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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,263
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,263 |
RE: Noslers
I think the 200 and 220 30 caliber have the partition farther forward and the old 175 gr. 7mm semi spitzer did too, not sure about the current 175s. The LRAB if anything has the partition further back. One PH did not like Noslers, he claimed that the straight line penetration was not as good as some other bullets, but this may be based on a single bad experience with a giraffe rodeo.
"When you disarm the people, you commence to offend them and show that you distrust them either through cowardice or lack of confidence, and both of these opinions generate hatred." Niccolo Machiavelli
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Joined: Apr 2005
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,938 Likes: 1 |
The 320 Woodlieghs penetrate and expand very well from a 9.3X74
Nice, I have heard good things about the 320gr Woodleigh solids as well, they go deep and straight. The 320 grain Woodleigh solid is the best penetrator of all the Woodleigh round nose solids in any caliber according to penetration tests by Micheal McCurry
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,144 Likes: 11
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,144 Likes: 11 |
RE: Noslers
I think the 200 and 220 30 caliber have the partition farther forward and the old 175 gr. 7mm semi spitzer did too, not sure about the current 175s. The LRAB if anything has the partition further back. One PH did not like Noslers, he claimed that the straight line penetration was not as good as some other bullets, but this may be based on a single bad experience with a giraffe rodeo. No, the 200 and 220 .30 caliber Partitions do not have the partition moved forward. That said, they still penetrate great--and in my experience straight. One my own examples was a 6x6 elk I shot at 75 yards with a .300 Winchester Magnum and the 200. He stood quartering toward me, and the bullet landed where I aimed, in the big joint of the left shoulder--and exited toward the rear of the ribs on the right side. In a penetration test a few years ago Phil Shoemaker found the 220 Partition to penetrate deeper than any other .30 caliber bullet he tried--and he's tried a bunch. The LRAB does not HAVE a partition, nor does the standard AccuBond. Instead the rear end of the jacket is bonded to the core. The jacket is also much lighter than standard AccuBonds, and I suspect the core might be a little softer as well. The LRABs are designed to expand all the way down to 1300 fps, the reason less of the core is bonded. In my experience they retain about as much weight as Hunting Ballistic Tips at closer ranges, around 50% give or take a little--which is also about like Hornady Interlocks. in the standard AccuBonds enough of the core is to approximate the weight retention of Partitions of the same weight and caliber.Thus the heavier, larger AccuBonds are designed to retain a higher percentage of weight than the smaller ones. Of the few I've recovered of the larger AccuBonds, average weight retention has been in the 80-90% range, while smaller AccuBonds retain the typical 65-70% of smaller Partitions.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,247 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,247 Likes: 1 |
The 320 Woodlieghs penetrate and expand very well from a 9.3X74
Nice, I have heard good things about the 320gr Woodleigh solids as well, they go deep and straight. The 320 grain Woodleigh solid is the best penetrator of all the Woodleigh round nose solids in any caliber according to penetration tests by Micheal McCurry Good to hear, Thanks, I remember that AR thread, but haven't the i.t. talent to look through 4 or 500 pages of testing data.
Trump Won!
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Joined: Nov 2004
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 10,697 |
I've hunted more with the 9,3x62 than any other cartridge and have had excellent results with 250gr. TSX and 286gr. NP. I've never slayed a cape buff, but wouldn't hesitate using either bullet.
Personally, my rifle loves the 286gr. NP so I've settled on.
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 3,428
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 3,428 |
RE: Noslers
I think the 200 and 220 30 caliber have the partition farther forward and the old 175 gr. 7mm semi spitzer did too, not sure about the current 175s. The LRAB if anything has the partition further back. One PH did not like Noslers, he claimed that the straight line penetration was not as good as some other bullets, but this may be based on a single bad experience with a giraffe rodeo. No, the 200 and 220 .30 caliber Partitions do not have the partition moved forward. That said, they still penetrate great--and in my experience straight. One my own examples was a 6x6 elk I shot at 75 yards with a .300 Winchester Magnum and the 200. He stood quartering toward me, and the bullet landed where I aimed, in the big joint of the left shoulder--and exited toward the rear of the ribs on the right side. In a penetration test a few years ago Phil Shoemaker found the 220 Partition to penetrate deeper than any other .30 caliber bullet he tried--and he's tried a bunch. The LRAB does not HAVE a partition, nor does the standard AccuBond. Instead the rear end of the jacket is bonded to the core. The jacket is also much lighter than standard AccuBonds, and I suspect the core might be a little softer as well. The LRABs are designed to expand all the way down to 1300 fps, the reason less of the core is bonded. In my experience they retain about as much weight as Hunting Ballistic Tips at closer ranges, around 50% give or take a little--which is also about like Hornady Interlocks. in the standard AccuBonds enough of the core is to approximate the weight retention of Partitions of the same weight and caliber.Thus the heavier, larger AccuBonds are designed to retain a higher percentage of weight than the smaller ones. Of the few I've recovered of the larger AccuBonds, average weight retention has been in the 80-90% range, while smaller AccuBonds retain the typical 65-70% of smaller Partitions. MD - This is the first time I've seen anything written on any construction differences between the LRABs and the standard ABs, so I greatly appreciate the information. I do have some questions, if you wouldn't mind? Because of the lighter jacket and potentially softer core of the LRABs, what would be your opinion of using the 129gr. .264 LRAB in a 264 Win Mag for elk? Would you be more inclined to use the heavier 140gr LRAB or just simply default to the standard AB or even the Partition? I've been working up some handloads with the 129gr. LRAB, but have had these questions running through my head of if I would really trust this bullet on elk and your comments made me question them even more. Thanks in advance for your thoughts!
