Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game I had a Barnes TSX failure

I've shot and seen shot a pile of Alberta deer with the .243 85gr X/TSX and 80gr TTSX. I'd say that if the OP's bullet did indeed disintegrate, that would definitely be an anomaly. I've smashed bone and driven them stem-to-stern, recovering one 85gr X from the outside round roast after it had smashed the femur, on a frontal shot. The deer died post-haste and the bullet expanded nicely. This has been the norm over several dozen deer.

The TSX did not open consistently in my use on deer and pigs.

In stark contrast, the TTSX has been outstanding and is my favorite hunting bullet. Also, the TTSX is very accurate with 0.010” of jump in every rifle.

Any chance their is a perfectly expanded Barnes in a front shoulder roast?

Not so, at all. Is that an indirect threat? At this point jorgeI, you are on my ignore list. I won't reply to you after this post since you (and several others) resort to disguised threats and name calling and can't seem to contain your non-hunting views to the "Hunter's Campfire" section.

Jordan;
Good afternoon to you my friend, I hope all is going as well as can be for you and yours on the other side of the big hills.

One of the interesting things about these sorts of discussions is the differences seen doing what should be the same thing, but there are variables for sure in hunting.

While I've never personally shot anything with a .243" Barnes, a buddy loaded them for his son and they shot a few local mulie bucks with them with no surprises.

As I've mentioned, we've switched to monometals for hunting game about 15 years back and have always had good results, but I will say that after seeing the damage on a few different combinations of muzzle velocity and bullet RPM, I've left the church of speed, renounced my beliefs pretty much and have whole heartedly converted to the followers fast twist!

I'm sure you've found a similar site, but this makes for some interesting cyphering if one is so inclined - and as you know about me sir, I absolutely am that guy.

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2008/06/calculating-bullet-rpm-spin-rates-and-stability/

We've recovered a few monos over the years and all that we have are typically within a grain of original weight.



The little fellow on the left is a .257" 80gr TTSX from a .250AI with a Ron Smith gain twist barrel so that's a bit of an interesting one to attempt to figure out bullet RPM on, you know?

Before leaving that one however, I'll note it broke a rib on entrance, shredded the heart, broke another rib, shattered the ulna about an inch below the joint with the scapula and then wandered up under the hide midway up the scapula. It really rocked the mulie buck when it hit too might I add, which the .250AI doesn't always in our experience, or at least as much as say the 6.5x55 projectiles seemed to.

Anyways sir, as always there's lots of roads to Mecca or wherever the center for barrel twist cult is in my case.

All the best to you folks as we head into shorter, colder days and good luck on your remaining hunts.

Dwayne

It failed if it didn’t live up to performance claims by the mfg. otherwise it would fall under your expectations didn’t meet reality.

Why is that?

mathman;
Good afternoon to you sir, I hope the first Monday in November finds you well.

When I picked up the rifle it was an estate sale so I had to do a bit of digging on the barrel maker.

Despite my best efforts to nail down what the rate of twist actually is, I can only say it gets faster a wee bit.

My method for measuring is using a tight cleaning patch and marking the rod to see how far it went to make a rotation. While that worked on non gain twist barrels, this one sort of stumped me.

Hopefully that made some sense?

If you have a better way to measure I'm all ears for sure and certain however and thanks in advance.

All the best to you this fall.

Dwayne

I got it now, you don't know what the twist is at the end of the barrel.

mathman;
Thanks for the reply, I appreciate it.

Yes that's the case sir.

I thought I did when I first got it, but recall at the time - this is 15 odd years back so going on foggy memory here - that it seemed a bid odd, but I couldn't put my finger on it exactly.

Then read that this chap in Alberta specialized in gain twist barrels, which of course made me measure again and become even less sure of what I had.

I want to say going off of foggy memory that it starts at 1:11 but ends just a smidge faster?

Again that's without trying it again.

Thanks and all the best to you again this fall.

Dwayne

I’m just wondering if it was the rib fragments that tore up the lung and heart and the OP might have missed the bullet somewhere in the offal. A TSX or TTSX will rarely break up more than shearing petals but in my experience mono’s can occasionally be diverted elsewhere if hitting something hard and be found somewhere unexpected.

Back in the 90’s, I was experimenting with the Lost River Tech’s non-leaded version of what became Barnes’ X’s, then TSX’s. Out of a 340, one hit the point of a bull’s shoulder at 475 yards. He dropped instantly but then raised his head. I hit him again and one other time as it was getting dark and he was only fifty yards from the steep, north-facing side of a canyon.

Two were through and through but from entrance and exits appeared to not open at all. One, I’m not sure which shot, was found in a ham, somewhat bent but not expanded; it had taken an almost exact right angle after hitting the shoulder. Those bullets seemed too hard to me or just had a too-small hollow point which is also why I probably wouldn’t pick a small caliber TSX for a general big game bullet as to Jorgel’s point . The above 340’s were 210’s at 3200 at the muzzle.

I’ve even had a 375 TSX do something similar. But, mostly, large caliber TSX’s and almost all TTSX’s fail to fail.

I am big on 100g Hornady and 105g Hornady bthp....

I am a huge fan of the Barnes copper bullets. I use the in 25, 6.5 7mm,8mm and 30 cal. I’ve caught one 6.5 shot out of a 264 WM on a 150 lb bedded buck. I have had two instances where the bullets didn’t perform to perfection. Both ended in dead deer. Both were 100 gr ttsx 25 cal. One shot out of a 257 rob at 325 yards the other a 25-06 AI at 40 yards. Both gave pass through but no blood trails.

If you still have the rifle just measure the last ten inches at the muzzle or whatever it takes to make one full turn and that is the number for the RPM calculations. I bet it will be close to 1-10 or no faster than 1-9.

Reasonable approximation, but it will underestimate a bit.

The resulting rpm that is.

Dwayne,

All is well here, and I hope things are going equally well (if not better!) for you!

Fast twist is nearly never a mistake, for a few reasons, expansion on impact being one of them. When Barnes hit at light speed they can certainly cause some damage. My preference is high (but not hyper) velocity and fast twist. Works well!

I was wondering the same thing.

Yup, that is true. But it's better than nothing.

With several measurements along the length of the barrel, it would be possible to get a fairly close approximation by fitting an exponential curve to the measurements, but that's likely more effort than it's worth.

Do yourself a favor and get a 6.5CM. Skip the 25 Souper - it can't match +P loads in a 257 Roberts. If you must get a .25, get a -06. The 6.5CM has a much greater selection of factory ammo and rifles and recoil is not much greater than a .243.