The hard core religious Jews are more resistant to the Gospel because of the "spirit of religion". It was actually the spirit of religion that crucified the Lord. If Satan can't beat'em, he'll join'em. The spirit of religion is Satan himself; the High Priest, Pharasees, crowds etc. were actually functioning as his minions at the crucifixion.. DF And those were the ones who stoned those who broke the religious rules of the day. It wasnt GOD. There are a lot of hard core religious today who take control of GODs words for their benefit, and call other morals father and claim other groups of believers in Christ hell bound.
Last edited by jaguartx; 02/19/20.
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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How do you explain Muslims, who don't know Jesus, claiming Jesus came to them?
That has happened. I have good friends who are missionaries, have started churches in Israel. The Mesianic Jewish couple who are their associates over there report a real awakening among the Arabs. They've had Arabs come to their home requesting that they tell them about Jesus. Asked how they heard about Jesus, they hear stories of Him showing up and healing people. Now, that's a pretty good segway into sharing the Gospel. The hard core religious Jews are more resistant to the Gospel because of the "spirit of religion". It was actually the spirit of religion that crucified the Lord. If Satan can't beat'em, he'll join'em. The spirit of religion is Satan himself; the High Priest, Pharasees, crowds etc. were actually functioning as his minions at the crucifixion.. DF And those were the ones who stoned those who broke the religious rules of the day. It wasnt GOD. They got their orders from God.
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Campfire Outfitter
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And those were the ones who stoned those who broke the religious rules of the day. It wasnt GOD.
They got their orders from God. By rights the Jews could have arrested and killed Jesus for uplifting the tables in Temple, which was a very serious capitol punishment offence. but it shows they gave him a free pass...which makes the Bible narrative highly improbable if not absurd. Jesus preached in the Temple and caused an unforgettable major incident (as above) in the Temple...so surely many people by this time already knew the man and could easily positively identify him. ...but apparently the pharisees had to go to the trouble to pay a Judas to identify him...??? just another absurd/highly improbable Bible narrative example.
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
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Campfire Ranger
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When he overturned the tables in the temple, the Jews had turned the house of prayer into a den of thieves, Theirs was the offence, not the Lord Jesus Christ's. And contrary to popular misinformation, He was just an average looking Jew of his day, so not everybody recognized him, well except the ones with high speed modems and search engines.
"Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life." (Prov 4:23)
Brother Keith
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He was just an average looking Jew of his day, so not everybody recognized him You turn over the tables in a Temple of all places (where you also preach in), and they wont forget who you are. Re: "average looking jew" ...how do you know this? Chinese largely 'all look the same' to anglo folk, but Chinese people know how to identify their own individuals of particular interest. Im confident the Jews could do the same with their own tribal Jews.
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
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How did they not recognise him? Musta been the only white guy there (according to all the depictions of him)
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk. That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied. Well?
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Campfire Ranger
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Just an average Jew .... Isaiah 53:2-3
For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.
3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
"Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life." (Prov 4:23)
Brother Keith
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Campfire Outfitter
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Just an average Jew .... Isaiah 53:2-3
. or more precisely: Isaiah 53: “He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to Him, nothing in His appearance that we should desire Him.” that does not mean they could not easily identify a person who preached in the temple and caused a major capitol offense scene in the Temple..drawing great attention to himself.
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
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Campfire Ranger
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That is one side of the coin....the flip side is God killing people for very little reason, gathering sticks on a Sabbath, etc, which is not a demonstration of Love. You still don't get it. God,in His love, force them to take a day off so they didn't work all the time. The God of Love forces people to have a day of rest....and if they don't he kills them? This is a display of Love and Tender Mercy? True, I don't get it. You don't get it because you don't want to. God made an example of one and that took care of that. But there's a little thing you seem to forget. Just like I told you about the boss you didn't get the idea the Boss is not subject to the rules. Those who don't cooperate are rejects. I used to burn the rejects. It's the nature of the 'example to others' and the underlying attitude it embodies that is the problem. You still don't get the idea the Creator is not bound by anything. There's almost nothing we can do like God. Some, like you, can not fathom the concept we humans have value only because the Creator says we do.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
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Yeah, but we created god, so he is bound by what powers we decide to give him
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk. That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied. Well?
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My experience is that God calls to those with open minds and hearts who know they’re deeply flawed and want to know Him.
I’ve met many people who didn’t believe but didn’t NOT believe and who asked God to show Himself to them and none were ignored.
But in the interest of fairness, if you’d prefer to shake your fist or wave your bird at Him instead you’ll also get the answer you seek. That was not my experience. I tried. The more I learned about it, about the Bible, about science, about religions in general and about the world the less it made sense. I could lie to everyone else of course but if He is real then I figured I wasn't fooling Him. You reckon he'd be more pissed at trying to pull one over on Him or not pretending to be faithful?
