So, on the recommendation of some savvy souls here, I got a bunch of new 25-35 brass, ran a couple through my resizer die and ended up with the attached. I'm a little concerned with what appears to be a "ring" at the top of the shoulder. Being a "newbie" I figured you wizened savage mentors could offer your opinion as to continue and use them, or do I have a problem here? The case seems to chamber fine as is in the rifle, but as I said, being a NEWBIE I am not sure of what I'm seeing. Running a S&B 5.62 x 52R case after bullet pull didn't produce said effect. Opinions?
What he said. 'Tis perfectly normal because the .25-35 shoulder region is smaller than the .22 HP and can't be opened out in a sizing die.
Hint: now is the time to adjust the die to give good headspace for the cartridge's initial firing. Set up the die so that small secondary shoulder is far enough forward so as to make the bolt a little tiny bit stiff to close on it. What that does is simply making the cartridge headspace on the shoulder (the small secondary shoulder you're creating) instead of the rim. The benefit to that is it minimizes the case stretching upon firing and may well help promote better case life.
"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz "Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
yeah, what they said, "that's normal, it will go away on the first firing". Make sure it will chamber, you might need to push it even further. Check your overall brass length after resizing, and after each firing. Keep your case length tight and consistent for best brass life.
I have discovered that moving brass around into new shapes often squeezes the extra brass up into the neck length. After you have needed to trim the brass length more than twice, your risk of case head separation goes way up, toss it.
"...One Nation under God, indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for All"
Or, save that brass that's been fired a couple times for use with namby-pamby low velocity plinker loads for another shot or two. 6-8 grains Unique and a 60 grain cast bullet doesn't generate much pressure at all and is more fun for busting empty beer cans than watching Nancy Pelosi cross a busy expressway blindfolded. On second thought...
"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz "Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
Don't send it to me! I have more HP brass than Carter's got Little Liver Pills!
Do what you want. Machs nix to me. I'm just saying that I, and the cast bullet guys I've hobnobbed with for 40 years, routinely save cases that are dodgy for 50,000psi loads for a couple more firings of mouse-fart loads.
Besides, if someone is cranking up the pressure in his loads such that he's only getting a couple shots per case, IMO he needs to re-assess his needs. There's no earthly reason to run full tilt with every pull of the trigger. It's no less manly to shoot mid-range loads than full power loads. A wise man told me once that a bullet only needs enough velocity to make it to the target and put a hole in the paper.
Last edited by gnoahhh; 03/25/20.
"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz "Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
NOTE: Variations in groove diameters are something encountered in rifles chambered for this cartridge. Most barrels have a groove diameter of .228” while a small percentage are found with a larger groove of .229". Jacketed bullets of .228" diameter work well when used in a standard groove (.228") barrel. For oversize barrels, we recommend the use of case lead alloy bullets which will expand to groove diameter.
70 Grain Jacketed Bullet
IMR3031 starting load: 24.0 grains = a Muzzle Velocity of 2433 feet/per/second Maximum Load: 27.0 grains. MV = 2777 fps
IMR4895 starting load: 25.0 grains = a MV of 2400 fps Maximum Load: 28.0 grains = a MV of 2754 fps
IMR4320 starting load: 27.0 grains = a MV of 2652 fps Maximum Load: 30.0 grains = a MV of 2840 fps
ACCURACY LOAD: 25.3 grains of IMR3031 = a MV of 2604 fps
FACTORY DUPLICATION LOAD: 25.5 grains of IMR3031 = a MV of 2624 fps
NOTE: THESE MAXIMUM LOADS MAY BE DANGEROUS IN YOUR RIFLE. YOU SHOULD WORK UP TO THESE MAXIMUM LOADS CAREFULLY.
I'm just looking for the bullets to make round holes and not keyholes and go where I aim mostly. Not looking for big bang moments.
I've experienced that re-formed brass will be good for 6,8,10 reloads with 22HP (or the 219Z, which is where most of my experience comes from). I'm using case trim length as a gauge of how much the brass MIGHT be stretching. Standard reloading protocol I know, I'm just more conscious of it when using re-formed brass.
I'm reassured by checking for that case length after each of my firings. When I find that I need to trim it again, it gives me an early warning that the brass is stretching. Brass life is probably shorter using re-formed 30-30, I get folds in the shoulder, that usually end up as splits. I imagine you could reload brass forever using your low power tincan plinking loads.
"...One Nation under God, indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for All"
I dont reload ,,,just read about it ;-) That said ......How do you determine SAAMI CUP pressures ? Can they be determined from velocity of each reloading specs ?
Finally got my super accurate Mitutoyo calipers today and started measuring brass. The Norma and S$B cases with no bullets measure about 2.041", the reformed 25-35 cases re coming in at 2.036, a little short of the 2.04" trim to length.
Is this a problem? I'm a little confused at this point.
Since this is my first attempt at reloading anything, I wanted to be sure I wasn't going to make an UNFORTUNATE newbie mistake and have my first reload do bad things. I found plenty of info for trim to length, but nothing to indicate a minimum case length. Just a maximum.
You're good to go! Your 2.036" brass will expand toward the 2.040" SAAMI length with each firring. Check Your case length after each firring and keep track of the changes. This will give you solid statistics to gauge your brass life-span.
Brass will expand to fill the chamber when firred, it will typically flow forward with the internal expansion. When your brass is trimmed to something less than the chamber/SAAMI length, the brass will flow/expand into the empty chamber neck space.
"...One Nation under God, indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for All"
Now, to add a little more "WTF?" to the conversation.
I used an overall length gauge to measure my HP 22 for optimal case length. I did this twice. I got 2.724" from bolt face to where the bullet engages the lands in the barrel for overall bullet length. They say to subtract .010 to .025 for optimal bullet length. That puts me at 2.7" OAL.
That is almost .2" more than the listed OAL of 2.510".
Do I have a problem? I will try to measure it using the empty case with bullet method next and see if it's repeatable.
If they feed through the magazine no problem. COL is just a general length to insure feeding and chambering in all firearms. Load some dummy rounds - no primer or powder- to to the length you wish and see if they cycle through the magazine and chambers. If it doesn't just seat the bullet deeper until it does.
Mike
NRA Patron Member
If its "Made in America", its not setting on a container ship!
Best OAL will be specific to your rifle. Load your chosen bullet to spec length, find your best powder/charge weight. Then, if you just want to burn up powder and bullets, play with the OAL seat depth for tweeking improvements. For hunting ammo OAL is best figured for ease-of-feed as Mike offered.
"...One Nation under God, indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for All"
