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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
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Once you sell it, it’s gone. Catch 22. Yep, not selling any of my stash. Might do even trades for some things I could use more of, like LRP for LPP. I like to shoot. I’ve been a little more “methodical” in my shooting, just not as much of the goofy stuff. One good thing has been trading stuff I don’t need for things I do. And vice versa for fella on the other end.
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Campfire Sage
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Joined: Jun 2002
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This was posted by a local gun shop. FWIW Last time I was in that shop he had the 9mm priced at $17.99/box one box limit and this was probably 3 weeks ago. ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/8qSfiaS.jpg) That's just based on economic ignorance. The dealers have to price things with replacement cost in mind, regardless of what they paid for their current inventory.
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 599
Campfire Regular
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I'm involved in a small business making 9mm and 5.56. We run a half dozen Camdex machines and average a few million rounds per month. Availability of components right now is tough and it's not what you know but who you know in order to keep a supply in the pipeline. The only way we've managed is we've prebought our primers for a year in advance with OEM suppliers who we have relationships with and are willing to hook us up with preferential service.
I can assure you that our retail prices follow our costs and there's no looney conspiracy to gouge among small businesses like us. The only gouging I've seen is where average Joes who invested in lots of ammo over the last few years are now selling and making a profit on their speculation. The prices I've seen on retailers shelves accurately reflect their costs as near as I can tell and in some cases I'm amazed that they are not asking for more money. I believe what you say to be the truth but when I go into a LGS - Texas Gun Experience in Grapevine TX - and see Hornady Whitetail Hunter 30/30 @ $79.99 per 20 it sure is hard to buy into the "only passing on our cost" theory. I support capitalism etc. and get it 100% I have the choice to buy but I'm not an idiot (arguably anyway) about what is happening. I do sincerely wish you the best - business should be good for a long time.
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Joined: Jun 2002
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
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good thing has been trading stuff I don’t need for things I do. And vice versa for fella on the other end.
Yep. Just last week I traded a pound of Unique for a pound of Goex FFFg with my next door neighbor. He reloads, and I shoot cap and ball revolvers, so it worked out perfectly. PS Some of that Unique will be used by him to load me up some .44-40, .45 Colt, and .45 Auto Rim, with once fired brass and large pistol primers that I provided for him.
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This was posted by a local gun shop. FWIW Last time I was in that shop he had the 9mm priced at $17.99/box one box limit and this was probably 3 weeks ago. That's just based on economic ignorance. The dealers have to price things with replacement cost in mind, regardless of what they paid for their current inventory. Either way, he seems to be getting a pretty good shipment to his gun shop weekly.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2012
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My LGS is currently selling Primers for $200-250 per brick. Their reasoning is that they are having a tough time getting them and people are paying $300 + on GB, so they are preventing scalpers from profiting so much. My Local Sportsman’s Warehouse rarely has primers, but I recently bought a brick of Federal LR match primers recently for $28. To the LGS credit, at that price their supply they do get lasts days instead of minutes, increasing availability over time. Downside is those that got caught short pay for lack of foresight. I don’t judge than for doing it, it’s current market conditions. Regarding ammo, I’m sure the story is similar at retail venues. Another LGS requires purchase of 200 bullets with the purchase of a pound of powder. His prices have gone up a bit but are reasonable. Turns out he invested heavily in bullets , powder and primers, but only the powder and primers sold.
Old70 Mee Maw and Pee Paw’s Pawn and Gun saving us from ourselves, stewards of the community LOL
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Joined: May 2002
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2002
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Mom and pop shops around here say they are still making the same profit margin they were before and it's the shipping that has gone up for them. Who here owns a shop?
Holding onto anger is like drinking poison and expecting the other the person to die ......
"When I stand before God at the end of my life, I would hope that I would not have a single bit of talent left, and could say, "I used everything you gave me."
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Joined: Nov 2009
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,282 |
This was posted by a local gun shop. FWIW Last time I was in that shop he had the 9mm priced at $17.99/box one box limit and this was probably 3 weeks ago. That's just based on economic ignorance. The dealers have to price things with replacement cost in mind, regardless of what they paid for their current inventory. Bullchit, they know more is coming and this will sell almost as quick as it would if it were $20/box so they figure why the hell not mark it up and make $20+ per box. I hope they go out of business for their shenannigans. Got to keep the lights on, pay rent, hourly wages....no you're just as bad as the scalper at the Flea Market, except you didn'y pay as much as he did for it and are making more profit. That's the great thing about capitalism, he has the right to charge what he wants as much as I have the right not to pay his stupid prices. I just get tired of the poor mouthing by dealers who are raping their loyal customers.
