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bore guns #15692647 01/23/21
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Anyone else interested in the grand old shoulder cannons? Heavy, innefficient, over sized, insane recoil, vision obscuring, whats not to love.I owned quite a few big game calibres eg 375, 416's 460's and a 585 but never got around to owning a Bore gun. I had John Shorb of October country almost lined up for one of his double 8 bore MZ in about 2000 but the aussie dollar running about 50c to the USD made it too expensive. Not sure if he is still out there these days. Then Alan Vaisham (green River rifle works, Australia) and I discussed a single 2 bore gun, but common sense re-asserted itself, just too big. He is well retired these days. Then another time I contacted Colin Stoltzer about making a double 4 bore MZ Colin for the record was doing everything including breechloading 2 bores at that point. So a long list of failing to pull the trigger on one smile

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Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15692662 01/23/21
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Alot of the Big Game Rifle guys shoot 12 bore usually based on a Greener single action and with a rifled barrel. They can get almost overlapping shots at 50 yards. A bit trickier to get them to shoot well at 100yds though.

Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15696675 01/23/21
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mauserand9mm, is that down at the club in victoria or is that shoot being run on other clubs these days? I never got to visit them but did wonderif any big bore guns were in use. A 12 bore greener with ball is in the spirit of the thing, thats nice shooting. Know if any new/old 4, 8 or 10 bores out there? I remember a fella in Tasmania could make all the big stuff too, Alex beer?

Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15696860 01/24/21
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There's various clubs of the Big Game Rifle Discipline around Australia. Not sure how many are in Australia but the Vic's have dominated the Nationals for some time - I think us QLDers beat them last time though. Í haven't shot in the club for a while but will be getting back into it this year. We have the top notch shooters here in Brisbane like Graeme Wright and Mark Hibbert - I'm not one of the top notch shooters though. I haven't seen any bore guns except for the 12 bores. Graeme would know who has what, and I believe that someone had an 8 bore double rifle at the Nationals in Darwin a few years back (I didn't go to that event).

Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15698500 01/24/21
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I’m pretty sure ‘fire regular Steve Zihn has built some bore rifles, if you don’t mind a front stuffer.
I always wanted a 16 or 20 bore.

IC-A

Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15699297 01/24/21
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Yes I have done several. 12 and 8 bore were the most popular but I did six 4 bores and I did one 2 bore which according to the research I have done along with 2 associates in England, it seems I was the first man in documented history to build a sporting rifle in 2 bore. I can't be certain of that as a fact, but if anyone else did one before me (not counting punt guns and wall guns) We have not found any documentation of it.
Here is a pic of the muzzle. It's very close to the size of a golf ball.
[Linked Image from live.staticflickr.com]2 Bore muzzle by .com/photos/156296479N08/]Steve Zihn, on [bleep]
A few others too.
[Linked Image from live.staticflickr.com]100_1422 by .com/photos/156296479N08/]Steve Zihn, on [bleep]
[Linked Image from live.staticflickr.com]100_1426 by .com/photos/156296479N08/]Steve Zihn, on [bleep]
I do have one 12 bore Rigby style left on the books that I will get done in about 3 years. The customer went through an ugly divorce and abandoned the project so it will be up for grabs. But I am not taking any new orders because of my age and the length of my back log. If you'd like a 12 bore, let me know, but I must be totally honest, it's not going to happen real soon. I am too old to be comfortable with super long back longs now, so I stopped taking on new work 4 years ago and I am all the way down to a 3 year back long now (I think)

Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15699304 01/24/21
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szihn Online Content
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This is a Rigby style so you get an idea of what I am talking about. This one was a 16 bore, not a 12, but the lines will be very close .

[Linked Image from live.staticflickr.com]IMG_20151228_081801 by .com/photos/156296479N08/]Steve Zihn, on [bleep]

Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15701436 01/24/21
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Steve lovely guns there, thanks for sharing them. Were you the fella who made the 2 bore for that kid on Accurate reloading? I cant remember his name but he used to post up random 2 bore stuff for a couple of years and we didnt quite take him seriously. Then one day he ends up with the gun! The pic of the bore of your gun looks familiar is all.

