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And interesting fellow;

https://www.tshaonline.org/handbook/entries/vial-pedro-pierre

And another noteworthy fellow

https://www.tshaonline.org/handbook/entries/mares-jose

These guys saw some stuff!!!!

The ol’ Taovaya indians up on the Red River continually pop up all thru the colonial period. Their main village was there on the Red around present "Spanish Fort" Texas. Although there was no Spanish , or French, or any garrison there. There was a reported brreastwork the Taovaya had built around their main village.

It was here that Commandant Parilla led his ill-fated punitive expedition against the  "Norteños" for their destruction and martyring of the priest at the Mission way down on the San Saba, river three leagues east of the Presidio discussed earlier in the thread.

One note from the battle in Parilla’s report was of a native cancique (chieftan) well mounted and armed with French fusils, accompanied by about five "loaders" on foot who assured their chief never had an empty musket!!!

I appreciate everyone’s input. In light of my love of history, I have really enjoyed this thread.
My compliments. Some of you gentlemen really know your material.

JTrapper73,

For me personally there is more interesting stuff to be read in historical accounts, bios, and primary references than in any fiction. Just my personal preference. So many rabbit holes that lead to other things. Keeps me reading!

Yep. Not to far from the Ranch here. Also close to where Rath City was located. Within view of the Double Mountains.

I feel the same way sir!

I with that there were like buttons to use to express that as a non participant I’m enjoying this thread. Great conversation. Please, consider that I am brewing a fresh pot of coffee for you guys so that you can carry on.

The battle of Adobe Walls was pretty much the beginning of the Red River War. It lasted from 1874-1875. The Comanches were finally defeated at the Battle of Palo Duro Canyon, by Col. Randall McKenzie, whom the Indians called "Bad Hand". He destroyed the Comanche's horse herd and larder and pretty much forced them onto the Reservation.

We do not blink at Euro explorers wandering all over the place, but somehow seem to mentally nail our Indians down in one area. Weren't so.

Years ago I read a historical account in "Muzzleloader" magazine of an 18th Century Englishman interviewing a Natchez Indian, this particular Indian had traveled alone up the Mississippi and Missouri, crossed over the mountains and encountered Russians in the Pacific Northwest. Returning from that journey he had set out again, this time ascending the Ohio River, eventually making his way to the New England Atlantic Seaboard and back.

During the sack of Ticonderoga in 1757 in Upstate NY, the scary cannibalistic Ottawas came in from as far afield as Wisconsin, and one captured and eventually adopted British soldier was paraded before his captor's relatives as far afield as Mississippi.

All through that period the Iroquois were conducting long-distance revenge warfare against the Cherokees and Chickasaws to name just two, many forays by either side taking a period of months during which time the the combatants might cover more than 1,000 mile round-trips on foot.

During the Rocky Mountain Fur Trade era the largest single contingent of trappers may have been Iroquois Indians from NY, Canada and the Midwest. The Delawares were especially mobile, originating in the New Jersey/Delaware area and in subsequent generations turning up all over the West, which is why there's the Delaware Mountains north and west of Pecos TX. In particular, one Delaware, Black Beaver, had been to California and back five times before Jedediah Smith finally found his way there.

Same period, the Ute Bandit Walkara, based in Utah, was trading slaves and stealing horses as far afield as California.

A while later, a party of Blackfeet from the Northern Plains joined up with some Kiowas and traveled far enough south through Mexico to encounter parrots and monkeys.

I suppose I should throw in that during the Great Comanche Raid of 1840, many if not most of those Comanches and Kiowas raiding clear to the Gulf Coast had doubtless come down from the big inter-tribal peace treaty brung about by the Bent Brothers way up in Southern Colorado.

The Texian Santa Fe Expedition (1841???), wherein the Texians got famously lost was spotted by Jim Shaw, a Delaware then around 21 years of age and already a veteran at crossing the Plains and had been to Santa Fe several times. Shaw could see they were lost and might have helped them but feared they would shoot him out of hand for being an Indian.

Gotta throw in those two Nez Perce who famously made their way on their own initiative from Central Idaho to St Louis (??) to ask for missionaries to come visit them.

I'm sure there's more....

Than went on to die broke and insane. Damn shame.

Yep. Like this fellow. There’s a creek south of Abilene that runs through my nephews place that he discovered that’s named after him.

https://www.tshaonline.org/handbook/entries/jim-ned

Believe there's a jim ned highschool in that area as well.

Yep. In Tuscola. That’s where Colt McCoy played HS Football.

And they are still the Jim Ned Indians ! 🤠

Here’s a good story on the Legendary TX Ranger Jack Hays last Battle with the Comanches. The Battle of Paint Rock.
It’s a pretty neat historical site if y’all ever get a chance to visit it.

http://www.texasescapes.com/JefferyRobenalt/Paint-Rock-Last-Comanche-Fight-of-Jack-Hays.htm

Ain’t saying it didn’t happen in some form, but 100 dead Indians at a time would rank as one of the major bloodlettings of the West, that including women and children let alone all fighting men in their prime

“Devil Yack” Hays was undoubtedly the real deal, but he didn’t file reports or write anything down. It has been suggested that he didn’t file reports because he lost so many men, one of his company in the early 1840’s gave the chances of surviving a year in service at around 50%.

Seems like such an unprecedented one-sided victory with so many survivors to tell the tale woulda been all over the press.

I dunno where accounts of the Paint Rock Battle first surfaced, IIRC Hays’ reputed Bandera Pass battle comes from a single account given decades after the fact.

I forget the name of the guy who wrote it (Calallen?) but a close associate of Hays who had relocated with him to California retired to his boyhood home in Kentucky and wrote a dime novel greatly embellishing Hays’ exploits (when I looked some years back only one copy survived, in the collection of a California library).

It is from that we probably get the tale of Hays joining a hunting party of Delaware Indians and running on foot for two days straight to catch up to and attack a mounted Comanche war party. I’d believe that of Delawares raised into the life but an off-the-cuff ultra-ultra marathon sounds a bit much for someone who weren’t.

It might be significant that the Texas State Historical Association makes no mention of a Battle of Paint Rock either in connection to Paint Rock itself or in their bio. of Jack Hays.

“Bad Hand” is also a pretty good book. The mental breakdown was blamed on a wagon accident that happened years earlier. He was an amazing tactician against the plains Indians.

Yep!

Yes, and overshadowed by people like Custer and Nelson Miles.

Agree 100%, Kaywoodie. My latest rabbit hole looks like The Life and Times of Bat Masterson. I knew of his reputation as a lawman and gambler, but didn't know he was a 21 year old kid fighting at the second battle of Adobe Walls. Billy Dixon had nothing but high praise for young Bat's fighting prowess.

Agreed Mike. I always thought the story of him running for two days straight with the Delaware’s story was a little far fetched.
Jack Hays was definitely a bad ass, but I would imagine he spent most of his time on the back of a good horse. Running for two hours, maybe. But for two days straight would probably kill even a hardened marathon runner. Much less a Ranger that spent most of his life in the saddle.