Last edited by UNCCGrad; 02/12/21.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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I know this has been discussed before but from someone who actually has to purchase from suppliers, has your price for loaded ammo really gone up 2.5-3X? That appears to be what is reflected locally and online. Big retailers seem to be holding prices and I can't imagine them losing money intentionally. I don't know enough about the ordering to have a valid opinion but it does appear some online vendors and local shops are gouging to take advantage of the situation we are in. Maybe it's the best way to slow down demand while supply catches back up?
Luckily I reload, but still wish I had several thousand more primers on hand. I'm likely stocked up for over a year at the rate I shoot for small rifle and pistol, longer than that for large rifle. I would like to get back to $0.30/rd ammo on .223 so I can just buy it instead of having to load to shoot. Maybe you could name some of these "Big Retailers" that have kept their prices down so some of your fellow shooters can get some reasonably priced ammo, I am seeing either rising prices or empty shelves, usually both. Kaiser Norton Academy, Cabelas, Scheels, Rogers Sporting Goods Walmart still has fridge packs of 100 game load 12 gauge for $21.94 But we all know the virtue signaling Caribou Bob’s still suck their local LGS cock and “rootin tootin I wont step foot in a walmarts couldnt pay me to go in there, might snag my bolo tie on somethin made in chiner and get choked”
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I need some of those game packs. 20 gauge would be great. Our walmart has zip zero.
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Joined: Oct 2011
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Joined: Oct 2011
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Back in the Clinton days I was into IPSC matches and Steel plate handgun matches.
Primers started drying up.
I swore I was never gonna get caught flat footed again and I haven't since.
As a result by today's prices I could make a ton of $ but I won't do it.
Fella I work with needed SRPs to load 300 BO, I sold him a brick for $39.95
I have enough components and loaded ammo to keep shooting on a regular basis for several years.
My LGS has nothing in stock.
No ammo other than a few boxes of 8x57, 450 Bushmaster, one box of 250 Savage and some 17Mach2 all at normal prices.
Powder shelves are completely empty and the only bullets they have are .338 ELDMs
Your mind is your primary weapon. Never let it get rusty.
Endowment Member NRA
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Joined: Mar 2007
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Campfire Tracker
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[/quote]
One good thing has been trading stuff I don’t need for things I do. And vice versa for fella on the other end.
[/quote]
I have been doing the same. My reloading room had the inventory of a small gun shop, for many calibers I no longer have and stuff I will never use at my age. I have been horse trading for components that I actually use and I have sold the rest of it here at whatever midway has stuff listed at. Nice to reduce some of the clutter. Glad I saw this coming and had everything I needed before it started, it has been interesting to watch. Unfortunately I think it is going to get even crazier the the Dems get around to talking about gun legislation, you know it's coming.
Last edited by jdunham; 02/12/21.
NRA Life Member
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Joined: Jul 2018
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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The real question is will it return to "normal" or is this the new normal?
I'm sufficiently stocked up. But I'm hesitant to use any of it-because replacing it may cost me a fortune.
I have enough to hunt and stay practiced enough to hunt. But can't just go shoot recreationally like before.
-Jake I'm pretty confident we'll never get back to even close to the normal we knew several years ago. In our business we are trying to forecast our component needs out for at least a year so we can assure we are still in business. That represents around 50 million rounds of ammo for our little operation. It's a big risk for us because availability is fickle, plus the stroke of a politicians pen could put us out of business in this current political climate. The OEM component sources are gambling also. You can bet it's seriously discussed at every staff meeting if it will pay off to expand manufacturing facilities or not. The most obvious safe path is to run current equipment around the clock and do the best you can with what you have. The changing from the Trump administration to the Biden fiasco has put the fear of God into ammo manufacturers for facility expansion and who can blame them? Every day we agonize over questions of expanding our business and if we will even be able to stay in business due to politics. Because of this we have increased our profit margins a little bit to cushion us from the increased risk we have now days. This contributes a bit to increased ammo price points among our peers, but I wouldn't call it gouging. It might be a good time to go into business making innovative dry fire equipment. Thanks for taking the time to post. I can understand some inflation to cushion yourself in this climate, any smart businessman would do the same. I was mainly interested in the price discrepancy between large retailers and some of the LGS. A couple of the LGS seem to be content with selling whatever comes in at a reasonable rate, say 25% markup. Others are running on 200-300% markup. Those will be the ones I look at last when and if times get better The LGS has a much smaller target audience than the big retailers with online presence. Online, they can probably get whatever price they want if they wait long enough. LGS has a targeted client base in the community. They too could sell for more online, but if they did, who would ever visit their shop?