Id concur regarding the first 2 bore hunting gun done. I have never been able to find solid evidence of 19th century pieces( aside from punt guns). The two references were always Sir Samuel Bakers gun, which as it turned out was a heavy charged 4 bore. The only other reference was a short passage I read about a 'George Gibbs loading blasting black in his 2 bore'. It was a fragment on a now defunct website, cordite.com I think but whether it was real I am not sure- it could even been an excerpt from a fiction novel.

Can I ask whether you ever made double barrels? Always liked the idea of a double 8 bore MZ cape gun aka 1 barrel rifled, 1 smooth. I figured that gives plenty of clout, some ability to shoot at range and takes some of the hassle out of double rifle regulation. I dont fire the big stuff now anyway, just an admirer these days.

Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15701492 01/25/21
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There’s a 4 bore single shot being put together by a smith in Vic for a BGRC member. It’s built on a massive Farquarson style action that was made locally. Everything about it is massive.

Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15709690 01/26/21
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szihn Online Content
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158XTP The only 2 bore I made was for a man in Illinois who died a few years ago and the gun was auctioned off by Rock Island auctions.

https://www.proxibid.com/Firearms-M...ussion-Left-Hand/lotInformation/39026450

I don't know who owns it now. The man I made it for was named Ken Greenlee.

I have made several doubles. All I made were rifled, both barrels. The largest doubles I have made were 8 bores. A double 8 weighs about 12.5 to 14.5 pound's depending on barrel contour and the type of breach plugs used. As the barrels get larger the weight grows exponentially, so a larger double then an 8 is actually pretty impractical. It can be done. My old apprentice Colin Stolzer made a double 2 bore on a challenge and it weight about 42 pounds as I recall.
But 8s can be make in reasonable weights. Not "light" but it's possible to make a 8 bore double as light as 11 pounds but the barrel become very thin and keep the loads fairly "mild". For the true "elephant guns" it's best to go a bit heavier. Loaded with balls and about 250 to 275 grains of powder, such guns do kick even at 14 pounds.

Last edited by szihn; 01/26/21.
IC-B

Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15710143 01/27/21
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Steve, very nice 2 bore, yours is a lot nicer than the one I recall. I concur with what you are saying about 8 bores. I looked into them for a while and it seemed a double 8 is where practicality and big power meet before becoming too crazy. A true heavy 8 bore with the right size barrels as you say, ticks a lot of boxes. All that stomping power, macho size hole in the barrel, but still within limits of carry being 14lbs is no worse 577 nitro double territory. Would you have any photos of your 8 bore doubles by any chance? For the record can I ask what you charged for a basic one in the day?

Re: bore guns [Re: 158XTP] #15710937 01/27/21
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Well it's been a few years sine I made a double, but I have 2 set of barrels I made sitting back for my "retirement days" if I live that long. One is a fast twist 62 cal for the making of a "600 Black powder express". There was no such thing in the old days, but what it's going to be if I ever get it done is a double firing lead 900 grain bullets copied in size and length from the 600 Nitro Express, but cast instead of being jacketed. The other is indeed a double 8 bore. I have the breach made for one of them (the 8) and the plugs made but only 1/2 fitted on the 62 cal.

But I have them set at the far end of the line. At my age I feel the pressure to satisfy all my customers and get down to "zero guns" on the back log before I do anything for speculation.
The last double 8 I made was about 16 years ago. That gun had engraving on the locks, trigger guard, butt plate return and the sock was checkered made on a VERY nice piece of Bastogne walnut. That one sold for $7500.

Flintlock double got for a lot more because to make a large bore flinter you need recessed breaches and inset pans, so such guns have to be made with 2 mirror image locks and those locks have to be hand made. Cap-lock guns can be made with modified commercial locks. Still not fast or easy, but a lot les work then making the locks from bar stock.


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