Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only The great 458 Winchester. Everyone should own one at least once

I found a bunch of H4198... stand by once I get back. I’ll be getting it ready!

Yet Richard Harland and Ron Thomson relied on the .458 Winchester Magnum throughout the 1960's and forward, each culling many thousands of elephant in their conservation work with parks departments.
Finn Aagaard said that even if the .458 WM factory loads was doing ony 2000 fps with 500-grainer, it still made a "bloody big hole" through anything.
The creation of the SAAMI .458 Lott was a commercial hit job. Much propaganda and gaslighting involved there, just like with the DALDs.

Great !
I have neglected the Hornady 250-gr Monoflex.
Might take faster powder than H4198, but that is a great place to start.

At gunner500's comment on correcting 5-yard chrono velocity to MV:
It occurs to me that a table or graph might be handy.
BC vs MV.
Higher BC less loss.
Higher MV more loss over that first 5 yards ...

I will keep you all posted with my results. I’m thinking that big 458 should make them scoot pretty decent.

Rock and rolla with the ayatollah!

Tested some cowboy loads in a Ruger Vaquero yesterday, at 25 yards.
It was time to start twisting on the windage adjustment of the MAGPUL MBUS PRO that had been filed into a notch rear sight.

NEAR arrived for another .458 WM+ project:

Rotometals delivered 5 days after the internet order. Free shipping and 4% discount starts with 9 bars.
Delivered by USPS to my door when I was home, postman said "It is tiny but it is heavy."
Indeed a tiny little cardboard box with 45 pounds in it:



787 bullets of 400 grains.
656 bullets of 480 grains.
525 bullets if they each weighs 600 grains, etc.

Good shooting Sir Ron, holy hell on the NEAR mount too, i need to buy one, nice box of alloy straight 20/1 will about work for anything, gonna make a short Ode to Saint Bagwell video this weekend and send to your e-mail.

Holy cow ! Will look forward to that.

LOL, i used 20 to 1 alloy with the little 45-70 and four 30 thou wad stack with nothing but Rooster jacket lube on the paper to duplicate the 461 Gibbs Selous/Seyfried rifle load, that big skinner at 20 to 1 would shoot through anything, what a fun test that was, and "Buy a Donkey" to you Sir Ron for issuing the challenge.

I remember the .45-70 turned into .461 Gibbs No. 2 equivalent. Will post it up again after first getting the General Hatcher load table for the .458 WinMag in 1956.
The SAAMI .458 WinMag always could do what was claimed for it by Winchester:



Highlighted load:

Why is gunner500's 570-grainer at just under 1300 fps such a great penetrator ?



At 1250 fps, penetration of game is about 50" for the test bullet above.
Double the velocity to 2500 fps and penetration is improved little, to about 56".
Tissue resistance is greater at higher velocity, exponentially so, even for an FN solid.
A soft might penetrate even less at higher velocity, because the greater frontal area from expansion of bullet really puts the brakes on,
if the bullet does not disintegrate at a shallow depth of penetration, though wound cavity may get interesting if it does ...

Sir Jerry has been a great inspiration for duplicating his .45-70/.461 Gibbs No. 2 load with a .458 WM, with BP and smokeless ...

I now know the WBY ammo boxes are for a .338/378 WBY for 1125-yard gonging:





















Great copper penny front sight, shades of Saint Bagwell.

A faint lube star is seen on the muzzle (even out of focus) and that could only have come from the Rooster Jacket lube on the paper jacket,
IIRC, Sir Jerry opined ...

Sir Jerry might comment on the range of the paper target above and the gong and paper target below ...





I also hope he will comment on the diameter of the slick before and after it is patched for the BPCR.
And is that a Shiloh Sharps with 0.458" groove diameter and 1:18" twist ?

Riflecrank

Canuckistan here

thank you for donkey on NEAR

small return of my part for all you bring to us with your threads

Gunner’s donkey has been known to eat targets. He has to follow that animal around until said targets reappear.

Not sure how he reconstitutes them.

Probably lets the donkey reconfigure the ones he doesn’t want shown.

Hmm...

Ha!

DF

Good stuff Sir Ron, i'll try to remember:

1 560-570gr bullets drying their patches in the pan, 16 or 20/1 alloy.
2 Patched bullets diped and dried in RJL and ready to shoot, Rooster Jacket lube wont stick to wax paper.
3 Ready to chrono the little Shiloh 45-70, i leaned hard on it with OE 2FG.
4 560 to 570gr bullets at 1269 fps from a 45-70 is a hell of a load.
5 Five loaded at 1269 for range and fouling test.
6 Box with black bull about to be set at 200 yards.
7 Five rounds at 200 yards with ladder barrel sight, only used front rest, no rear bag..
8 Lube star indeed present, unbelievable how clean it shot, no wiping or blow tubing.
9 That's a 6 shot group on the 700 yard gong, cant remember if i did that with my 45 3-1/4 or 50-90.
10 That is the 15lb 50-90 after firing a 200 yard group with target sights and 720 gr paper patch bullet.

The big Selous/Seyfried bullet comes from a KAL adjustable mould, had machine shop Bud turn the button off the seater stem, dont need a hollow base, that\s wasted space for lead, looking for max weight, also had him remove 30-40 thou of height from the stem, again, longer heavier bullet.

That mould throws a beautiful slick at .440 dia, wet patches up to .448" with 9lb onion skin paper, little Shiloh is an 18 twist standard weight 30 inch barrel, a ten pounder you can carry all week.

LOL DF, ole Stub eats paper like a dang goat, but yes, on targets, i report the good with the bad, provided they're not in the donkey composting program.

BTW, bullets being measured above at 1.505" are 50 cal 720 grainers, all the jumbling is completely my fault for not learning how to post pics.