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That is one side of the coin....the flip side is God killing people for very little reason, gathering sticks on a Sabbath, etc, which is not a demonstration of Love. You still don't get it. God,in His love, force them to take a day off so they didn't work all the time. The God of Love forces people to have a day of rest....and if they don't he kills them? This is a display of Love and Tender Mercy? True, I don't get it. You don't get it because you don't want to. God made an example of one and that took care of that. But there's a little thing you seem to forget. Just like I told you about the boss you didn't get the idea the Boss is not subject to the rules. Those who don't cooperate are rejects. I used to burn the rejects. It's the nature of the 'example to others' and the underlying attitude it embodies that is the problem. You still don't get the idea the Creator is not bound by anything. There's almost nothing we can do like God. Some, like you, can not fathom the concept we humans have value only because the Creator says we do. The bible defines its creator, giving descriptions of his values and actions....
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If we accept omniscience and omnipotence then I start to get a little irritated. Stacking the deck against me and knowing how it was gonna play out all along and all the while having the power to intervene... thanks Bruh
But then again if we accept that and then look at the system, it falls apart pretty quickly
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Campfire Kahuna
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OP
Campfire Kahuna
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Thanks all good brothers in Christ. we are called to spread the Gospel.
These premises insured by a Sheltie in Training ,--- and Cooey.o
"May the Good Lord take a likin' to you"
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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My experience is that God calls to those with open minds and hearts who know they’re deeply flawed and want to know Him.
I’ve met many people who didn’t believe but didn’t NOT believe and who asked God to show Himself to them and none were ignored.
But in the interest of fairness, if you’d prefer to shake your fist or wave your bird at Him instead you’ll also get the answer you seek. That was not my experience. I tried. The more I learned about it, about the Bible, about science, about religions in general and about the world the less it made sense. I could lie to everyone else of course but if He is real then I figured I wasn't fooling Him. You reckon he'd be more pissed at trying to pull one over on Him or not pretending to be faithful? Well, you were right in not fooling Him. Now, learning science, the apparent contradictions in the Bible, about other religions and then making your "intelligent" deduction and thus relying on your own understanding rather than having faith is a losing proposition. How many years did you ask Him in prayer to give you faith and help you overcome your unbelief, not saying I'm an expert or good example or very well versed in this.
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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Campfire Ranger
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Yeah, but we created god, so he is bound by what powers we decide to give him And where did we come from? O yes. I remember now. We came from nothing. Isn't that intelligent of me?
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
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Religion would otherwise say the same, oh, and where did god come from?
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk. That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied. Well?
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Nobody is claiming that we came from nothing.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Copy from a Monday TF post:
For AS, in case he missed it:
AS,
Please know that it is not a Christian duty or responsibility to convince you about the reality of God and the reality of Jesus and the gift. Folks such as I can point the way ..... explain little or much depending upon the “ears” that hear us....hold you up in prayer before the Father... so on and so forth ...But, it is the Holy Spirit of God .... not me or others.....that shows the clear and weighty truth to the honest seeker of God.
God will not hold me responsible for your eternal destiny. That is between you and God.
Those that have ears to hear, will indeed hear. Those that “stick their own fingers in their ears” ..... for whatever reason they do.... those are the ones that will not hear and not believe and who have not yet received the gift.
Also....There has been much talk about evidence or “proof.” There is proof. As, I have previously related, God spoke to me..... God proved Himself to me. I related that experience on this Forum.
I have proof and you don’t. Our differences may be as simple as that. Seek the proof.... it is there.
Btw....regarding “threat” ....... when one recognizes an “indication of impending.....whatever.....trouble, risk or danger....”...... a responsible caring person might warn the one who is at risk. With that thought in mind, yes, I fear for you and am trying to warn you. Others have as well. Kinda like warning someone of a runaway horse headed their way.....”Watch Out!”
Not to say that preaching hellfire is of no value, but it seems to me that simply threatening some one with hellfire will do little good. Sometimes yes, but why would they be afraid of hellfire from a God they place no stock in? Seems that something specific from the Holy Spirit has to have been communicated first. Anyway, that is a digression.
This is your life and a hand has been dealt to you..... play it wisely.
ATB,
TF
TF, I do not seek a specific god or specific outcome, what I seek is the truth. I do my best to carefully examine and minimize my presuppositions, base my beliefs on objective evidence, and accept when insufficient evidence to accept a given proposition. I'm open to sound idea's supported by sufficient evidence of the appropriate quality given the nature of the claim. What I see in your post is an emotional appeal. Yes, I believe it's a well intentioned, heart felt emotional appeal, but none the less still, just an emotional appeal related to an outcome for which I've been presented with no good evidence, and much contra-indicated evidence. Yes, this is my life, and I'm living it the best way I know how based upon best evidence available to me. In return, it is my hope that your irrationally based beliefs do not lead you to bad outcomes. May the random variances of the universe favor you. AS.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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DBT posted......
How does God call out?
I already addressed that. Go back and read it if you are interested. You talked about it, but I wouldn't rally say you answered it.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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