Progressives are the most open minded, tolerant, and inclusive people on the planet, as long as you agree with everything they say, and do exactly as you're told.
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one thing that is going on, that is driving prices upward, is folks are selling their 'stash't to local gun shops. I have personally seen it happen. In one case, 9mm was sold to the store for .75 a round. The store will sell it for over a dollar a round. I saw a gun shop bidding and buying bulk ammo the other day. He was scarfing bulk ammo up. I have no doubt he'll break open the cases and sell 20 round boxes much higher. Really don't have a big problem with that, mostly because if he didn't have a market, he wouldn't be doing it. You can't really impress on people that they need to stock up when prices are low, and ammo is flowing like a river... You can say it over and over, and people just don't listen. History doesn't teach those type anything. Those types that DON'T stock up are the same ones squealing like a pig under a gate when they are out or low on ammo.  We have a local gun store that sends employees to stand in line and wait for the Academy store to open in the morning. They proceed to purchase their limit of the available ammo. They then repackage the acquired ammo into smaller packages with their name on the outside to sell at their store. I guess people are paying the upcharge to not have to stand in line.
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Campfire Tracker
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I’ve noticed that one of my LGS has raised prices on certain ammo about 30%, others about 10-15%. I am starting to see reloading supplies increase as well, but not at the same rate overall, in stores that is. Now, I do see Bass Pro not being clear on their pricing. Twice I’ve gone to buy some bullets they had on the shelf for one price and then at the cash register, the price is totally different. I’ve also seen Sportsman’s Warehouse do the same thing. I’ve told them to keep it when I catch it. I’ve argued before with both places, only to be given an excuse and that they would not honor the price on the rack. While I may not pay their inflated prices, they know someone else will.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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223 Rem, my favorite cartridge - you can't argue with truckloads of dead PD's and gophers.
24hourcampfire.com - The site where there is a problem for every solution.
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I know this has been discussed before but from someone who actually has to purchase from suppliers, has your price for loaded ammo really gone up 2.5-3X? That appears to be what is reflected locally and online. Big retailers seem to be holding prices and I can't imagine them losing money intentionally. I don't know enough about the ordering to have a valid opinion but it does appear some online vendors and local shops are gouging to take advantage of the situation we are in. Maybe it's the best way to slow down demand while supply catches back up?
Luckily I reload, but still wish I had several thousand more primers on hand. I'm likely stocked up for over a year at the rate I shoot for small rifle and pistol, longer than that for large rifle. I would like to get back to $0.30/rd ammo on .223 so I can just buy it instead of having to load to shoot. Maybe you could name some of these "Big Retailers" that have kept their prices down so some of your fellow shooters can get some reasonably priced ammo, I am seeing either rising prices or empty shelves, usually both. Kaiser Norton Academy, Cabelas, Scheels, Rogers Sporting Goods I've bought some ammo and bullets on sale at Cabelas and Scheels, just in the last couple of weeks. And nothing specialized... 44 mag ammo, 175 grain SMKs, etc
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The real question is will it return to "normal" or is this the new normal?
I'm sufficiently stocked up. But I'm hesitant to use any of it-because replacing it may cost me a fortune.
I have enough to hunt and stay practiced enough to hunt. But can't just go shoot recreationally like before.