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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,144 Likes: 11 |
Unless you're planning to only shoot elk at longer ranges, I'd be more included to use the heavier LRAB (which which weighs 142 grains) or the standard 140 AccuBond in the .264. How far do you usually shoot?
I have used the 129 LRAB on deer, but so far from milder 6.5s than the .264, the biggest my 6.5 PRC. But I am just as likely to shoot deer relatively close as at longer ranges--the mule deer buck I killed a couple years ago with the PRC was only 159 yards away.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: May 2005
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Thanks for your response, MD. I don't usually shoot all that far. With this rifle and scope combo, I like to keep shots within 300 yards, although I may push it to 400 if all is perfect. However, like you, I'm just as likely to encounter them close as I am far. This year's bull was shot at just a bit over 200 yards, with 100 to 225 yards being about the norm. I actually have not shot an elk with the .264 WM and was just messing around with different bullets and loads and considering the possibilities. The 129's shoot really well, which is why I was considering that bullet, but as a guy that tends to lean toward using heavier bullets in all calibers, the 129 just seems too light to me, which is why I was questioning it. I believe I'll move towards the heavier bullets for an elk load, based on your information and response. Much appreciated.
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Joined: Oct 2008
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I have only used the 128s LRAB in the 6.5x55 for deer. No question that it is as good or better than cup and core 130s in the 270 Winchester but I would be inclined to go with the 142s as well for less than perfect angles. The 129s did fine at closer ranges not unlike a BT, at longer ranges it acts more like a partition.
Comments on the partition, had a brain lapse on the accubond and on the 175, 200, & 220 I was thinking of the old screw machine models as pictured in Bob Hagel's books. Not the newer ones.
"When you disarm the people, you commence to offend them and show that you distrust them either through cowardice or lack of confidence, and both of these opinions generate hatred." Niccolo Machiavelli
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,144 Likes: 11
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,144 Likes: 11 |
Given your range parameters, I'd probably choose a tougher bullet, regardless of weight. The weight of the 129 AccuBond Long range isn't a problem, but it's designed for long-range performance--which means beyond 400 yards.
Elk are big animals, and despite the obsession with tiny groups these days, at the ranges you shoot 1.5" 3-shot groups at 100 yards are more than sufficient for hitting them in the right place. I know a lot people recommend "whatever shoots best," but at your ranges bullet construction is more important than either pin-point accuracy or weight. As an example, the 127-grain Barnes LRX would work fine.
Among the many bullets I'd recommend would be 120-130 monometal bullets, or tougher bonded/partitioned bullets from 125-140 grains.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,144 Likes: 11
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,144 Likes: 11 |
I've hunted more with the 9,3x62 than any other cartridge and have had excellent results with 250gr. TSX and 286gr. NP. I've never slayed a cape buff, but wouldn't hesitate using either bullet.
Personally, my rifle loves the 286gr. NP so I've settled on. Close to 20 years ago, not long after Barnes and Nosler started making 9.3mm bullets, I attended a hunt/event at a Texas ranch, which included my friend Richard Mann's demonstration of a new kind of bullet-test media he'd developed, using wax which retained the shape of the bullet channel. Among other bullets, we planned to test some of the 250 and 286 Barnes X's, and the 286 Partitions. I bet Richard that the 286 Partition would penetrate somewhere between the 250 and 286 Xs, due to being a "partition forward" design. He looked doubtful, but wouldn't put money on it. But that's exactly what happened....
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Oct 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 23,369 Likes: 2 |
I've hunted more with the 9,3x62 than any other cartridge and have had excellent results with 250gr. TSX and 286gr. NP. I've never slayed a cape buff, but wouldn't hesitate using either bullet.
Personally, my rifle loves the 286gr. NP so I've settled on. You will never be disappointed!  What powder?
"The Democrat Party looks like Titanic survivors. Partying and celebrating one moment, and huddled in lifeboats freezing the next". Hatari 2017
"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid." Han Solo
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Whatever the Nosler Custom ammo shop used. Bought a couple boxes years ago and it shot lights out in my rifle, so bought several more boxes in the same lot for under 40 bucks a box. I'm set for life... 
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