-Jake I'm pretty confident we'll never get back to even close to the normal we knew several years ago. In our business we are trying to forecast our component needs out for at least a year so we can assure we are still in business. That represents around 50 million rounds of ammo for our little operation. It's a big risk for us because availability is fickle, plus the stroke of a politicians pen could put us out of business in this current political climate. The OEM component sources are gambling also. You can bet it's seriously discussed at every staff meeting if it will pay off to expand manufacturing facilities or not. The most obvious safe path is to run current equipment around the clock and do the best you can with what you have. The changing from the Trump administration to the Biden fiasco has put the fear of God into ammo manufacturers for facility expansion and who can blame them? Every day we agonize over questions of expanding our business and if we will even be able to stay in business due to politics. Because of this we have increased our profit margins a little bit to cushion us from the increased risk we have now days. This contributes a bit to increased ammo price points among our peers, but I wouldn't call it gouging. It might be a good time to go into business making innovative dry fire equipment. Is capital available should you want to expand capacity or has that dried up? I could see where getting money right now to build up could be problematic.
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Joined: Sep 2009
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The real question is will it return to "normal" or is this the new normal?
I'm sufficiently stocked up. But I'm hesitant to use any of it-because replacing it may cost me a fortune.
I have enough to hunt and stay practiced enough to hunt. But can't just go shoot recreationally like before.
-Jake I'm pretty confident we'll never get back to even close to the normal we knew several years ago. In our business we are trying to forecast our component needs out for at least a year so we can assure we are still in business. That represents around 50 million rounds of ammo for our little operation. It's a big risk for us because availability is fickle, plus the stroke of a politicians pen could put us out of business in this current political climate. The OEM component sources are gambling also. You can bet it's seriously discussed at every staff meeting if it will pay off to expand manufacturing facilities or not. The most obvious safe path is to run current equipment around the clock and do the best you can with what you have. The changing from the Trump administration to the Biden fiasco has put the fear of God into ammo manufacturers for facility expansion and who can blame them? Every day we agonize over questions of expanding our business and if we will even be able to stay in business due to politics. Because of this we have increased our profit margins a little bit to cushion us from the increased risk we have now days. This contributes a bit to increased ammo price points among our peers, but I wouldn't call it gouging. It might be a good time to go into business making innovative dry fire equipment. Is capital available should you want to expand capacity or has that dried up? I could see where getting money right now to build up could be problematic. I don't perceive capital being as big an issue to expansion as unstable politics which could drastically affect importation of powder and primers. American shooters have been huge beneficiaries of the privatization of former Soviet Bloc factories which allowed them to feed our appetite. All Biden has to do is stop that flow and we are screwed for years. At that point why would American companies go through all the expense and trouble to create infrastructure to fill the void when you might get politics that would shut you down?
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Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,857
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,857 |
The real question is will it return to "normal" or is this the new normal?
I'm sufficiently stocked up. But I'm hesitant to use any of it-because replacing it may cost me a fortune.
I have enough to hunt and stay practiced enough to hunt. But can't just go shoot recreationally like before.
-Jake I'm pretty confident we'll never get back to even close to the normal we knew several years ago. In our business we are trying to forecast our component needs out for at least a year so we can assure we are still in business. That represents around 50 million rounds of ammo for our little operation. It's a big risk for us because availability is fickle, plus the stroke of a politicians pen could put us out of business in this current political climate. The OEM component sources are gambling also. You can bet it's seriously discussed at every staff meeting if it will pay off to expand manufacturing facilities or not. The most obvious safe path is to run current equipment around the clock and do the best you can with what you have. The changing from the Trump administration to the Biden fiasco has put the fear of God into ammo manufacturers for facility expansion and who can blame them? Every day we agonize over questions of expanding our business and if we will even be able to stay in business due to politics. Because of this we have increased our profit margins a little bit to cushion us from the increased risk we have now days. This contributes a bit to increased ammo price points among our peers, but I wouldn't call it gouging. It might be a good time to go into business making innovative dry fire equipment. Is capital available should you want to expand capacity or has that dried up? I could see where getting money right now to build up could be problematic. I don't perceive capital being as big an issue to expansion as unstable politics which could drastically affect importation of powder and primers. American shooters have been huge beneficiaries of the privatization of former Soviet Bloc factories which allowed them to feed our appetite. All Biden has to do is stop that flow and we are screwed for years. At that point why would American companies go through all the expense and trouble to create infrastructure to fill the void when you might get politics that would shut you down? Oh, I get it. I figured the finance guys did too and might be holding on capital until they see how it plays out. The overseas primer manufacturing is interesting... I didn't know about them.
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